Revamp Controller Role (Strip Power Out)

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by BaelinFishman, Oct 25, 2021.

  1. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    Any time I see someone say "trolls aren't needed", all I can think is that that person has never stepped foot into elite. Technically no role is needed for almost any content. Plenty of us have ran 8 dps thru raids. We go 4 dps constantly on alerts. Solo and duo is an obvious no role. But then you get into elites. Debuffs are a no brainers cuz things hitting us not as hard yet us hitting them harder is great. Or maybe the group has a spammy solo healer. We get someone to work mechanics so the group can perform at max efficiency, cc's and stuns in something like totde are extremely important. And then yes, buffing. Buffing is amazingggg. Does it kinda stink that you may have to redo your build to do it? Sure does but any troll that can buff will be in high demand. It's a role that doesn't need a ton of sp to be good but if you've got a ton, you're an incredible asset. Sink a bunch into health, some into vit and dom, some into might and power, sprinkle in some prec since you may as well be weapon tapping in between everything.

    I get it, giving pot is boring. But there are so many ways to play and if you're wanting to be in elite, it's as important as any other role. Plus again, for non elite content, no role is that important. My smoothest elite alert runs for batman month when I was tanking were with trolls not healers.
    • Like x 2
  2. Tree Well-Known Player

    What exactly did the original description say? The current one says, "gain the following benefits while in Controller role: activating any super power restores Power to your group over time and +35% Vitalization" (Controller Role description under your power tree). Furthermore, there is a single loading screen tip that states, "Controllers keep the group moving. Controller superpowers can both replenish power to the group and lock down enemies from using their abilities". Those two texts tell me to be a battery and then some, doesn't it? And that is how I play. The game mentions Buffing in two ways: in the description of certain artifacts and the Group Power Heal's description. Players talk about Buffing like it's the end-all and best way to play Troll. Other than that, we don't hear it or see it anywhere else. Or are you saying "other players never expected Trolls to be a battery in the first place" with this statement? From the descriptions in-game currently, I believe that power restoring is important to the Controller role and the game is making it less important. BOO!

    I agree with you on the idea that the expectations of other players on how roles should be played pressures the player to play a certain way. And most likely they'll experience some hate or rude comments from those players with high expectations. It's insensitive and pretty bold of them to do that. Playing your game based on a frequently mentioned """meta"""? Pass. I really just want non-Controllers to understand that Buffing takes the power restoring aspect of Controlling and makes it less effective and in my eyes, makes me a less helpful Controller. It's effective to play as a non-buffer. It's also effective to play as a buffer, yet the latter is being favored more.

    And Aggro is the intent of Tanks, but we don't call it Aggro.

    I strongly feel some way about ranking up meta artifacts that I don't favor and don't enjoy. Don't lecture me. I get your suggestion and I stand by it (make stunning way more effective, debuffing necessary, more buffs), btw. An idea could be to edit the Group Power Heal superpower. Make it work just like Elite weapons when used by players within that specific episode. You know, allow the Group Power Heal superpower to boost the main stat of other players?

    I feel like adding to the Controller role at its root and base toolkit is needed. We know that things like stats, Cyborg, and passive regeneration won't be touched, so perhaps find ways to add to the role's core instead of taking away something from the game..?

    To the OP, I don't support your idea of removing Power Out and your suggestions of increasing passive power regen.

    What else is already in-game that we could take ideas from to make the Controller role better?
    • Like x 1
  3. lordexecution365 Loyal Player

    No, I am saying to reduce them so that they are not so overpowered to where you only need 1.

    Before that in my previous post I said to increase the NPC's ability.

    I didn't even bother to touch on the roleless buffs because I already know not many can handle what I am suggesting due to where they are with skill and the way they choose to run content.

    Of course we can keep having these discussions over and over again and keep doing things the way that they are now.

    I really don't mind either way, it will not hinder me at all either way.
    • Like x 2
  4. lordexecution365 Loyal Player

    Totally missed my point, but ok.

    How has that caused any group to need any tank, healer, or troll to struggle anymore or less to actually do anything differently other than the same as before with the changes.

    I think you were reading more into what was said or you may fall into the camp that see the roles fine as is.

    I don't know
    • Like x 1
  5. Wallachia Devoted Player

    Controllers should have SC's regenerating their entire powerbar, like, for example, Word of Power iconic power (which works wonders on elec healers). The other classes should just have their power consumption reduced by 66% or keep the roleles powerback role in all times, so they could regen power while holding block, since it would be equivalent to resting. This would keep controllers relevant, enable them to focus fully on buff and debuff, and everyone would be happy.

    Specially me. It'd do wonders to my ego if my idea was applied.
  6. Controller Devoted Player

    I don't know....there's some stink involved in DCUO when Controllers are not really needed until Elite content....

    Elite content is not a good place to "Finally" need a Controller....Elite content is a rough training ground to prove your mettle.

    I've never deviated from how "I" play the role regardless of whether it's Elite or Normal but I "do" see some changes going on around me....they're small but like I stated before those "Small" changes keep adding up with each subtle change over the years.

    I think part of the solution is to start introducing content that makes it VERY obvious that Controller(s) are needed.....maybe make adjustments to how non-Controllers regen power


    Maybe new artifacts for Controllers? The Devs have ALREADY introduced a TON of interesting and diverse artifacts so I don't know what else could be done there.

    I know there is a perception out there regarding Controllers that is NOT true....but I do know that over the years there have been subtle changes made in game to......."Modify" how we are used....
    • Like x 1
  7. Stanktonia Dedicated Player

    Right, I’ve ran without tanks numerous times in reg lol. Trolls are still needed and beneficial, I really don’t see where the opposing argument is stemming from
  8. MaryMagdalene_DCUO Well-Known Player

    Controllers already have those things. It's like inexperienced players here are ignoring several things such as...
    Tanks usually being tasked with crowd control and add juggle
    Inexperienced controllers having no idea of npc breakout profiles (basically keeping adds juggled/stunned without the adds breaking out and getting immunity. Tanks can do it too, as a Controller I've done this to adds especially adds like the suppressor in pce)

    You don't know what is best for the role, there really aren't any actual veteran controllers in this thread except me.
    Hopefully the devs can lock and bury this thread.
    Troll role doesn't need a revamp. The devs just to introduce great mechanics in content to give the role some shine but the community ain't too keen on mechanics if said mechanics ensue difficulty.
  9. BaelinFishman Well-Known Player

    Actually I didn't miss your point at all. But you seem to be in the same camp as the nerf nerf nerf nerf crowd, you're just in a different tent. The roles strength wise are fine, they just need to stop rehashing mechanics in these raids that promote different styles of play and make less important roles more valuable. Because as it stands you can runa lot of elite raids without a troll, it might take longer, for some power might be an issue because they can't manage properly, but it can be done.
  10. BaelinFishman Well-Known Player

    First of all you so so ignorant in this reply its actually astonishing and thats even accounting for what league you're in and the people you play and hang around of your leaguemates actually said that orbital damage was calculated from precision which is actually hilarious, you and your league constantly glitch/cheese/exploit content I know because I've seen it first hand. I even know you kept all your voids, phoenix and NSF materials after glitching the heck out of those capsules...but thats beside the actual point.

    1) They may be tasked with CC but thats not what they're supposed to do beyond keeping the adds focused on them, don't get me wrong knock downs, juggles, and chronos help prevent a massive amount of overall damage reciveved when you look at the grand scheme of the entire raid, but CC is not the primary job of the tank....its the primary job of the Controller...HENCE THE NAME.

    2) To think you're the only one with any authority to speak on a subject is 1 asinine and 2 an outright lie, you're no different then a particular youtuber because he acts the same way and if you managed to spoof your forum name I literally wouldn't know the difference because you two because you act the same way. You came in here with the attitude of 'you people suck and don't know anything, I'm MaryMagdalene (not blacklisting because thats your forum tag) and I am the only one who should be listened to and everyone else should shut up'. You actually said "Hopefully the devs can lock and bury this thread". So not only are you acting like an elitist a** and dickensian about it, but you're actively trying to shutdown the discussion because someone said something you disagree with which is par of the course with you. Up until you came in this thread people we were having nice discussions and back and forth and for the most part 99% of it was civilized discussion which is what this forum should be. And if you didn't like it, then maybe you can either refute things with facts, ignore the thread and move on, or go pound sand...either option is fine with me. Even though I disagree with most of what you said I've never once insulted you and have never tried to get this or any thread shutdown EVER because it contains stuff I disagree with.

    Please go pound sand.
    • Like x 4
  11. TheLorax 15000 Post Club

    Are you sure about that?
  12. Bipolar Diva Well-Known Player

    I've been gone for minute or two but we'll known for sticking my foot in my mouth fighting for the controller community. I am chomping at the bit to get into this. however my opinion that controller's should handle cc is widely known.( Spelling while drinking wine is hard) I am a kinder gentler diva now. Hi Mepps. I'm being good...
    • Like x 1
  13. Tree Well-Known Player

    Give the thread something useful. You seem to know a thing or two about breakout profiles. Could you tell us more?
    • Like x 2
  14. Smashbang Wallop Well-Known Player

    You want trolls to stun/cc, but in order to do that tanks would need to be nerfed to not not stun or break our cc's. Lets face it, their stuns are better and I also see why tanks should be able to break our cc's. So that's just not gonna happen, there'd be riots.

    As I said, it's up to the devs to decide how to make trolls useful again, cause right now they're a luxury. Trolls have a (relatively) crap version of everything atm, cc/stun/shield, I don't see how that's fixed without breaking tanks/healers.
  15. Bipolar Diva Well-Known Player

    Biting tongue. Biting tongue.
  16. lordexecution365 Loyal Player

    Yes you did, lol...

    Initially they were fine, before they started down the road with WM/AM and then reworking the mechanics to how players managed their own powers.

    Very few healers could solo content back in the day, they just didn't have enough to maintain the group and I really don't care for those that would want to front as if they were the G.O.A.T. back then, I remember what it was like back then, I know some were good but I also know that even more were just terrible.

    I also know that people will not run difficult content, so I get why the pushback for any adjustments.

    I wasn't speaking of elite, I can careless for that because even that content doesn't say much because of the way it is setup.

    Healers are overpowered to the point you only need 1, so are tanks, and hardly anyone even pay enough attention to even know what trolls are actually doing even those playing the role of controller being they rely on tanks to do their job because they can't do it and say it is easier for the tanks to do it.

    DPS are the only ones who need assistance with burn, if we are going to say things the way you are making it to be like.

    They make up the majority of the group.

    Here is where elite can come into what I am saying, only because it is the only area that DPS numbers are reduced for what ever reason anyone has or any group of people have, but it is only little close to what I am suggesting, but if you feel like things are great as they are now, who am I to tell you that you should think like me.

    I was only speaking from my perspective.

    Thanks though but you definitely missed my point.
  17. Controller Devoted Player

    On a personal level I don't mind Tanks CC/Stuns being stronger. In a proper raid / alert this is how its suppose to be.

    Controller grabs adds....stuns them for a few seconds....just long enough for the tank to come in, grab the boss AND the stunned adds and take over from there.

    Controllers THEN assist with stuns for any strays.

    As far as shields? I'd like to think that my Hardlight Group shield is strong enough to get my raid party out of a bind...and my personal shield adds yet another layer of protection.

    I personally think that Power Regen - added over the years and quite subtly - is what's diminishing somewhat to the Controller. Some experienced Trolls see this then go the "Battle Troll" way to lessen THEIR power output but ADD to their damage output....

    I rarely bring my Battle Configuration out of the house.

    You now have what? Three versions of Controllers...."Buff" ones, Power Ones and "Battle" ones?
  18. BaelinFishman Well-Known Player

    Back in the day if the troll hit adds with a Distortion wave, the adds stayed rooted until it wore off and as long as the tanks were paying attention, they were able to keep aggro and adds would go right to tanks after the stun went away. I just want the damn stuns to last longer. Because right now the stuns last significantly less than they used to last and that was due to the revamp, all they have to do is increase the stun duration across the board by a flat percentage. And if the tanks break it, so be it, that happened all the time before the revamp.
    • Like x 2
  19. FlexVibrant Well-Known Player

    Just make content that makes mechanics where a troll is required whether for a stun/debuff and without it content can't be passed. So we can go back to the Tank-Heal-Troll-DPS style for alerts. It'll make trolls utilize their tools more and make trolls want to play the game more.
    • Like x 1
  20. Yaiba Committed Player

    You can check Penryn's guide about breakout profile, here is his guide .

    As controller, you don't really want to CC adds because most of your powers will give them immunity (immune to CC), this is not a big deal in normal contents but in some elite contents, it might lead to a wipe.