Nature and Weapon Mastery....

Discussion in 'War Room (Powers, Artifacts, & Builds)' started by CrappyHeals, May 8, 2014.

  1. CrappyHeals Devoted Player

    So now that Weapon Mastery is out and me and others have had time to test other powers out using WM our testing has confirmed what I said the day the Dev's said nature wasn't going to receive the WM buff, and that is that nature would be falling behind without it. Now don't get me wrong nature is still good but so many other powers outshine it now cause it does not get the buff. Even with the so called "awesome mechanic's" which are not they are just dots like many other power sets have.

    Take ice for example put your dots out do a shield weapon mastery combo use resonating gale as the move that gets the WM buff and get 3-4k hits on multiple targets with the power. Now take nature with 3 dots and voracious plants. Nature has one more dot but still it doesn't match up to the damage that ice can do because voracious doesn't benefit from WM and only hits for 2k on single target at the most and if not single target you can get hits as low as 400, but on the other hand when ice uses resonating gale and gets the WM bonus on it it seems to not split much. If you hit 3-4 people it will hit them all for about the same but if theres more the number will be a little lower but still hit multiple targets for about the same damage.

    Using WM then a power after it seems to make that power not split and if it does split its just a slightly lower number and still hits multiples for that number. Heres a example First hit of dreadful blast after a focus/Blast to solar flame hits 3-4 targets for 3000 to 3600 at 4-7 maybe 8 targets it hit 2200-2600. Now that same first hit without the WM buff splits at 2 targets and the numbers are well under 2k and hitting for 1000ish maybe a tad more or less.

    So from my testing the WM buff not only does it buff the power but makes it not split much or at all and when theres more then 3-4 targets the damage on the power is lowered a bit but still hits multiple targets for about the same damage.

    So bottom line Nature with these so called "awesome mechanics" is not so awesome when other powers get such huge benefits from WM. Even with all the dots nature has it still doesn't match up to the damage i can do with other powers and Weapon mastery. A extra might dot is not going to over come constant 3-4k hits from other powers. I have no idea where the devs got their info from to make the decision that nature should not receive the WM buff but they should look else where for proper feedback next time before making such a big decision.

    These are just a few small example and i hate to write. I could explain much better in a actual conversation but i hope you get the point.
    • Like x 20
  2. RoyalServant New Player

    For Starters:

    Full Weapon Mastery Power Set = Utilizing ONLY the powers allowed to retain Buffed Might crits + New WM Combos

    Restricted Weapon Mastery Power Set = Utilizing powers that restrict might buff + New WM attacks



    So when there's an individual who argues a power set is fine, it should be made clear whether or not we are discussing the restricted or the Full WM power set. They aren't the same.

    And please correct me if I'm wrong, but Sorcery & Nature are the only 2 powers with restrictions as it stands?


    From what I understand, the current Powers that Prevent Full Weapon Mastery:

    Sorcery - Fury & Guardian

    Nature - Savage growth, Briar, Vine Lash, Swarm, Gorilla Form, Wolf/Insect Form, Canine Form.


    It's obvious that the Nature power set is completely gutted and barebones when attempting full weapon mastery use. Other power sets simply have access to most if not all of their powers abilities and have greater potential for damage.

    If you judge Nature Dps based entirely on only using serpent, thorn shield, roar, voracious plant, impairing thorns and carnage, it's the worst power in the game to utilize Full weapon mastery. Sorcery also has a restriction but they have WAY more options than that of Nature.
    • Like x 1
  3. CrappyHeals Devoted Player


    Sorcery is actually fine without using the fury, they loose no dps at all. When using WM with sorcery there is simply not enough time to keep up all your dots and keep the pet powered up at the same time. What the devs did doesn't affect sorcery at all despite what some people may think, but then take nature. they completely took away every useful power that nature can use. And like you said if you base nature off of powers like roar and serpent call its for sure the worst powerset in the game.

    I really cant see why and how they made the decision to take the WM bonus away from nature. Every other power can use whatever they want and get the WM bonus, but nature can't use any of its useful powers...Thats like saying for rage dps you cant use plasma retch, galling eruption or violence. Or how bout mental you can't use mass terr, thought bubble or pyro. or how about sorcery you can't use circle,shards or soul well and if used in a long enough fight can turn out to be 6 dots....and the list can go on and on.
  4. LowFlyingMoon Loyal Player

    I can live without the ability to use WM crits together with Nature DOTs (and BTW - I'm pretty sure Harvest also disables WM crits for 12 sec - even without DOTs present). I don't understand why Swarm can't be used, though. It's not like Swarm is on par with Sorcery pets or as if it can compete with WM damage output (like spread DOTs potentially can - although not really). I don't mind replacing Swarm with robot sidekick, except IT MAKES NO SENSE FOR A "NATURE" PLAYER TO USE A DAMN ROBOT...
    • Like x 2
  5. J Zmooth New Player

    Sorcery doesn't need the Weapon Mastery Bonus. It does better damage with the Fury. You can also actually do the WM combos and still keep the DoTs up. Most people just don't use the correct loadout/rotation.
    • Like x 2
  6. CrappyHeals Devoted Player

    Without the fury is a lot better in my opinion. Trans hits real hard and the way WM works makes it not split much. So it crushes with the rite WM combo.
    Instead of powering the pet you could have used trans and done more dps then the pet would, but this is a whole nother discussion lol
    • Like x 1
  7. Whizzkid Dedicated Player

    That's interesting because the same can actually be said for those that prefer Fury to the crit bonus o_O. They both are very close in terms of DPS but the size of that gap depends on the WM combo used by the player not using Fury and also the content. For some things I prefer Fury and for others, I prefer an alternate load out. It's all really personal preference.
    • Like x 1
  8. J Zmooth New Player

    I just said I prefer the Fury to the crit bonus.
  9. J Zmooth New Player

    Trans does 1 tick of damage that's also AoE just like the Fury but the Fury can hit up to 5k. The Fury also does DoTs while It's up. Trans does not. And if you're running Grand Summoning you can have 2 of them hitting that damage while the Watcher and guardian also do DoTs.
  10. CrappyHeals Devoted Player

    This isn't about the best sorc loadout in this thread. And by the way if your running grand summoning your missing out on something important
    • Like x 2
  11. Black Prime New Player

    Agreed. I gave up on nature. Maybe they will undo what they have done. I dont think the will. There is not enough nature people that are upset and not enough people understood in the begining that this was a nerf. I have tried every combo possible. I did more damage from iconic powers that nature powers. Again this was supose to be about options and there really is none. In process of trying cels and sorc now. Tired of rage, mental, gadget dps in my league putting out ALOT more damage than me. I swear the only power that has really been made stronger is rage, which it did not need. Maybe when a actual raid comes out they will have to back up and find a range loadout. Til then rage rules dcuo. No one could try and say its not so. They are getting 200k damage from that OP super charge. Nothing in the game comes close.

    But yes, now everyone can finally see. Nature was nerfed with WM.
    • Like x 2
  12. RSL New Player

    wait... is this really why i don't see the big crit-y hit when i do my WM combo in DPS on my main? did the devs really take WM bonus away from nature as a whole?!?
    • Like x 2
  13. Black Prime New Player

    Yes if you use dots or swarm. Vacarious plants from my testing hits harder when things are terrified. Hits real hard with PI and WM.
    • Like x 1
  14. RSL New Player

    well this helps. i thought i just sucked at timing. will have to play around with voracious plants this evening. i really thought... i never see that number [trying all sorts of dot numbers].
  15. Superskull85 Devoted Player

    I said this to you in your initial posts Crappy but you need to wait for each powerset to get their awesome mechanics before you can really comment on this topic. I say this because Electricity's new Voltaic Bolt will not activate the Weapon Mastery buff when it is used either. Voltaic Bolt is pretty much Resonating Gale in concept (Resonating Gales is not in the "new thinking" yet) so you should know where I am going with this...

    I don't think you will be patient and wait though. :p
    • Like x 2
  16. Titans1373 Dedicated Player

    I had high hopes for nature. After running it for 5 days when wm dropped I realized exactly what CrappyHeals is saying. The dots just don't add up to what you potentially lose. Switched to sorcery. BTW I found not using fury seems to generate better numbers with a fast wm combo.

    Back to nature though I don't know why they get penalized for having poisons. Many other powers have dots and don't get penalized. I could live with missing the bonus if swarm was up, but losing the bonus for dots is a joke.
    • Like x 1
  17. MasterOfTheHunt Well-Known Player

    Stuff like this makes me want to quit.
    • Like x 1
  18. Skylez New Player

    #NatureIsLife
  19. Artichoke Heart New Player

    So, I'm a little confused.
    Is there a build that does work with WM at all? Or is it just pretty much play like WM didnt happen if you are nature dps?
  20. pitbullb3 Devoted Player

    Anyone who is using fury with sorcery is losing a lot of dmg. The wm bonus make transmutation hit up to 3500(my highest) and shards 2800(again my highest). With the fury you have to keep it powered up which make you loose dmg even more, because you coulda did a burst dmg power instead of offering. I said before the u36/dlc dropped that sorcery won't be effected hardly, but nature will fall behind and people argued the opposite, don't understand why players think fury is sorcery best dps move. Veterans know better, but the bandwagoners don't(veterans of sorcery)
    • Like x 1