Source Wall Raid Ain't That Difficult...or is it?

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by Essential Exobyte, May 22, 2022.

  1. Proxystar #Perception

    Well yea that's why I wondered what your thoughts were, because I don't think normal has been that way since Nexus/Dox or prior to that.

    It's an interesting thing to think about, I think if anything normal probably got watered down as a result of the rifts created by the Origin Crisis difficulty bar and to be fair the devs have probably been trying to find a better balance ever since, hence why content difficulty vastly differs DLC to DLC.

    Thanks for your extra thoughts.
  2. SethZoulMonEl 10000 Post Club

    To play Devil's Advocate, I don't always notice the text on the screen in the middle of a fight, especially the first time through an instance. I do notice chat if someone says something before the fight.
  3. L T Devoted Player

    EVERY TIME the devs violate or get away from the original core block/block-break/interrupt mechanics, I feel like the game dies a little bit. That's especially true for the new fad of don't-tap-block-to-breakout.
    • Like x 3
  4. Monkeyboy Committed Player

    First, as long as you have the required CR, you're eligible to enter the raid. If someone doesn't like the quality of players they're free to re-Q or form their own group. This problem is not new. Most have accepted this fact & prepare accordingly. You're not talking about elite but have an elitist attitude...classic!
  5. L T Devoted Player

    Nah. Throne of the Dead regular had multiple mechanics that you needed to pay attention to when it was released. Elite at the time was just more adds more health and higher damage.

    Come to think of it, Perpetua's oh-my-got-so-hard mechanic is copy and paste from the AF2 content, where we saw it in multiple places.
  6. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    It’s a weird time lately in there. I’ve been in random lfg groups and been out in under 15mins and I’ve been in some that take 50. And then elite runs are either 30mins or 300. Event is fine for all my toons now that they’re all renowned up tho so thankfully doesn’t matter much anymore. Get those coins however you can!
    • Like x 1
  7. Quantum Edge Devoted Player

    I've always found that the best time to go into the new, shiny raid is as soon after reset as possible. I find the geared players want to run it, and get it off their list ASAP. As the week progresses, more and more people gearing up decide to give it a whirl. Following this logic, I try to run it as early as I can on Thursday. I've been pretty lucky with groups, since the DLC launch I think I've been in two groups that have wiped.
    • Like x 1
  8. BumblingB 15000 Post Club

    I'm confused, is this a thread against CR skip, player tutorials, content difficulty, or lack of communication? We are kinda all over the place here.

    In terms of this raid, normal and event are different, not really mechanics wise, but damage wise. Proma is probably the worst of the first boss and really would be better served to have two tanks. The problem is that the concept of 2 tanks is heresy to the community. I've undergeared tanked it, died immediately and had to change my strategy and even then struggled. I can't imagine a less experienced tank handling it. When fighting Perpetua, her explode attack is a team effort. You can't use any powers, not even healing ones, it triggers the explosion and will wipe the team. This is not conveyed in event, at all.

    As for tutolige, they are not going to add that in. At this point, be happy they have the loading screen information.

    In terms of content of old vs now. We have a new set of designers that are trying different things to make content more engaging. The problem is, when something works they overdo the use. We see these mechanics for years after introduced on every boss. They also have changed the rules, like the ignoring of shields or breakouts not granting immunity.

    In any case, I am looking forward to new content, not that the mechanics are new, but the stories are. The whole Metal and Year of the Villain story went too long. Like 3 years too long.
  9. Dominic Blue Committed Player

    I really hate it when someone with Perpetua's green barrier that you need to gather to to minimize damage decides to run away from the group or better yet hop up and down and therefore you wipe the group. That and the eyebeam you have to block not roll from in the last boss fight is always great to again wipe/grieve the group in Regular. Obviously in Elite players will be paying more attention to mechanics but in Event and Regular your standard random will just ignore a lot of what's going on but this is the part and parcel of DCUO gaming experience. It doesn't help that Perpetua as an episode villain is just cheap with the mechanics overall. I'm absolutely not sorry we left her cheap cheating queen heiny with all her devious griefing ways in the Source Wall afterall not one bit, nope.
  10. Critical Massacre Well-Known Player

    Event isn’t real good about preparing you for normal content. Event is nice because it’s just chill, but no one that is going from event to normal has any idea what you're talking about mechanic wise. Which means any given raid you have 2 or 3 people learning all this stuff the hard way and it means a lot of failure. Event should definitely be closer mechanic wise to event, the reentry of the fight should pretty much make event still event. Maybe you could tone down a few one shots, but generally speaking you can’t learn from it unless you lose from it some.
    • Like x 1
  11. Valka Lynx Dedicated Player


    It also repeats in the chat every time someone gets the arrow. "Move to Marked Teammate to reduce damage" or something.
    I guess some don't realize they are the ones marked or just don't care. As in "I don't play much to know mechanics, bruh" like I heard once. :rolleyes:
    I understand some things are easy to miss, tho. But when it happens countless times for the same reason, especially after being told how to avoid it multiple times, and some special players still ignore it... it's kinda frustrating.
    • Like x 1
  12. Quantum Edge Devoted Player



    I find it useful to tell people to pull their camera all the way out.
  13. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    My favorite things going on are:
    Die in fire....don't worry...I'll pick you up..SHOOT...now I'm dead!....PICK ME UP!
    Get the protection symbol around you? Make sure to keep moving so no one can group by you.
    ....or make sure to park right in the path of Proxima Eye beam sweep.
    ....or in merc's swords.
    Or how people love to block like 90% of this raid...except the 2 spots you HAVE to block...Drowned's clap and the beam.

    Heck, the ONE mechanic most people understand is the 'block the beam'...or at least after 1 wipe they do. The rest of it? Nah, healer's got me....oh, the healer is down...shoot.

    Yeah, LFG for at least 4 or 5 people including the roles. A few stray DPSes will work, as long as they block the beam attack.
    • Like x 1
  14. WilderMidnight Devoted Player

    There are inconsistencies with mechanics spread over the alert, duo and raid. You have to go to the person with the protection symbol in the raid but you want to avoid the same thing in the alert. you have to block through perpetuas eye beam in the raid but not when it happens during the first boss fight, you can just walk that off. It's not that difficult to figure things out but it's still confusing to some. Add it an insane amount of lag that has been occurring in this dlc and it makes for frustrating content. I've had everything freeze up for me only to be knocked out when it comes back a couple of seconds later like four or five times the past few days.
  15. Quantum Edge Devoted Player

    Probably the most frustrating thing for me is when a character goes down, if you're attempting to pick them up, there's almost always some AOE that will kill you. It is a raid that punishes staying still for too long.
    • Like x 1
  16. BumblingB 15000 Post Club

    Yeah, that red arrow outward and green arrow inwards was not explained well. It was a new tell they introduced to the game to try and help players understand mechanics, but the instinct is to stay away from players when they have an icon above their heads.
  17. Proxystar #Perception

    Thanks for the additional example, it adds an interesting extra one to think about, however in doing so, I still disagree with the premise that it's a good example of normal previously being like the current elite

    The idea thrown around was that elite, even the most recent, is the new normal or somehow is the bar normal used to reach.

    Even throne regular doesn't meet that threshold, throne regular had hard mechanics and by hard a mean compliance, but it also wasnt particularly difficult and wasnt as difficult as elite.

    Put it this way, if anyone said the following:

    Throne regular back in the day, was as hard as source wall elite

    That statement would be objectively false, it simply isn't true.

    Which is the point I'm making.

    Normal content has probably got easier over time, but the suggestion it was ever as hard as elite just simply isn't true, even Prime Battlegrounds and Nexus weren't really, Paradox is probably the only exception
  18. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    [quote="Proxystar, post: 4512222, member: 312493"....snip... Paradox is probably the only exception[/quote]
    EO was the exception. Paradox if you close the tunnels was fine...challenging but fine. EO made it an 'elite' raid (minus the actual 'elite' title). Even if you didn't go for the feat, the 'go straight to center' method is where it became a PITA.

    Just saying...people made it harder than it was on it's own most times.
    • Like x 2
  19. Nangaf Well-Known Player

    I dont understand why developper dont put the event raid like a tutorial ,where explain the mechanic to players.
    Event serve to try new raid,alert,duo, but nothing is explain, maybe it’s time to introduce text or something in the event.

    And add a lock to regular raid before you doing the event mod
    same thing with elite will be great, add a lock to elite and need to do regular first to unlock
    (also on a personnal note, remove video from regular content just put movie in the event, big waste of time on all duo,alert,raid) ( i thing i will do a post for that)
  20. Lt Skymaster Dedicated Player


    I mean Fos3, Fos2 weren't exactly easy raids, even prime, obviously nexus and paradox. Those werent first day we beat the raid?

    Lockdown remember everyone QQing when they had laser instead of the ice artifact? Love and war, the amount of people not getting through the raid more so at the last boss was oof. Not saying they were paradox level or anything just saying they had a level of complexitiy higher than what current normal is.

    Before only really good groups would beat normal raids first day, some others would take several attempts. Some others gearing and then several attempts.

    I'm talking around 2016 and before mostly.

    Edit: and to your comment you need to have a healer, yeah I mean, sure, but also very often you can do it without a tank, i've been part of those groups where the tank queues as a tank but doesn't switch role. Not talking particularly about TSWR as I've only seen lb doing that, but other raids like flash to the future/flash voyage/ even TSDR