Test Discussion Mental Midrange Adjustments

Discussion in 'Testing Feedback' started by Tunso, Dec 4, 2015.

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  1. TybeeTahiri Devoted Player

    Are we able to use Menace and Mass Terror before leaving Invisibility ?
  2. TybeeTahiri Devoted Player

    I think Menace and Resonance should be combined more than ever now. Atomic has it, why can't we get it ?
  3. Absolix Loyal Player

    Yep, but sometimes you have to wait just a moment before using Mass Terror/Lev clipped with Menace since if it behaves similarly to the Pyro/Menace clip on live Menace won't actually trigger despite the it's icon in the loadout bar turning red. You could also use Menace first then Mass Terror.

    You can stay in Invisibility as long as you don't take any damage, and do not attack any enemies.
    • Like x 1
  4. Karasawa Loyal Player

    Bug Report
    Seems you can get 2 AM-boosted Mass Terrors out of 1 use of Invisibility. I assume it's unintended since you can't do this with Gadget's Stealth ability.

    Repro Steps:
    (1) Equip Mass Terror and Invisibility on your active bar.
    (2) Equip Mass Terror on your Invisibility bar.
    (3) Perform Invisibility>Mass Terror from Invisibility bar>Mass Terror from active bar.
    (4) Observe that you get AM boosted damage on both Mass Terrors.


    Also note that I was also able to perform Mass Terror [clip] Menace from the Invisibility bar, but Menace only does 64, 60, and 71 damage when it procs with the next Mass Terror.
    • Like x 2
  5. Gameongabe New Player

    check your pms bro.
    • Like x 1
  6. L T Devoted Player

  7. Tunso Developer

    Yup, definitely not intended. Thanks so much for reporting that! So we'll get it fixed.
    • Like x 3
  8. DustyAnkh Loyal Player

    Okay, so I'm really liking the changes so far. But at the risk of sounding like a spoiled brat, I have 3 requests (more like begs).

    1 - Please add Cryokinesis to the AM. I really want to shoot fire, electricity and ice from my mind. TK Bolt and TK Push are not only too similar to each other, they are kind of lame. Please please please add Cryo.

    2 - Please make it so we can use Movement Mode while in our Mass Hysteria form. Or give it flight-only or something, like how Wolf has Superspeed, even if your Nature toon is not Superspeed. Moving so slow while in that form makes me want to scream lol. Again, I'll add a "please please please"

    3 - Please make Mass Hysteria buff our attacks, instead of just weapon attacks. It makes more sense since our AM is focused on our tray powers.

    Everything else seems okay so far, and I'm looking forward to the changes.
    • Like x 2
  9. Absolix Loyal Player

    Keep posts in this thread to testing the AM.

    Here is a thread that is meant for more general Mental feedback. I would suggest making sure to at least read Tunso's posts in this thread.
    • Like x 1
  10. DustyAnkh Loyal Player

  11. Xibo Loyal Player

    MT - Grandeur - MT is clippable like Gadgets?
  12. Kimone Luthor Genetech Clone

    So how is the Mental adjustment coming along?
  13. Sore Steadfast Player

    I couldn't agree more. It is good for Mental at the expense of balance. It would be better to remove instant access to full AM damage from Gadgets, Earth, Sorcery and Ice rather than give it to Mental too. Otherwise what will other power sets ask for? Will Quantum explode a fully loaded Time Bomb if cast instantly after Gravity Well? Will Nature and Elec stack all DoTs instantly from two powers? What does Munitions, Atomic, Fire, HL, Celestial, Rage, etc. get to compete with that? How is this going to manifest fairly for all power sets? I feel it may be short sighted. Even if you did add it to them all, will that make the game more fun or just easier? I'm not a fan of the simplification WM and AM brought and this seems like the path to another example of that. Instant Rawr damage is not good design for DCUO. Some burst, sure. But it should be equivalent across the power sets.
    • Like x 3
  14. zCaution Well-Known Player

    Every power wouldn't need a shortcut..come on lol ice doesn't have a shortcut and it passes gadgets sometimes. Atomic doesn't need a shortcut to pass gadgets. All those powers need is to hit harder or have crazy burst potential
  15. zCaution Well-Known Player

    And quantum literally can't have a shortcut because time bomb does dmg based off the pi dmg
  16. CrappyHeals Devoted Player

    All powers with shortcuts and super short setups need to changed to say a min of 3-4 powers before they are at max potential thats the only way things will be balanced.

    Ice needs to be looked and so do a few other powers. This instant damage isn't good for balance in the long run unless they drop the dps of the powers with shortcuts and fast setups.
    • Like x 2
  17. CrappyHeals Devoted Player

    The only way I can see balance happening with powers with shortcuts and super fast setups is to drop the dps on them. If they are going to be able to deal damage so fast then that damage needs to be toned down. That sounds like a fair trade off to me. Either that or they are gonna have to go rework a bunch of powers and to me it would just be easier to tone down the dps of those faster setup powers.

    Heres a few quick ideas for if they wanted to correct the instant damage powers. I think the pets for earth/sorcery should not do max damage till their third attack. Ice/fire has to do 3 arctic gusts/fire bursts before its at max damage (similar to how munitions has to build up). Gadgets/mental no short cuts. I have other ideas to but those are just the basics, but like i said it would just be easier to tone them down a bit.
    • Like x 1
  18. Fies Committed Player

    Powers with an universal loadout (all ranges) like quant/nature/elec/earth... should be doing lower dmg than those with exclusive midrange loadouts like mental/gadgets/ice...Shortcuts are a good way to compensate. Could go on about differences between the AMs and how they should be weighted all day btw (Hi nature guys with over the top group buffs and best healing+imba-cc :)) That absolute "balance" some on here seem to strive for isnt achievable unless every power is basically the same/just a recolor. At a certain point (when no power is left too far behind) its time to let go and focus on other (more important) aspects.
    That said dmg-wise mental didnt need an update (dmg) at all- it already was "competitive" also bc of its insta power-back that allows/ed to keep the am going and start with a big hit at a new group of adds. With that being removed as well as a generally boring 123-4 AM the shortcut is very appreciated and the right step to take.
  19. TheDarknessWithin Loyal Player

    I agree. it seems phase 3 has gone in the right direction but now has now created a new issue. Gadgets and Mental were boring API 1234 powers, the added shortcuts made them slightly more complex and fun but with additional high damage. This just simply isn't good and has added further imbalance and tough competition for Combo and DoT type powers. Something needs to be adjusted in future updates. Probably after the HL, Rage, Nature and Electric updates so we can see what conclusive adjustments need doing.

    It's just simply unfair how some powers can activate in a clip and spam instant high damage whilst others require longer to warm up and are more interrupter-able.
    • Like x 1
  20. Sore Steadfast Player

    Ice certainly has a shortcut. If I recall correctly, originally you wouldn't get Arctic Gust or Avalanche boosted unless you had either 4 chill effects or Ice Armor active. Then a free shortcut was given by the NPCs only needing to stand in an icy field. So instead of stacking chill effects, all you need to do is cast one clip of WinteryTempest/IceBash/ColdSnap and you have Instant Rawr damage. We can define Instant Rawr damage any number of ways. Being able to leverage out-the-gate boost of your full AM potential within 2.0s via one power (or one clip) is a good enough definition for me.

    You say "All those powers need is to hit harder or have crazy burst potential". I agree that could work. That would be designing the powersets with trade-offs. Give and take. The problem is that the devs have already announced their intent to make all the powersets have the same sustained damage potential. That's the CR126 25.5K / 30.0K / 35.5K damage targets over the average of a long sample. That takes "hit harder" off the table as a trade-off. That means adding shortcuts to Instant Rawr damage to some powersets and not others just makes the powersets with Instant Rawr damage have the best of all options.

    This isn't Mental opening the door for other powersets to ask for Instant Rawr. That door's already been opened by Gadgets/Ice. Sorcery/Earth already walked through that door. This is Mental walking through it too. This isn't precedent setting, it's precedent reinforcing. If you're not playing an Instant Rawr powerset, start asking for it to be added to your powerset now. Let's setup the next round of 8-month balance passes after midrange is done.

    So in my mind, I don't have a problem with Mental and Gadgets having a 1-2 punch. But you should have to 1234 once before being able to use the shortcut. That makes you have a setup time closer to other powersets around 4-6s. If the shortcut stays, you shouldn't be able to use it as a lead-in to a battle.
    • Like x 3
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