Discussion in 'Oracle’s Database (Guides)' started by OMAAR, Mar 2, 2013.

  1. OMAAR New Player

    I'm mostly comparing the combos between weapon attacks rather than weapons.

    Currently my spin chop vs flurry will be answered by one issue: does spin chop hit for 360 degrees or not.

    If yes spin chop is definitely better than flurry. The Powerset I play with has a combo that is similar to spinchop, in theory the combo does 100 or so less dps ( not damage ) than our top combo, but since it hits for 360 degree it is much better in all situations except boss battles with no adds.

    Shiney the problem here is a cross platform issue. The PC is smoother overall and can be helped even further via use of macros.

    The Ps3 is hampered by manual input ( even using old vs new controllers makes a difference ) . The thing is we should do a combined guide with both PC and PS3 values to be judged.

    As we can all see the main discrepancy is dps or to be exact the timeframe itself.
  2. dWI New Player

    flurry is the dual wield combo right? if it is, it is more targeted than than spin combos in general. all spin combos are not the number of hits used to use it, they are area of effect damage over time. that being said, all spins are easily avoidable by one dodging and then lunge interrupting it.
  3. Warlan New Player

    False, as long as the weapon combos are clipped with the SAME power it doesn't matter and generally speaking as a player that's all I care about. If I'm using a power like Detonate to clip I don't care if Inferno takes longer to clip, all I care is if Spin Chop clipped does more damage per second than Flurry, assuming that the two weapon combos take the 'same amount of time' to complete.

    No one was claiming you can just ignore the other cast times of the power and the damage from that power. The point is that is irrelevant when comparing two weapon combo moves if their time to completion is the same (or at least very similar).

    Noone was claiming this. You're taking this out of context. We were talking about two moves that OMAAR was claiming had the same cast times. I totally understand that if you have two moves with vastly different clipped times that it becomes wholly dependent on the powers used to clip and also available power. I do agree that weapons are a lot more balanced but I'd also say that there are other factors that unfortunately are hard to take into account. Either way, great work you did in the other thread.
  4. shiny mackerel Committed Player

    Nooo that's exactly what my example was about - different combos with the same power. It will matter and depends on this power. But yes, if the two combos had the same amount of time you're right. Maybe no one was claiming it but the exclusion of powers in the overall thread just worries me, so sorry. You may be comparing spin chop and flurry that take approximately the same amount of time to execute and clip (also confusing to me) but what about when you get to other moves? And yeah, all of these external factors are easily just as important as the theoretical damage/time but hey.. we gotta start somewhere.
  5. shiny mackerel Committed Player

    Yeah, this is fine. We're just approaching it differently. PC may be smoother but people still have trouble clipping perfectly. The times I posted aren't realistic for anyone on PC except maybe the macro users. I didn't even time any of the clips myself. I thought the delay of clipping just depends too much on the person, so I found the absolute minimum time it takes and advised anyone reading to time the moves themselves or add a delay for practical use. The clipped DPS for me would then just be the theoretical max, so definitely our numbers will differ greatly.
  6. Dump Truck New Player

    Very cool thread Omaar.
  7. OMAAR New Player

    I'm going to change my thread to PS3 only! And link the PC to your thread.
    I can guarantee you the actual damage ( not dps numbers ).

    I,m trying to compile a calculator for both my HL guide and this.
    I will make a PC/PS3 selection in it that uses my or your clipping times.
    Cheers my man!
  8. OMAAR New Player

    P.s. spinchop hits in a conic ( albeit wide ) fashion NOT a 360 degree way.
    Please correct me f I'm wrong.
  9. Zur-En-Arrh28 New Player

    Yeah, SpinChop isn't 360 like Hold Claw or Staff's 360 move.
    • Like x 1
  10. Soulburn32 Loyal Player

    i've always used flurry on one handed, it has always felt like better sustained/average damage to me

    what weapon you doing next omaar?
  11. Warlan New Player

    Flurry also hits multiple targets and for me it seemed to have about the same radius as Spin Chop.

    Staff Downward Smash Combo hits 360 far as I can tell. MA just blows in that regard from what I could tell. Bow has nothing AOE that doesn't split but I think it can put up better numbers simply because sustained damage is constant because you're not getting interrupted and you don't have to worry about your big hit missing cause the mob is already dead.
  12. OMAAR New Player

    Handblasters this weekend. For some reason I can't find my notes.
  13. Warlan New Player

    Is there a list anywhere of which weapon combos are AOE and don't split on at least 2 to 3 targets?
  14. Jaye31987 Well-Known Player

    3 things that im slightly confused of.

    1. Ctsv - Im really good at math and Im still not grasping what you mean exactly or how you getting the numbers for that term. Please explain.

    2. Time elapsed - is that the time for the combo to be clipped or the full animation timer?

    3. Calculating "real dps" - is the real dps stats caculated using a clip or using the full animation? The reason I ask is because clip weapon vs full has 2 difference dps.

    Other than that, this is hands down one of the best guides.
  15. OMAAR New Player

    Hi jay.

    1-Think of CTSV as follows:
    ( your weapon dps + ( your precision/10) ) x CTSV = your damage. CTSV is a constant that is predetermined by the devs.

    2-time elapsed from the first hit till the moment you can clip, example:
    Flurry is ht then hit then hit then hold for flurry then use power
    Time elapsed is the moment from the first hit till the moment you activate your power to clip flurry.

    3-real dps takes your crits into account:
    0.84( your chance of normal hits)x damage + 0.26( the highest critical chance you can get)x2.3( your critical damage modifier I have seen both higher and lower so I took this at an average)x damage = real damage
    Real damage/time elapsed is your real dps.

    Note it's 2.3 for melee and 2.15 for ranged weapons. For reference it's 2.15 for power as well ( weather melee or ranged is equipped )

    The numbers are being reviewed daily and they will be updated along with HANDBLASTERs soon.
  16. Jaye31987 Well-Known Player

    Thanks for the reply. Number 2 I understand fully.

    For ctsv per hit= so you mean that .33 for 1 hit is the total time of 1 hit compare to spinning chop which is 1.98 per hit of total time avg of 3 hits?

    And for number 3 - just to be clear, when you write down the numbers in ur papers, are your waiting for the full animations to write the number down or clip the combo than write the number in?
  17. OMAAR New Player

    CTSV : say you have a 131 dps weapon and 609 precision. 1 hit is 0.33x(131+60)= 63. Meaning each time you tap square you do 63 damage.
    You spinchop does 1.98x(131+60)= 378 damage.

    These numbers are average and you can hit both lower and higher.

    CTSV has nothing to do with time. It is a constant used to calculate damage of a particular atack with a single tap or flurry or spinchop or....l

    3- from the time you raise your weapon ( the first frame of animation from a standstill ) till you can first lip the desired combo. These numbers are slower compared to PC macros so take note.
  18. Jaye31987 Well-Known Player

    Sweet, now I know how you getting your ctsv. Thanks for the replies.
  19. OMAAR New Player

    Anytime buddy.
  20. Intent New Player

    Is this still gonna happen? I was looking forward to this. I've been doing raids with HB lately instead of 1H and I've noticed a slight increase in damage.