Saying There's No Money in PvP Isn't True

I still play Hearthstone from time to time. I played it "seriously" for like 8 months or so when I took a break from DCUO last year. I enjoy card games and I don't feel Hearthstone is fully a "pay to win" game because it still takes a good amount of skill to beat people even if you have all the nice and expensive cards. The problem I ran into with Hearthstone was after I achieved Legend rank and got the 500 wins with Warlock I got bored with it quickly as I had no desire to start on another class. Of course I never tried to get top 100 Legend or anything but I was content with achieving that Legend rank and getting the card back. I just couldn't be ****ed to grind back to Legend the following month even though they did improve the Ladder climb at least, lol. I'm hoping Brode's new game is as animated as Hearthstone is but with Marvel characters and a solid card game engine behind it that is enjoyable to play. Only time will tell.

EDIT: One other problem I had with Hearthstone was the overwhelming RNG that some cards generated. I am okay with some RNG in card games because without it, it can get a bit stale, but some cards in Hearthstone are WAY overkill on that junk. I'm hoping Brode stays away from saturation of RNG in his game.

That is absolutely silly. An MMO or any game that has single and multiplayer content by necessity needs to have more single player content because the single player content is the same exact experience and will get stale MUCH faster. Especially in an MMO structure where the content has to be grinded on repeat. The multiplayer experience is innately more dynamic and different every single time you play it. You don't have the same NPCs in the same location, with the same AI, and the same story content in multiplayer.

What made DCUO for me and so many other people so gripping was the PvP. For the first years of this games release, any league that was anyone had a very strong PvP presence. Rivalries between leagues that had epic back and forth battles in the arenas bled out into massive warfare in the open world. It's what people participated in and had a blast doing when they weren't running the same content over and over and over again.

My very first character and main that I played since day 1 is gadgets. If anyone was around that long knows gadgets was actually one of the worst powersets for the first couple of years for PvP. But I ******* loved it because I played gadgets against the meta. I was a two-handed gadgets user, and I wrecked **** because people had no idea how to play against me. My setup was unique, and it worked. It was a fulfilling experience, something that was not possible to get from PvE.

For me and many other players, DCUO was a PvP experience first and foremost. The unique combat system brought a completely fresh dynamic to MMO PvP. And it still is completely unique.

I keep seeing this 25% of players at most were PvPers. That doesn't tell me the difference between which players were the more dedicated players or which players were the more loyal subscribers. At this point though it is very possible the PvPers have been driven away by a complete lack of focus from the developers and it may be a fruitless effort to cater towards them. But this game was never innately a PvE game.

apologies for the -snips- there... just wanted those two points to discuss.

I agree that there are people that love to PVP, LPVP, duel or scrimmage in their (what I call) downtime. They do those PVP things when they are tired of the PVE, or wore out of the boredom factor of running events over and over and over again. I myself do a little LPVP and LPVE when the other parts of the game get 'stale'. It freshens things up. But for me, priority one is PVE.

You mention that for you and many other players, that DCUO was a PvP experience first and foremost. The complete flip of the coin opposite of that is true: That for me, and many other players, DCUO is and was a PVE experience first and foremost.



Ultimately, DCUO looked at their games' data, crunched their games' numbers, and picked which of the two (PVP or PVE) would be their best bet at staying alive/ which would be top priority for the game.
Honestly? I think that 25% number is way, way low. You have a point about loyalty; many pve peeps came - took a look around - and left. Almost everyone I knew from back then 'dabbled' with PVP in one form or another, they played it, but played PVE more. But again, it's what is first and foremost to DCUO's numbers where they decide to focus their priority... and currently it isn't PVP.

Just going to bump this a smidge...from way down in the middle of page 1...

So, I would propose that if the powers and revamp are part of what hosed PvP, then how about they remove normal PvP and stick to legends. No powers to worry about. At least in as much as what the legends themselves use. I know lots of people do like the Normal PvP but I would argue that it totally does not fit this genre. And from what little I recall when I played normal 7 years ago, it was basically who can pull of the various glitches the quickest. IMO, the biggest mistake they made was including regular PvP.

Legends on the other hand, is a made to order fit. Goes perfectly. Especially if they make so one side is heroes and one is villians. I.e, pick Joker and your on the villain side. I mean, we have literal decades of scenarios that would work. Each episode could come with a single map/scenario to coincide with the episode.

I liked Legends a lot, but some maps just didn't work. Paradox for one. Nearly impossible to get through that one with no actual healer. Which means certain characters with need a heal ability, or all need at least one, even its something small-ish.