More Stats Revamp 1.1

Discussion in 'Stats Revamp Archive' started by Mepps, Dec 19, 2016.

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  1. RogerBlack Committed Player


    Suggesting that Gadgets get a 'group shield' makes the powerset worse?
    That's your opinion.

    As for the rest of your comment... scroll-up to see my reply to Hollow Dreamz.
    Not going to retype all that stuff.

    On a sidenote: It seems that folks who mostly play with other powersets have quite alot to say about Gadgets.

    Personally, I think the Devs should just talk to high-level Gadget Trollers and get their opinion on whether they would want a 'group shield' or not......instead of talking to folks who prefer to play as Rage Tanks, or Ice DPS's, or Munitions DPS's, or Sorcery Healers, or whatever.
  2. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    • Like x 1
  3. Ringz Dedicated Player


    Wow, really!? You shutting off people just because they don't like your idea and you assume they must not be a gadget troller?? You have no idea if the people you assume are gadgets, have an alt that is gadgets, or have past experience of being a gadget troller. Remember, you asking for gadgets to have a 8 man shield was a "SUGGESTION" provided by you, and people have the right to tell you that your suggestion is either good or stupid. And you talking like this change is a necessity and being talk thru the devs right now.

    If you really feel that you are missing a 8man shield, then how about you switch to those other troll powers for it instead of trying to kill variation and asking for an all in one power to have everything.

    Thats like me asking for fire tanks to get a shield like ice just because.
    • Like x 2
  4. Wiccan026 Loyal Player


    Actually why comment on the things you said to Hollow Dreamz, he already accurately provided the right "counter arguments" for "your" belief.

    Most folks don't want the powers to just be reskins, what you're proposing very well could do that (they very well might just take battle drone to give you what you want) and also it makes the power set have even less "skill" necessary to play at the top of your game.

    I also think most people responding to your post either are gadget players currently or at least have a "main" alt or so (or switch back and forth between gadgets and whatever) but I'm willing to admit that I'm wrong on that count.

    Oh Technowing says "hi" by the way.
    • Like x 1
  5. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    right lol I've done gadgets controller for like 3 pushing 4 years and I know how to do pickups in elite raids and SM with gadgets but even with 5-6 years he's still having problems with rotating decoy distract and stealth/hl shield to be as efficient as a group shield xD If you need a group shield supercharge to pick up 2-4 ppl and none of them are in a dot and your group doesn't have like 5+ adds out, something is hella wrong lol I'd hate to be in a group with someone dependent on a sc for pickups.
    • Like x 3
  6. RogerBlack Committed Player

    Why are you so offended just because I suggested that Gadgets get an 8-man group shield?
    Why do you think that adding one single power.... kills all the variation?

    Sidenote: No, its not like you asking for Fire Tanks to get a shield like Ice Tanks.....

    It's more like you asking for Fire Tanks to get a 'group control immunity' power... an ability that every Tank has.

    Those ice shields benefit just one person... meanwhile, a Group Immunity benefits all 8 teammates.
    See the difference?
  7. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    Bad example considering Fire Tanks already have a group control immunity, 2 in fact. Burning Determination and Burnout. You'd want to give an example of something they don't have that every other tank has. A Shield being an example of that.
  8. RogerBlack Committed Player

    Spoken like a person who doesn't pickup many teammates.

    And btw, if a teammate is closer to do a pickup... guess what??
    There is something most Trollers can use to help their teammates rescue other fallen teammates who are far away..... ah yes... it's a called a 'group shield'.

    How ironic.

    You're so busy trying to shoot down my suggestion... that eventually you revealed your own selfish behavior.

    Thanks for clearing that up tho.
  9. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

  10. Sw33t Well-Known Player


    He didn't have to "shoot down your suggestion". You managed that perfectly yourself.
  11. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    Small stipulation on the example though: No extreme stupidity cases like 3 people going down in a field aoe and the solo or both healers are in the field. You shouldn't be asking for powerset changes in cases like those. That's meant to be a wipe.
  12. RogerBlack Committed Player


    Olympus Elite Raid >> Zeus Fight:
    • One person is in the back of the room luring the Phoenix away from the rest of the group, but he gets KO'd
    • Meanwhile, 2 more folks get KO'd at the same time, up in the front.
    • As someone else gets zapped by the pool.
    But hey, according to you... that guy in the back (who was distracting the Pheonix) is not helping out his teammates. At all.

    He (or she) doesn't deserve to get picked up.

    No need to waste a sc 'group shield' to ensure everyone can be rescued without the Phoenix interrupting the pickups.

    Sure, I get it.
    • Like x 1
  13. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    K.
    1 Dps is in the back with the bird.
    2 dps were close range dps'ing and didn't take a soder when zeus did his skull and died.
    1 healer died to being zapped by the pool.
    1 troll 2 heal 1 tank 4 dps comp.

    Gadgets troll throws battle drone and uses a trinket for power out for the healer. Lunges to the back and hits decoy and distract on the bird and does the pickup for 1 dps. 1 Revive. The last dps who didn't die can pick up both people in the front seeing as they should be right next to each other or within a meaningful range and the tank shouldn't have zeus right next to them for any aoe staff moves to interrupt the revive. After the first dps gets revived, he should be taking the soder he didn't take to avoid dying if he wants to and should be rushing to get the 1st healer that died being zapped to the pool. After the gadgets troll gets the person in the back, both of them should be helping with any complications that somehow arise in the front.
    Dps in back - revived by troll
    2nd dps in front died - revived by 4th dps
    3rd dps in front died - revived by 4th dps
    healer who died from pool - revived by 2nd dps or can even be done by the 2nd healer if he has a shield for the tank or if the tank knows how to kite.

    Also, distracting phoenix while in bird form or out of it is actually a strategy that people use for OLYE, so that doesn't count as not helping the group. I was in the group on test server that originally found out that he could be held in the back to not be a nuisance.

    And even if I wanted to let that dps die:
    lunge and decoy distract bird
    troll picks up healer who died to the pool
    dps's still do the same on their revive.
    7 man run now. 1 dps replaces the one who we let die. 1 troll 2 heal 2 dps 1 tank now on the boss or if you're confident in your healers you can do 1 troll 1 heal 3 dps 1 tank on the boss and have the second healer replace the dps in terms of distracting the bird.

    Next example.
    • Like x 1
  14. RogerBlack Committed Player

    Just stop.

    This was a terrible attempt explaining a simple solution.

    First of all, the Gadget Troll would have to be 'near the Phoenix' for the Hologram Decoy to get its attention within 1-2 seconds....

    Second of all, if the Gadget Troll is nowhere near the Phoenix, as soon as he hits 'Distract'.... his remaining teammates (who are still alive) 'become instant targets' of the Phoenix.. and they will most likely get interrupted, as they try to revive their fallen comrade. (Distract is better if only one single person is down... it's not a power you want to throw in a situation where there a only 2-3 members left alive who have mere seconds to move to an area an revive someone. That's a 'death sentence' for them, because now they have all the NPC 'aggro', while you do not.)

    Lastly, by the time a Gadget Troll throws out.... 4 DIFFERENT POWERS.... (assuming that all 4 powers are 'ready to go' and not on cool-down)... BEFORE racing to make the 1st pickup across the battlefield... his DPS teammate is probably already out of the fight... because his timer has run out.

    Instead, what could've happened is....

    - Gadget Troll throws up a 'group shield'....
    - Then rescues the closest KO'd teammate...
    - Which gives rest of the remaining players a 'fighting chance' to revive the person closest to them, at the same time.

    Simple as that.

    When 'every second counts'.... throw 1 power... Not 4 different powers... That takes too long.

    Maybe, if you spent more time 'reviving folks'.... you would probably know this stuff.

    Which reminds me...

    Devs while you are considering giving Gadgets a 'group shield'... please add a 'Rescue' Stat to the scoreboard.

    Since you already track a player's number of 'Deaths'... perhaps you should also track the number of times they 'save their teammates' as well.

    Thanks.
    • Like x 1
  15. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

  16. EconoKnight Loyal Player

    I do enjoy people spouting off all of these intricate details, strategies and tricks as things people "should know". It's like watching an airline pilot criticize a guy in a Prius for not knowing how to fly properly. The guy in the Prius in fact doesn't know how to fly a plane properly; but he doesn't want to either. He was just trying to drive to a movie and have fun with his friends.
    • Like x 4
  17. RogerBlack Committed Player

    Battle Drone
    Trinket
    Decoy
    Distract

    That's 4 different powers.... Not 2.

    Plus take the time to target a moving object... and hit 'lunge'.

    Ahh yes... do all of this.... before actually making your way over to a 'downed teammate' to hit the gear over their head.

    OK, I've heard enough. bro.

    Thanks for your input tho.
  18. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    Actually, you put 4 powers before racing to get the pickup in you comment as seen here.
    [IMG]

    I only hit 2 powers cin my current location when everyone dies.
    And the bird doesn't move until he's already picked another target and during that time period he hovers over the dead person for 3-5 seconds. If you're paying attention when everyone dies including the guy with the bird, that bird will not have moved and will be right next to the dead person because all of his attacks are melee that can kill you. The bird has a ranged attack that used to 1shot you but it was nerfed. The only way for you to die to the bird is to be melee. So if he's melee range to the bird because of how he died and the bird doesn't move immediately after killing someone, after those 2 power casts and 1 lunge I'm right next to the downed person after 3 seconds of them dying. As for targeting, not only is the bird not moving but all you have to do is turn your camera toward the back and when u get in range of the bird and you see red, hold L1 and lunge. That's not rocket science nor time consuming.

    After I'm already there, THEN, you hit decoy to draw bird aggro and hit distract to deaggro the bird if you pulled it's attention and to give you a shield in case the bird does an attack so it doesn't interrupt the pickup.

    I shouldn't even have to break this down, you're reaching so hard it's not even funny, just accept a loss -_-
  19. RogerBlack Committed Player

    You did all this typing just to admit that you are hitting 4 different powers (plus lunging a moving target) BEFORE actually making 1 single move to touch the gear over a downed teammate.

    Yet you think that giving Gadget Trolls 1 'group shield' is not needed... because you think you can run around, cast 4 powers... clip half of them... spin your camera around.... target enemies... lunge at them.... then hop, skip & jump in LESS time than it takes to throw up a 'group shield' with the press of a single button.

    Pure Nonsense.

    Just stop typing already.
  20. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    You realize you just repeated yourself instead of actually replying to my response to the first part of you not understanding the difference between what "racing" and "interaction" is? You do realize that racing, which is the first term that you used, would be a term referring to movement right? Because, you know, you can't have a race if you're already at the finish line right? And in regards to the group shield comparison. I would've been 1 second later to the pickup for the trade off of having used 15% less supercharge and having more power out than you. Besides for yourself, the group shield aspect is wasted on everyone else in that situation. There's only 2 threats to the group: Zeus and the bird. The bird is in the back and because of it's hovering mechanic it's not going to reach the other side of the map to even attempt to attack someone for at least 5 seconds. Zeus is held by the tank and with the 2nd healer not having to do pickups, he's fine, and the bird is hovering which means that of the group members left for doing pickups none of them are actually under any damage threat to even break a pickup besides you since you're going to be the first person to next to the bird. So congrats, you used a supercharge and wasted 15% more than I did just to shield yourself and nuke a healer's power pool for no reason and give dps's power when they were already maxed and gave 3 other group members a shield that wasn't needed. And of top of that because the group shield doesn't give crowd control resistance, the bird can actually panic you and stop you from the pick up even if you didn't take damage from the move. Between the time before the panic, the panic itself, and the cast of distract if you had to use it afterward, you'd actually take longer than me to do a pick up in the situation you created.
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