Stats Revamp 1.3: Gadgets

Discussion in 'Stats Revamp Archive' started by Shin-O-B, Jan 27, 2017.

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  1. Beta Cell New Player

    The stealth crit buff needs to come back. If you don't want people nuking with bunker buster from long range in stealth then make it so the crit bonus is only be active when you are within mid-range of your target.

    Mines need to have their recharge lowered. I tried to time it and it seems to be 5-6 seconds between laying one mine and the next. That's like 15-17 seconds just to lay 3 mines. That's to slow and and boring before combat (especially in a team setting) and too slow to be effective once combat starts. I think you need to be able to lay 3ish mines in around 5-6 seconds.

    My suggestions:
    A. Mines have their cool-down/animation time adjusted so that you can get 3 out in 5-6 seconds.
    B. The total number of mines that can be out at a given time be caped around 5ish.
    C. Give mines a bit of utility in controller role. Implosion mines give a small energy bonus to you and the team when they detonate and damage a mob. Thermite mines should give some supercharge to you (and maybe the team?) when they detonate. This might make mine users more attractive in team content.
  2. BumblingB 15000 Post Club

    Or prevent it from being able to be slotted on your stealth loadout.
  3. TheDark Devoted Player

    • Like x 1
  4. BumblingB 15000 Post Club

    I am not saying I want that, but stealth no longer has the crit increase and it is probably due to super charge increases they are doing.

    So what that guy is asking for is to have it back without the range.
  5. TheDark Devoted Player

    I read the full context. Your suggestion alone is what I'm protesting. It is my feedback/response.
  6. Maxwill Committed Player

    Cryo foam was great as damage over time so please bring it's damage over time back, we already have more than enough burst damage powers.We don't have enough dots .With cryo foam as dot we would.
  7. Crimson Mayhem Loyal Player

    I have nothing against going back to Cryo as dot, however what everyone is forgetting is that Napalm isn't a burst anymore and burning is a full damage dot now. So out of the four key powers that build the heart of PI chaining (Gauss, Fear Gas, Napalm, Cryo Foam) only Gauss would be a burst if Foam was reverted to a dot. I'm all for making things more like they used to be but I want to have a choice between dots and burst either way.
    That said, if Fear Gas could be changed to have the PI burst tick at the start instead of the end, that would be great. Then Cryo Foam could be reverted to a dot and Fear Gas could be used as a JC burst like we always did to some extend. I mean, Fear Gas needs a change either way but that's how I could imagine turning Foam into a dot again without making Gadgets a full dot powerset.
    • Like x 1
  8. Trexlight Loyal Player

    Fear Gas, Napalm Grenade, Cryo-Foam, Guass Grenade, Photon Blast, EMP Pulse

    Spec: (using 166 Skill Points)
    20% Critical Attack Chance (w/ 20 Skill Points in innate)
    80% Critical Attack Damage (w/ 20 Skill Points in innate)
    17735 Health
    19428 Power (w/ 62 Skill Points in innate)
    7932 Might (w/ 32 Skill Points in innate)

    So i finally gave Gadgets a try and big thanks to Penryn on his Break down of the PIs for the power. Stream chat wanted me to split the the Stats again like i did with my Sorcery Testing.

    The idea behind the loadout was that i wanted to try the PI rotation having them stack each time with:

    Fear Gas giving Dazed PI > Napalm giving the Burning PI while doing extra damage from the Dazed > Cryo-Foam giving the Frostbite PI while doing extra damage from the Burning > Guass Grenade giving the Electrify Pi while doing extra damage from the Frostbite > EMP Pulse to do extra damage from the Electrify PI and Photon Blast being the execute and doing extra damage from Burning or Frostbitten enemies

    No loadout took some time to get use to and i liked it in theory and bringing Artemis down to half health was awesome but I feel that was more from the Backup Trinket.

    Thanks to BB for dropping by the stream and give some advice too. Jump canceling Fear Gas seems to be a no no and did it just out of habit but no jump canceling Im ok with it. makes it clunky for sure but thats channeled abilities for ya. I didnt switch out in the video but decided to use Neural Neutralizer instead of Fear Gas for the Daze PI (Why is that even a thing?) and also provide a Shield for myself for some survivability.

    Overall it was interesting to play. With Stealth having the extra crit gone I decided not to use it but Im certainly going to try it again once I get use to a loadout I enjoy to add in a different flare. Power costs wasnt much of an issue but I will say my loadout does need more refining since its basically all Medium Power Cost abilities and 2 High Power Costs. P. Dart being a low cast and spammable was enticing and make try to fit that it somewhere or just put more points into Power and find that sweet spot that will allow for such a loadout.
  9. Karasawa Loyal Player

    This might just be me, but I'm actually starting to like the big burst at the end of Fear Gas if you let it channel all the way on the proper PI. It's kind of satisfying. I do miss the mobility of being able to jump cancel Fear Gas and hop around though. Could Fear Gas perhaps be made a mobile channeled ability like Arctic Gust? I would have no complaints about it then.
  10. Maxwill Committed Player

    Yeah Fear Gass should do the DOT even if we clip it !
  11. TheDark Devoted Player

    You're probably the second person, other than myself, to actually notice the burst hit at the end. It's meant to be a reward for continuing and finishing the channel. I would suggest the burst tick doing slightly more damage but that's about it. The additional damage it deals from getting a PI buff then that activating the burst hit makes it interesting to use as is. It just comes down to damage it will do over 2 seconds compared to 1 or 2 other powers depending on power costs.

    Just a note for complaints on Fear Gas. It never gave you full damage even when you jump canceled it on Live. It gives you reduced damage if you jump cancel it on Live Server. What they did was they allowed Power Interactions to buff the actual DoT tick (which is does not do on Live. Infact no DOT tick is buffed by PIs on Live for Gadgets. Only burst attacks are.) and then added a burst damage component to finish off. It's like an ability you use if you want straight PFT (play from tray) and needed DoT & burst in one attack. Or if you went into a hybrid and needed time off from casting powers to inflict an attack while power heals were coming in.
    • Like x 1
  12. TheDark Devoted Player

    I had a few minutes tonight to test the effect of the Debuffs at far range. I reported on Saturday that the debuff appears on targets even if you use a midrange or melee power. However, I needed to be sure that the effects of the Debuff registered on an enemy, and that it wasn't just a cosmetic "check engine light" underneath the NPCs nametag.

    When I ran Desecrated Cathedral alert, I tried the debuff on the first 2 bosses. But James is the boss of interest. With him on one side with the tank and my toon on the complete opposite side using Vortex Cannon, the damage debuff reduced his damage. It also completely removed his damage buff which is identified by the black and yellowish aura around his hands.

    So as far as feedback and confusion on players not wanting melee or midrange power as debuff choices, the fact is it doesn't matter. Game Update 50 and this test show the debuff effects will apply at max far range.

    Personally, I like EMP's animation. I'm not a fan of Stasis Field's encasement though. Maybe power should be redone like Mental's TK Prison. Maybe add something Batman like. Like the Batarang animation with electric shocking animation but applies a stun. ( call it Darkshock :D)

    I read there's suppose to another build coming out this weekend. I do suggest Decoy's duration is extended to take advantage of the final taunt before it disappears (add like 2 to 3 seconds more for a 15 to 16 second spawn). Power heals from the instant power heal are also too minimal.
  13. BumblingB 15000 Post Club

    Fear Gas always did more if you channeled it fully. But with the fast pace gameplay everyone did and the dot that was at the beginning with the burning pi as well it was better to jump cancel it. Spord later made that concept part of the pi method of the am. You actually had to jump cancel it to get the pi setup.

    I actually would like to see it mobile now if they don't want to restore it to how it was. Planting you down in a channel or cast just make you feel restricted. All power sets should have this treatment.
    • Like x 1
  14. TheDark Devoted Player

    He also made it so you didn't have to jump cancel it anymore to get the PI set up because they opened up the window. That version is on Live. You have the option to jump cancel it for reduced damage or channel entirely for full damage. Either one gets you the AM tag.

    On test it's all or nothing. If they wanted to they could do reduced damage either by eliminating the burst attack at the end if jump canceled, and/or reduce the number of DoT ticks by half. It currently deals 10 DoT ticks total with no PI active, and 7 DoT ticks with a PI that not include the burst hit.
  15. Shin-O-B Developer

    Gadgets was low on spammer options, so this power was converted to one.
  16. Shin-O-B Developer

    Gauss Grenade and Cryo-Foam are pretty robust abilities with a lot of Power Interaction options. If they could apply and exploit P.I.s AND debuff, they would be too good and maybe considered mandatory. We try to make each power compelling in some way.
    • Like x 1
  17. Karasawa Loyal Player

    I was playing around with Gadgets last night and I have to say I'm actually loving it a lot more than the last version. Aside from the obvious bugs in abilities applying the wrong PI, I reallllly like how the PIs create different rotations and lead into each other.

    I even like trying to time the delayed burst damage on Sticky Bomb with another burst ability right after or with a fully channeled Fear Gas for big damage all at once. It was weird having Cryofoam as a burst instead of a dot at first but it makes sense considering Napalm is now a dot, and I like using Cryofoam right after Sticky Bomb for that well-timed burst.

    I'm not too sure if those mines are ever going to be meta, but they do hit really hard and would synergize well with Cryo-Field if the cast times were shorter.

    The only negative feedback I can think at the moment is I don't like any of the low cost abilities. I believe I only saw Paralyzing Dart and Taser Pull as costing 100 power and they're both a little too similar.

    Edit - also, being able to move while channeling Fear Gas would make Gadgets nearly perfect in my eyes. I think I'm just too used to associating Fear Gas with moving around from years and years of jump canceling it and hopping around after.
  18. BumblingB 15000 Post Club

    I see, so since there is more damage on the controller side now, you don't want too much done by one or two powers. That makes sense, but placing the debufs on like EMP kind of hurts it in the way of power cost.

    Also, can you replace the encasements?
  19. BumblingB 15000 Post Club

    Is it possible to give it a PBAOE around the target like Cryokinesis?
  20. Shin-O-B Developer

    Try Taser Pull (Elec apply) --> Fear Gas (Daze apply, Elec exploit) --> Vortex Cannon (Daze exploit) --> P. Dart (Daze exploit) X number of times until Daze times out. This rotation is Low, Med, High, Low~ and should allow you to maintain Power. This also leaves you two slots to fill with whatever you want!

    So you can't jump cancel it, because it is a channel. However, we are considering reducing the channel time.

    I'm not, but they are both channels that cannot be jump canceled, unfortunately.

    Haha! You're welcome!

    Cryo-Foam's damage output is calculated the same way the output of all other abilities are calculated.

    The multitarget aspect of this power may make a comeback, but the output would be have to be reduced to account for that.

    If it were a DOT, it would be Fear Gas by another name.

    Where would you be interested in seeing the Debuffs allocated? They are currently allocated in a way to spread around the secondary function of powers so that there isn't one power that does everything.

    This makes me sad as well :( But a guaranteed critical on Bunker Buster and some other powers kind of wreck the balance of things.

    You can always get in close! Stay alert and stay moving :)

    EMP is high cost and Cryo-Foam is medium cost. If they are your bread and butter, you are probably going to run out of Power.
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