Work In Progress Improvements to the Loot System

Hello DCUO Community,

I have some news to share that has been burning a hole in my brain for some time now. I cannot believe I finally get to share our plans to improve the loot system! It’s so exciting. We have been talking about this for a good while now, gathering feedback and looking at data on our side, and we now have a great plan going forward to make dropped rewards more rewarding and more fun.

We will make two significant changes, one limiting how long you can go without getting certain rare drops, and one allowing greater choice in what you receive.

Setting Expectations
Before I get too deep into it, let me make a few things clear:

Q: Does this system do away with RNG loot drops?
A: No. Random drops provide an exciting chase in the game, the unknowns keeping that chase interesting. We have used and seen them used successfully in virtually all games out there, and consider it an important part of the game overall.

Q: Will the very best loot in the game come from drops?
A: Yes. The excitement and surprise that is part of the loot chase needs to come with a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow that is worth the effort, a rare drop.

With that said, on to the details!

Bad Luck, Nerfed!
We are going to limit the number of boss fights you can go without getting a rare drop. We will do this by gradually increasing your chances each time you do not receive a rare drop, until one is virtually guaranteed. This will ensure that a rare drop will eventually come your way. Using Amazon Fury Part II as an example, this would apply to Item Level 100 or 101 gear.

We looked at the data and found that it was only a very unlucky few who had extended droughts of not getting a rare drop, or too much bad luck. Most people were right at our expected drop rates, some doing a bit better and some a bit worse. We looked at the streaks people had - or, how many bosses players went without receiving a rare drop.

In those streaks:

·36% of them ended after one boss fight (one boss fight unlucky, the second boss fight lucky)

·By two boss fights (two boss fights unlucky, the third boss fight lucky), 59% had ended

·By three boss fights (three boss fights unlucky, the fourth boss fight lucky), 74% had ended

·By four boss fights (four boss fights unlucky, the fifth boss fight lucky), 84% had ended

·By five boss fights (five boss fights unlucky, the sixth boss fight lucky), 90% had ended.

What this means is that most players, most of the time, are experiencing randomness as we want them to - unknowns and excitement without going too long without reward. That said, one poor soul went 19 bosses without a drop, and that is what we want to limit. (That player got a drop on their 20th boss, by the way, and still plays the game.) Somewhere above that 90th percentile, we will begin to increase the chances you will get a rare drop dramatically.

Once you get the rare drop, the percentage chance to get one returns to normal and the streak will be tracked all over again. This tracking is on a per character basis, so those of you with alts should not worry about which character you have to run.

So, yeah. YAY!!!!!

Giving You a Choice
This brings us to the part I am most excited about. Each time you defeat a boss, we will allow you to choose from a list of randomly populated rewards instead of automatically granting just the one. The loot tables and possibilities will remain the same, but you will have choice in determining which random drop you walk away with. You will still also get guaranteed rewards like Cash, Seasonal Items, Prestige, and Marks.

When you defeat a boss a loot list will appear. You will be able to pick one of the pieces of loot displayed there. Different types of content drop different sets of loot, with raids generally having the most lucrative lists. Right now we have two categories of lists. Solos, Duos and Alerts have one list, while Raids have another. Here is what those lists will look like, though I should mention the details here are subject to change:





First, the gear. These are two separate rolls - two separate chances at loot - off the same table or list. In an Amazon Fury Part II Raid, these would be some combination of Item Level 98 and Item Level 100 gear. You might get two Item Level 98 items. You might get a 98 and a 100. You might get two 100s. It is still random at that level. What this does is offer you the ability to choose between the items, selecting the one that is best for you. This is huge, because everyone's opinions and needs are different, in no small part due to what drops or choices you have made before.

Second, everything else. If you miss on the gear drops and do not desire either of those, you now have more options for what you would receive instead. Some people prefer 98 gear. Some people prefer an extra mark. Some people might want that sweet base item. Now, it's up to you.

Previously, we did have some loot that had a chance to drop sometimes but not other times. This will change to accommodate the new system. Those items will now be part of the array of choices, and not have a chance to drop additionally.

In the end, this is all about giving you more options each time you earn a reward, which overall makes the system more rewarding to more players. All of these things can be useful, and now you get to choose what you think is most useful to you.

Consistency
Not only is choice a big part of this system, but so is consistency. We've heard your feedback about wanting more guarantees when you play and unlock the content. These improvements ensure you walk away with the rewards that matter to you, and that you have a maximum limit on how long you will go without getting lucky.

By allowing greater choice and limiting bad luck, our goal is to make content more rewarding and more satisfying for an even greater number of players across our diverse population. We also know these systems are a bit complicated, so we are here to answer your questions and consider your concerns.

Thanks for reading and we look forward to your thoughts.

**Please note, we do not yet have an intended release date for these changes. We'll let you know when we know.

Looks fair to me. Quick question though:

If you get a 100/101 drop and do not choose that option does your bad luck factor reset or keep going until you actually choose a rare piece?

This is awesome.

Impressive.

Will these changes affect all content or just going forward?

Ok...you keep my interest...good job there Spytle...I do like this a whole lot better.

Is this just going to impact say AF II going forward or will this be pushed back to say the beginning of T6, go all the way back to say T1 content or only start with T7? Just curious how this will be implemented?

I have no words wow.

Personally I had no issue with the loot drops before, so getting this change is just amazing. I cannot wait to see this come through. I might finally get to gear our alts instead of chasing pieces I'm missing on my main.

Hopefully by the time this drops, my issues can get resolved and I can login and participate in it. Looking forward to a release date.

This is great news! Glad I stuck around to see it...

All of this seems very reasonable. I have no negative comments.

For clarification:

1 - So we kill a boss and each player gets a list of gear where we can choose what we want?
2 - Does this mean that any piece of gear will be up to be chosen or will there be a predetermined set? For example, we take out the Forge Master; everything in his normal loot table can be chosen as a reward or will we see only a small number of random pieces to choose from?

Either way, on paper, I see nothing wrong with this. I was thinking this morning, when you're levelling, all you wish for is that piece of gear, and when you're above level, all you wish for is that extra mark. Seems a good move, waiting to test it.

Okay, so when it comes to choice, I see that we will not be getting a chance to get: Piece of Gear, Utility Belt, RND item, and Seasonal item. It will be options to choose from that. As much as I like more gear, I like this better! Makes you want to replay for that boss.

My question is though, will seasonal items be included in the option list?! So instead of two pieces of gear, you could theoretically have two pieces of Celtic backs to choose from? Or two snow man trinkets? Or boos? It's just a worry. I like this a lot more, it would also make it where dry spells happen less, as instead of having one chance, you have 2 chances to get a 100 piece.

Final question, is this a going forward, or are you going backwards to ALL content like personal loot did?

Brilliant.
However, I hope this does not push vendor gear out of the picture. Purchased gear is a valuable part of the process and should remain the baseline or higher for progress to the next DLC. It's an attainable goal with a scripted outcome.

I like the idea. Still think vendor gear should be best.

#Loot is always on everyone's mind.

Okay, so as one of the loudest voices on the subject, here is what I have to say.

This system is good. Much, MUCH better. HOWEVER you still are NOT addressing the real problem here and you are passing off "bad luck" as merely not getting an item equivalent to the top level gear. Something I was concerned about from the start when Mepps began teasing changes.

If you go on a long streak of getting nothing but 98 drops, you WILL get a 100/101 drop... however that's the only guarantee. That you WILL get something. Not that the rare drop you are going to get will be something you can use. As I have said in other threads, yeah you might limit bad luck on not getting top level items at all, but what good is a 3rd waist? a 5th head? a 10th trinket? It's still bad luck and a waste of time/money.

Effectively, all this system does is give us a "2 for 1" on raid runs and let us choose our booby prize. Sure, there will be instances, where this system is beneficial, but for the most part you aren't resolving anything. People are still going to be running raids and only seeing pieces they already have or don't need and will have no step towards ever getting a piece of gear they need.

Because that's the very nature of this lottery system. You can't have it being too rewarding or your players will progress too quickly.

So thanks for making the changes. At least I'll be able to leave content with a guaranteed Base Item, now. But ultimately, we haven't solved the problem here and people are still going to be complaining about running raids for no reason.

Hopefully this will better as I've had horrible luck ... My last 4 raids I got 0 100 drops ...