Icon and Rocket

I rarely start my OWN threads but a nagging question that I have is - "Why a "Calvin Ellis Superman" instead of a "Augustus Freeman IV / Icon" movie?

I've discussed in many threads regarding my love for Icon and Rocket over the years - not only HERE but on other blogs I visit and the absence of Icon is troubling - at least to ME.

I have several thoughts / ideas as to the WHYS of the Icon and Rocket absence from the Big Screen -

1. No one to write it such a movie?

Nab Ryan Coogler to do it. He did a FABULOUS JOB with Black Panther.

2. Icon is - "Too OP"? As Powerful as Superman but NONE of his weaknesses?

Categorically FALSE. If anyone chooses to READ his and Rocket's Milestone comics you'll see as SOON AS Issue number 3 of his series that he falls VICTIM to the Bang Baby "Payback"s claws - almost killing him on the spot.



ALSO during his EPIC fight to the death in Icon 16 versus Superman Supes manages to bloody Icon's lip















Eventually the interdimensional being known as Rift stops their fight once he acknowledges that NEITHER will yield to the other



So once we're torn down the "Icon is too OP" myth then why no "Icon and Rocket" movie?

Does the "Calvin Ellis" Superman go forward because it is more of a "Recognized" brand?

I find this reasoning to be rather HOLLOW - being that Marvel's Black Panther was NOT a well-known brand, either..................and we ALL KNOW how well that movie did.

Why did the "DC Fandome" mention Milestone Comics revival but yet make NO MENTION of bringing any of them to the Big Screen? Especially Icon and Rocket?

Why did WB do a touching tribute to one of the MAIN Icon and Rocket contributors



but then turn around and offer up Calvin Ellis Superman?

Let me be CLEAR - I believe some version of Superheroes offer up different perspectives. I get it. But those who venture into the realm of offering different versions of Superheroes need to be mindful of ORIGINAL characters with RICH backgrounds and backstories - and then have the COURAGE to present them and bring them to the Big Screen - like Marvel did with Black Panther.

Marvel is ALSO rumored to be bringing Blue Marvel to the Big Screen.





Blue Marvel knocks the being known as Sentry into outer space - right AFTER solo'ing the Avengers.

Blue Marvel would mark another ALPHA-LEVEL superhero on the Big Screen for Marvel - along with Thor, Hulk and Captain Marvel.

But back to Icon -

He's joined the Justice League in Young Justice



And I've already proven here in this thread that he is NOT too "OP" to bring to the Big Screen but he is easily as powerful as Superman.

He has a VERY Original beginning



and his partner / friend Rocket is perhaps even more INTERESTING than HE is - being that she is an idealistic and intelligent teenager that convinces him to become a Superhero and ALSO ends up becoming one HERSELF.



Let me be clear - I LOVE the MoS, BvS, Justice League and Shazam / Aquaman / WW movies. I am looking forward to The Snyder cut.

But Icon and Rocket deserves introduction into the DC Cinematic Universe. It is time and would be original.

It might simply be a matter of exposure. Black Panther first premiered in 1966, and although there were attempts to bring him to the big screen earlier (think Wesley Snipes was trying hard to get the project off the ground at some point) he didn't make it to film in his own movie until 2018. And even if you count his appearance in Civil War as making it to the big screen, that's still 50 years to make it to the movies in any form.

Icon? He premiered in 1993, and despite the use of the character and exposure in shows like Young Justice, I don't know if he's that well known. Even with the amount of media out there and the accessibility to that media, he and Rocket may not be at the level of recognition that studio execs think is needed to greenlight such a project.

Should it take between 28 and 50 years for a character like Black Panther or Icon to make it to the big screen? No, and there's a whole boatload of issues that can go along with that particular discussion that I'm not qualified to delve into. But just from a name recognition standpoint? I have to question how well known Icon is, even after his premiere almost 30 years ago. So it wouldn't surprise me if DC/WB might think it was a safer bet to go with a Calvin Ellis Superman instead of Icon simply because people know Superman.

Thank God Dwayne McDuffie pushed to get John Stewart / Green Lantern in the Justice League Unlimited series. Here's a Green Lantern that had been around since 1972 I believe.

Augustus Freeman IV "IS" well-known among certain groups - especially after his appearance on Young Justice. I wish DC would take a chance with him.

Bring in Ryan Coogler to get this thing started.



I think you'd REALLY do Dwayne McDuffie / Denys Cowan and the other folks at Milestone Media justice if they took a chance at Icon and Rocket.

Let's be real, here - if folks would've stayed with the Status Quo then Justice League Unlimited would've looked like THIS



Instead of like THIS




If we keep going with "Known Brands" then we'll NEVER see different perspectives NOR see different Superheroes like Icon and Rocket.

Need a "Plot Opening" to get Icon into a DC Movie?

Well the man IS a high-powered and wealthy Attorney as his alter-ego. Simply have Ben Affleck / Batman mention HIM or his firm as being the ones who facilitated the purchase of the bank that foreclosed on Martha Kent's farm.

Being that Icon spent MANY years on Earth simply waiting for the technology to catch up to his alien pod so he could leave it why not have him visit Kal-El's ship during that time? The one that Kal accessed during the MoS movie? Let's say that when Icon gained access to Kal's ship he stumbles across THIS




.....and befriends this unusual dog and then turns him over to Kal-El eventually - many years later when he FINALLY becomes aware of Superman.

Icon crash lands on Earth in 1839. Kal-El arrived on Earth as early as 1938, from what I've read. This has been revised a few times, I understand.

So if we go with the EARLIER year of 1938 for Superman then Icon would've been on Earth 99 years before him - PLENTY of time for him to find his crashed ship from the MoS movie, use his powers to get onboard, befriend Krypto and many years later this dog become a path somehow to him befriending Superman.

Good solid plots are NOT hard. Folks just need the motivation to make it HAPPEN.

Heck - use MY plot if they need, too lol - IDC. I just want an Icon and Rocket movie in the DC Cinematic Universe.

Among certain groups may not be enough to convince the execs, though.

Just as an exercise and to make sure my own memory wasn't failing me, I dug through a website listing a TON of action figures made of DC characters. It included stuff from DC Direct, Mattel (they had the license for quite a while) and even the new stuff coming out from McFarlane Toys.

Side note: speaking of the John Stewart GL, McFarlane is coming out with a killer version of him in their line soon, and they've already got a Justice League animated version of him. Worth a look.

I checked through all the lists to see if Icon had gotten a figure in any of their lines. I thought with the number of figures Mattel put out while they had the license AND the number of odd/obscure characters that made it into their various lines (Jemm, Son of Saturn and some Super Friends even made it, for crying out loud LOL) that Icon might have made it into that line, if not one of DC Direct's assortments.

Nope. No Icon anywhere. Static/Static Shock got at least one among all the lines, but not Icon.

Calvin Ellis did, though. *shrug*

And yes, studios should be a little less risk-averse at times, but DC/WB has been REALLY hit-and-miss with their super hero films. Superman is just better known and would probably be viewed as a safer bet, even though it's not using the Clark Kent version but the Calvin Ellis version.

And knowing foolish studio thinking, there'd probably be some clueless exec somewhere thinking that people seeing "Rocket" would be thinking of this guy.

May not be "McFarlane" but they DO exist - Rocket does as well.

And I'm not quite sold that Icon and Rocket - from Milestone - aren't known among DC Cinematic Execs. I'm certain that they green-lit this touching tribute to Dwayne McDuffie



It strikes me as a bit hypocritical to do this tribute and then a week or so later talk about bringing a Val Zod movie to the Big Screen. I can't speak for EVERY DC fan but in the blogs I'm seeing it's not being received well at all.

Additionally - Rocket was well-known in the Young Justice series, also.

That Payback picture that I posted earlier has updated so I reposted it here. This Bang Baby - as I posted earlier - shatters the myth that Icon is too "OP" for the Big Screen.

In the comic here he almost kills Icon with his claws.

They cant have their “golden boy” not be the strongest in the dc universe. I have also been asking for icon in this game for a few years now!

I agree wholeheartedly. Introducing them would be a great way to introduce the Milestone characters into the universe. I'm sorry but Superman has been done to death, along with Batman. Speaking of Batman, I'm also hearing that they're developing Black Batman film with either Jace Fox or David Zavimbe versions.

Going back to Icon & Rocket. If they don't like their iconic suits, they can modify them using the new Milestone 2.0 designs:


I don't mean to be that guy, but let's keep it 100. Them wanting to introduce a "black" Superman is pandering all the way. I'm sorry but neither Val-Zod or Calvin Ellis are "original" characters. Sure they got differences here and there, but at the end of the day they're just Superman with dark skin.

Icon on the other hand has a different, more interesting origin IMO. He crash landed on Earth, had his body modified and enhanced, went through American slavery, fought in the Civil War, went through Jim Crow, Harlem renaissance, segregation, Civil Rights movement, etc. He has literally lived the Black experience in America.

They can even explain why he wasn't around when the Kryptonians were attacking. Maybe he's gone into seclusion and wished to be left alone, and all was good until Raquel Ervin and her friends broke into his house disturbing his solitude. I'm saying, the potential for a great story is there.

Man, DC/WB been messin up big time these past few years. There ain't that many Black DC superheroes, but the ones we have are GREAT characters that deserve to shine. C'mon now.

As customized figures, yes they are out there. Actual releases from a company with a toy license, though? Nope. In fact hitting that website was inspired in part by doing an image search but only seeing customized figures of Icon showing up.

And my argument isn't that the execs don't know about Icon, it's that the public at large may not be as aware. If they made that tribute video then yes they know about him. But if their testing through polls or focus groups gets a lot of answers along the lines of "Who's that?" when Icon is mentioned, they're probably not going to be too enthusiastic about trying to make a movie about him.

And to be fair, the fact that they're considering doing a Superman story using the Calvin Ellis version shows a lot in how the environment has changed in that regard. Yes, it's the easy/safe choice and can easily be looked at with a cynical eye as pandering. But setting aside my own personal worries about how hit-and-miss DC has been with their movies, a good and well-received film using the Calvin Ellis Superman could help pave the way for an Icon film.

It stinks that that's the path that might have to be taken for an Icon film, but Superman is simply a better known character. It may be that it's just not quite time for Icon to take the spotlight yet.

As I stated in regards to John Stewart earlier in the thread -

Thank God that Dwayne McDuffie pushed to get HIM in the JLU.

John Stewart certainly wasn't a Well-Known quantity, either - despite being around since 1972.

And these "Focus Groups"? Who do they consist of? What are their ages? Ethnicities? Races? Additionally - what are THEIR experiences in regards to Race, Comics, History and culture?

No offense, Will - but many "Focus Groups and Polls" thought that the 2016 U.S. Election was going to be won by someone other than we all know who.......................

Unless DC Cinematic Universe takes a BOLD step (Like Marvel has) then they will continue to lag behind Marvel in regards to the Superhero Cinematic Universe.

And while I'm typing this Marvel is reportedly planning to bring none other than Blue Marvel to the Big Screen in some form or fashion.

So this will make Falcon, War Machine, Black Panther, Killmonger, Nick Fury, and FINALLY an "Alpha-Level" being in Blue Marvel brought to Marvel's Cinematic Universe.

Let's be HONEST, here - our OWN DC Universe Online has Vixen, John Stewart, Static, Fire, AND Cyborg - ALL in speaking and prominent roles in our fun game, here.

DC Cinematic Universe? Cyborg and the villain Black Manta.

And that Icon figure I posted? That is an official company that created him and they evidently have OTHERS, too

https://www.figurerealm.com/customfigure?action=creator&id=8716

We must stop hiding behind the false wall of "He or she isn't well known" label. It is a hollow statement.

Forgot all about Garth Ranzz, alongside Static in the LoSH content.

Not letting this go anytime soon, lol.

If WB needs an ACTOR to play Augustus Freeman IV / Icon look no further than THIS talented actor



In the comics Icon stops aging at 40 years so I'm certain that MBJ could play this role.

Additionally - MBJ would be PERFECT for the role of Augustus Freeman IV / Icon due to THIS movie



being that Augustus Freeman's Alter-Ego is that of a wealthy and high-powered Lawyer / attorney. He played a GREAT one is this classic and thought-provoking movie.

Need to use THE LEGAL SYSTEM to put Lex Luthor away for good? Michael B. Jordan as Augustus Freeman IV is YOUR MAN.

Some to play Raquel Ervin / Rocket?



Amandla Stenberg could be one.

There are SLEW of talented below-twenty actresses that could play Raquel Ervin / Rocket.

Another actress that could play Rocket:

First off, DC/WB simply needs to start making good super hero movies if they want to catch up to or overtake Marvel in the cinematic universe department, and they've got a long road ahead of them in that regard to begin with. Even the poor box office performers and lesser-liked Marvel films are still decent films in their own regard, but the same cannot be said for DC's offerings to date.

But Marvel's consistent success allowed them to explore the lesser-known parts of their universe and bring them to the forefront. Otherwise we probably wouldn't have had a film featuring a talking raccoon and a tree creature with a three-to-four word vocabulary that rocked the box office twice. They've got the standing to experiment and explore.

DC hasn't earned that yet, so for better or worse they've still got to rely on name recognition of their characters.

And yes, focus groups can be notoriously unreliable. From my understanding it was focus group feedback that brought about many of the changes that came with the NGE, but again for better or worse it is one of the tools relied upon by corporations.

As for the figure bit? Part of that is a weird carryover from a favorite super hero film of mine, The Specials. In that universe a super team knows they've made it when they get their own action figures/figure line so the whole toy thing always stands out to me. However, that link you provided? When it says "customfigure" in the link data, that usually means "unlicensed." From my research, DC has never released a licensed DC-approved Icon figure, even from their own in-house DC Direct line.

I get what you're saying here, but I really hope WB / DC isn't gauging the production of an "Icon and Rocket" movie simply on whether or not they have an action figure made for them.

That would be terrible.

And like I said before - if WB made that tribute to Dwayne McDuffie and Milestone Comics then I'm certain they know about Icon and Rocket.

It just smacks of Tokenism to slap an "S" on the chest of a character and call him Superman - and trust me - from the nearly dozen or so threads I've seen elsewhere on the Internet this is NOT going to end well.

Folks are angry - including ME.

There are SOME parts of "Wokeness" that I'd rather flush down the toilet but that's just MY opinion.

I forgot to name the 2nd talented actress that could play Raquel Irvin / Rocket. Her name is Eris Baker and she plays in "This is us" television series.

She is around 15 or 16 right now - which matches up perfectly with Raquel Irvin's age of 16.

Amandla Stenberg could play Raquel Irvin's best friend Darla



Darla took over for Raquel Irvin / Rocket when she became pregnant



Augustus Freeman IV / Icon basically shatters his "Ultra Conservative" image with Raquel Irvin when he told her that "whether or not she chose to keep the child was HER choice." She then proceeds to slap Freeman in anger because she WANTED him - at that time - to LECTURE her on the merits of being Pro-Life BUT "HE" - remembering his OWN wife's choice to not have THEIR baby - didn't want to restrict Raquel from making that choice for HERSELF.

Deep stuff - at least to ME.

Augustus Freeman didn't want to RISK his wife's well-being with a pregnancy being that his OWN DNA - even though he IS Human - could somehow cause complications with a potential child-birth.

I cannot find images of Freeman's and Raquel's interaction during this terse moment but it's in Icon# 7.



The baby is her boyfriend's. Icon ends up talking to him about becoming an involved parent in the latter issues of the comic.