PvP Seasons and Progression

Yeah but I mean it does make leaving the game easier you know? But how do you people who play everyday feel , .

Mostly talking about the skill points involved, and how grinding for them wouldn't be worth it, unless you are super patient.

I use the same style(s) since I started the game, I'd only change if they gave more spot-on iconic stuff Hawkgirl helmet ( like an exact one)

Yeah but I still would hate losing in open-world just because debuff. Unless I use massive weapon skills ... but I guess you're right, sort of like legends now ( maybe get rid of all roles for pvp, too dramatic?)

you and i are not on the same page, i have no idea what you are talking about

I'm saying ,yeah they won't be able to say " you won because you're geared'" when they close the pvp-gap, because you'll be more or less evenly matched

But now if I were to fight a controller and we are evenly matched (because they closed the big pvp-gap) I'll barely come out winning if I win at all. While now I can usually take less-geared controllers with T4 healing pvp gear, when they close the gap I'll melt to newcomers

you should. a healer should only be able to beat a controller if that controller is really bad or under geared. Even under geared, they would have to be really bad.

So how would feel losing to someone new to the game, but it your opposite role , while your're an avid player

I understand how depreciation works as I deal with it quite regularly and do not require a lesson, but since we are on the topic the moment you drive a new car off the lot it loses value. Things depreciate at varying rates based on the market value--which is dictated more by human consumption (which is at best a social estimate and not a mathematical certainty.) My proof--the housing decline of 2007, but for sake of the forum I'll belay all the financial details of how this began and just stick with my original point. What is hot today is not tomorrow.

PVP was part of the original game and not an afterthought like in City of Heroes/Villains. Areanas were available for use at game launch and many of the pre-launch topics were about PVP and how DCUO was planning to do it different. PVP servers were some of the most populated for a long time (pre-megaserver/free to play transitions.) And I stated "imo" which I believe still means 'in my opinion"--could be wrong as I don't keep up with all the text abbreviations at my age.

Players can and will use PVP gear in PVE. Tunso already stated earlier in this very topic that things would be put in place to continue to make PVE gear in PVP and PVP gear in PVE less of an option.

http://forums.station.sony.com/dcuo...asons-and-progression.5141/page-28#post-70343

It is late and tbh I don't think anyone can help you see differently as you've obviously made up your mind. I wish you well and as I stated in the Roadmap topic if you are on USPC and are a hero look me up and I'll run some matches with you to help you gear.

Take care,
--YZ

they are only going to beat me if they properly play as a troller and im a healer or tank and im a troll, or they are a healer and im a tank, if they are a dps im beating them.
but if someone is new, chances are even with RPS in their favor, i will have the skill to overcome their newness.

I'd feel like adding them to my friend's list as they obviously know what they are doing.

I'm saying it almost makes it similar to legends ( takes skill) but the debuff will be your downfall now, while I still had a slim chance of taking out an opposing role with good dueling skill + better gear, eliminating the gear gap makes no one like THE best.

Neither do I. And I understand what you're trying to say. A car is also not completely worthless a few years later. I can't buy a car for as much as it costs a hamburger. The housing decline was also not planned, nor desired. Can it be explained? Sure it can. Do we need to get into that? Not really. The point I was trying to make, regardless of whether or not you agree with it or not, is 6 months of effort should not be reduced to 30 seconds. The developers have full control over this.

An interesting thought though... if you could have prevented the housing decline, would you have?

Well, all I can say is I feel strongly about it. But I can be reasonable.

Alright, take care.

A. I can see the reasoning behind removing the reward even for a lost match, but I tend to think it's better that there is a reward even when losing. PvP, in every MMO I've played, is the highest stress part of the game. It's in PvP where people get nasty with each other, and rage-quit a the most. I think that's just human nature. People get frustrated with a PvE raid wipe, especially if it's repeated, but people take it more personally when it's another person that is killing them, especially as frequently as happens in PvP.
The reward even for a loss I think is actually important in allowing people to enjoy PvP, because if there is any semblance of balance you will of course lose often, (though people get angry as though they should always win), but a reward even when you lose mitigates this upset. I really do think this is important to making PvP enjoyable so you can always walk away saying - well, at least I got x, and am still moving towards my goal.

A. i) As for people going AFK. We already have the start room which you can't stand in for more than a few seconds or you are removed, which works well. If there was a similar thing for inactivity in a PvP match, I think that would be good. That is precisely what they did in other MMOs I've played.

B. I'm concerned about the tiered seasonal system of progression proposed. I imagine from the game seller's standpoint a continuous progression is attractive as incentive for people to keep playing. As someone who has played a variety of MMOs for many years I find this mechanism has a turning point at which it drives players away from the game, and sometimes in throngs (especially when an attractive new game comes out). If there is always an uphill climb to achieve a 'completed' state of your character, it can quickly become disheartening to the player - because no sooner than you finally feel you have arrived, than the destination is removed to a distance again.

The way it is now, though it takes perhaps somewhat too long to earn each PvP set available, the goal is in sight, and doesn't seem to be moving. I think that is very important to a player's willingness to proceed with the task in front of them. You need to get somewhere, and be ale to enjoy being there for a while.

So my request and suggestion would be to have FEWER tiers than the 5 proposed each 6 months. Have maybe 4 in a year. Make it possible for someone who is NOT grinding regularly to earn their 4th at least 8 months into the year, so that there are 4 months to enjoy having 'made it' before a new grind is put in front of them. Allow time for people to want a new tier. If no sooner than you reach tier 4, there are announcements of new tiers coming, I am fairly confident this will drive some players away from the game to other new games coming out. That is what I have seen in previous MMOs.

If you want to provide a goal for players to pursue during the interim 4 months when an average player could have completed their top tier, make that goal in a different area of the game, so it isn't an unending treadmill that eventually wears down the player, until they decide to get the heck out of dodge.

Hello guys! I just wanna share my thoughts about the 5 gear sets and the seasons. Well it is not works for me, because if you think about it, the seasons doesnt matter! In each season, the difference between the new sets stats will always remains the same. You are getting the highest gear, and after the season you have to start it over again, actually you are getting nowhere. you have to repeat the same grind over and over and over. Its like you are starting from ZER0. 1 new set in each season would be much reasonable. Please listen!

After 6month you have to get 4 new set. But the differnce between those sets will be the same like the season before. I dont see where it is going.

What is the point to get 4 new tier if you are throwing them out? instead of geting 1 new tier in each season, which you are keeping and modding!It should be like this: at the begining of the new season, the highest tier from the last season should becoming the 2. best gear and the new tier should be the best.

I cannot speak for those who are in the middle of finishing a pvp gear tier or just starting to get their T4 pvp set. Mainly cause I have just finished accumulating enough Marks of Strategy to buy 5 T4 pvp pieces in one shot to get to full T4 gear level, just not enough exobits atm to fully mod it. Won't start spending any until details on the conversion rate to Marks of Valor are made known.

Excited about the Pvp revamp, but still reserving judgement until more is known. But thus far, its looking good.

Playing the devil's advocate here.

1. There will still be some exclusion, naturally.

5. My personal feeling is that Home Turf has brought in some new people to arena Pvp. Good or bad is tough to say. Some people are relying on the Home Turf additions, so not really a good sign. And some people don't use it, but will use it so that less time is taken to finish things like the crazy 1000 Lair win feat.

6. No more assumptions. Never assume. The gear stats and costs as posted by me on page 26 shows the current gear gap. No ifs, ands or buts. Current gear stat progression cannot be followed and must be changed or else the pvp revamp is rendered meaningless, since one of the main ideas behind this pvp revamp is to reduce the gear gap, thus benefiting old/returning/new players.

Gear is and will always be a focus. Its a game. Less focus? The argument can be made for more focus, especially with no marks being awarded with losing (currently the case with Marks of Strategy but not Marks of Tactics). So although better gear in the upcoming system will provide less of an edge compared to the current system, it will hold even greater significance to some.

Never underestimate what people will do to gain any edge, big or small. Look at the Home Turf additions. Are people relying on Home Turf additions the ones you would want enticed to Pvp? From your signature, likely not.

Generally I support reducing gear gaps. In my opinion gear should have no meaning in pvp, although sometimes it can be used to bridge gaps between unbalanced powersets.. However I sneer at the "removing grind" statement.

However I fear for the new ranked matchmaking system. Its great when you are mediocre. I can see it becoming intolerable when you are "too good". I have some experience from being "too good" in other games, I know how lonely it can be when you're near the top.

@DCUO Developers

I'm really trying to just get over the“Start Over” part of the Progression plan, mainly because it sounds like we don't really have a choice, but I can't. I like this game and don't want to have to quit, but if you go threw with this plan the way it is now I will quit. There is not one part of me that wants to start PvP gear over at T1 and PUG my way back to T4 over and over again. When I first heard about this I thought, 'Who ever came up with this plan has no idea what it's like to PUG from T0-T4 in PvP.' Lol. PUGing Arenas is not fun until you get to T4 because that's when arenas can truly become somewhat competitive. I only recently finished modding my T4 gear so I finally feel like I can compete at the highest level with anyone in the world and now I hear this news about how every season the previous T4 PvP gear will be only as strong as the new seasons T1 PvP gear and if a player wants to stay competitive in PvP your going to have work your way back up to T4 again, and every season the T4 gear resets to T1 again. PvE people should imagine it like this: Every Season (six months or so) your T4 PvE armor that you worked for is only as strong as T1 armor and you had to work your way back up only to go back down to T1 and start over at the beginning of every season. If the developers said this plan was for PvE, people would be going berserk! So why is it so hard to believe that people like me, who enjoy PvP more then PvE, are upset? This makes me feel like PvP is going to be pointless and that I've wasted my time with this game. I've heard the questions, “Why do you play PvP?” “ Look at the reasons why you play PvP.” I can honestly tell you I play PvP because it's the only part of this game that's always exciting to me. While playing PvE I have fallen asleep with the controller in my hand and I can say I have never fallen asleep while playing an arena match, that is why I play PvP.

I know you say that by doing the “Start Over” plan it will keep things competitive but what I think is going to happen is the people who can play this game everyday, the people who can afford a lot of replay badges, and the people who are in PvP dedicated leagues will always be ahead of everyone else and there will be no competitiveness in Arenas after the first week of each season unless your one of those three and that's not in anyway different then the way it is now.

Look I understand why your really doing this. Once I fully completed my T4 gear I noticed I stopped buying replay badges, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. I'm also sure DCUO developers /accounts/whatever noticed too. By doing the Seasonal reset people like me will never stop buying replay badges until they hit T4 and then when the season changes more replay badges, always chasing the T4 gear. It's a steady source of income that you can relay on so I can't blame you for proposing the idea. I understand that to you, the game developers, (guys like Mepps and Spytle) this is not a video game as we the player see it, DCUO is your business, it's how you make your money and I respect that. DCUO is a Free to Play game so you guys have to make your money somewhere and I respect that too, but please don't do it like this. I can understand you want that replay badge income so I'm not saying don't do the seasonal event thing. I suggest you do the seasonal Progression thing like this:

Current
T1 – Hawkgirl/Robin/Aquaman – Marks of Influence
T2 – Avatar Bombardier – Marks of Tactics
T3 – Virtuous Knight – Marks of Tactics
T4 – Checkmate – Marks of Tactics

Season 1
T1 – Avatar Bombardier – In game cash
T2 – Virtuous Knight – Marks of Valor
T3 – Checkmate – Marks of Valor
T4- “New Gear” - Marks of Valor
x – Hawkgirl/Robin/Aquaman gear styles available at a vendor

Season 2
T1 – Virtuous Knight – Marks of Valor
T2 – Checkmate – Marks of Valor
T3 - “New Gear” - Marks of Valor
T4 - “New, New Gear” - Marks of Valor
x – Hawkgirl/Robin/Aquaman gear styles available at a vendor
x – Avatar Bombardier styles available at a vendor

And so on and so forth.

I don't expect the plan to be exactly like this, for example maybe just 3 tiers of gear, maybe 6 tiers of gear, whatever, that's for you to decide. You can change the season every 4 months or so, so there will always be a steady stream of income from replay badges from PvP. You won't be making as much money from replay badges as you would with your current plan because because people with T3 or T4 gear won't need to buy as many replay badges as they would if their gear was reset to T1 every season but that's ok because people who got their gear up to T3 or T4 payed their dues with time and probably replay badges and good customers like that should be rewarded not exploited right? I know people will say, “You don't have to buy replay badges if you don't want to.” And I say to them, If you don't buy replay badges you'll be behind the people who do. If the game developers really wanted PvP to be “Competitive” they would make it so you can't use replay badges in PvP, which is something I'm not even asking for here because I know DCUO relies on those replay badges for income.
Like I said before I don't expect the plan to be exactly like I suggested but what I do expect is for my T4 gear to be no lower then the new season's T3 gear. If my T4 gear is any lower then the next season's T3, it shows me that you are greedy people and it shows me that you really don't care about your customers.

I've been playing this game since July 2012, and I've been a legendary subscriber since day one. I've bought replay badges, R&D scanners, Legends characters, and deeds. You could look up my account if you want, Giddeus USPS3. I also want to say when I started this game I started with my four brothers, all of which have moved on to other games but I stayed and been an advocate for this game to anyone who would listen. The reason why I say all this is because, I know my opinion doesn't matter to the other people who post on this forum but as I am a loyal and well paying customer, I hope my opinion matters to you. I recently bought the three month for $30 deal you were running and it expires around the time you plan on releasing this Progression update. I am not going to invest anymore money in this game until it’s release (with the $10 PSN gift card Sony handed out I was planing on buying Hal Jordan but instead I bought AUR for the game Dust514 so I can buy augmentations which I guess is that games version of the replay badge), and if the update is released with your current “Start Over” idea I will not be renewing my subscription and I will be moving on to the next game.

Thank you for your time and I hope you come to the "right" decision.


*And to all the people who thinks I'm an “elitist”(whatever the hell that means) or I just like to stomp low level players: I'm a T4 fully modded PvP Sorcery DPS and I've never used the joker box/transmutation glitch once (not even to see how well it works). I don't have a PvP league behind me, I had to PUG my way to T4. I literally played only PvP matches for six months until I got my T4 gear. I admit I used replay badges whenever I could afford them. I used replay badges to get to T4 as fast as possible so I could compete in arena matches which will not change with the update. Replay Badges will only become worst because there will be no end to it.
And to all the people who are giving praise to the developers for responding on the forums, they are just doing what other Free to play MMOs have been doing. You take a game like Dust514 for example, those developers are on those forums daily and sometimes when it comes to big game changing decisions they take a vote and let the people who participate in the forums decide. I do respect that the developers of DCUO have been more active with the “Community” lately, but their just doing what other Free to play MMOs do so don't kiss their *** too much.

Remember your paying them.

I have a proposal:

1 - Start off the first season with the current gear. Change to Marks of Valor. Give people a chance to earn up to T4 and finish it. Should be easier for new people to do this, right? Heck, first season just give some marks for losing as well and state it's only first season. Have this last 3 months. Almost everyone should have Checkmate. Do what you can to make that happen, without making it feel too cheap.

2 - Second season (3 months later) introduce 4 new sets. Replaces each set. Checkmate becomes cash gear. Top tier is only accessible to Last Laugh DLC.

3 - Third season (3 months later) introduce 2 new sets, and keep doing this every 3 months. I feel like 6 months is too long for a season, and 5 sets is too much as well. Let the previous season's top Tier be next season's mid Tier. That way those who have earned top Tier have something to show for their work next season, and other people have a chance to catch up with them.

And instead of calling it T1 through T5, lets call it Cash through T4, just as it is now. Tier gear should always be earnable with Marks. Cash gear should be considered entry level gear, not Tier gear.