I don't understand why is this such a taboo...

Elite instances should be locked for players who
- Had never run the regular (for elite) or elite (for e+) versions (maybe require players to run it at least 5 times for experience)
- Don't have minimum stats to complete the instance (not SP, stats)

A guy once tried to tank STe with dps build, and when I said he was not a real tank, he said "I always tank Mogo elite" - how are people supposed to know that Flashback elite is harder than Chapter elite?

A tank and me (healer) got paired with a bunch of DPS with low level arts who had no idea how AB works. We tried that stupid maze 3 times and got wiped because the person on the panels didn't know what they were doing and the constructs destroyed the tubes.

Why do people with low stats what to have access to stuff they can't complete? It only leads to frustration for everyone involved.

Also, I think it would be better to rename Elite as Hard, because I don't think people understand what Elite means. How can a person who just got in the game can look at the the word Elite and think "yeah, that's me"??

If that's too much for people, then allow weak players to run elite via Private Matchmaking only, just so they can see where they're getting into.

Not every run is guaranteed to succeed, I don't think you need to artifically gate keep content because the odd run ends in failure, it happens, sometimes.

It's best to just chalk it up to one of those things and move on to a different group and try again.

I never have such experience like this either as a tank or a dps, especially when we talk about the difficulty level of this recent contents. Maybe it’s also depends on your timezone, etc. But I guess you experienced that because you pugged Q. At least try LFG and it you’ll see a different world.
And nah, elite is really a correct word to use, because it perfectly suits the attitudes of the people who supposed to run them (according to your thoughts).

what are "low arts" in this scenario? What arts would have been sufficient?

What would the tank in question have needed to change in order to be able to tank the elite instance?

How are people supposed to know if they can complete it or not without ever having tried it?

Were you actually doing what you could to help the players in either event understand how to improve and salvage the instance run?

If you queue with a full group then its basically the same as private matchmaking.

If we're just haphazardly renaming things without giving people any idea what the developer recommendation is for stats and gear then does it really matter if the parenthetical difficulty is "hard" or "elite" instead of "unicorn" or "dragon"?

Elite is gatekeeping. Weaker players can't finish them. That's by design.

God, it really is a taboo.

First and foremost, I said enough stats to complete the raid, not to be good at it. The devs designed those instances with minimum stats in mind, they know how much is too weak for elite and elite plus.

Elite content naturally gatekeeps weak players from it, especially tanks and healers. They can't protect the team and make everyone wipe until people decide to leave the instance.

Why people don't complain about how CR gatekeeps players with low level CR from tier content? Oh right, because they know they wouldn't be able to beat the content anyway.

1. Good for you.
2. That means you're not weak for said content.
3. Even in preformed group that happens.
4. It's not about who should or shouldn't, it's about who's capable of running it. Does the sky gatekeeps penguins from flying? Or i'ts the penguins who weren't build to fly?
5. If pug isn't viable, then it shouldn't exist for elite.

That happens every week. I won't keep running the entire thing over and over just to get to the maze or Sinestro and find out the group can't do it. It's rare for me to even find a group that can get past through Atrocitus and Bleez, because they refuse to block, even when you tell them they have to. DPS meleeing the boss. Typical noobie behavior. I don't mind finding those people in regular content, because the chances of wiping are minimal compared to elite, so it's only a they problem. It bothers me when their problems become my problem, because there's nothing I can do about it except telling them what are the mechanics.

That raid takes ages and I have other things to do that doesn't involve running the same thing over and over again for no additional rewards. An alternative for locking elite is allowing us to collect rewards without having to pay for replay badges, even if it's just source marks. Is it elitist not wanting to waste my time getting caught on situations that could be avoided if devs cared about players' experience?

P.S. No one complained about the need to run regular to unlock elite, so I'm assuming you agree with me on that.

Weaker players can't finish, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be allowed to try.

It sounds like you're blind PUGing in LFG, that's also especially bad if you're trying to get it done at what is the very tail end of an episodes relevancy.

I would encourage you to find a league that regularly runs elite content and/or network with other players in this game.

Game has no progress restrictions. There should be something in play to have you play something so many times or something like that. As far as having the right gear on, well, that’s an entirely different thing. But I suppose my rebuttal is to just have a good league or friends or just inspect players invited into a group to see if they actually have white mods inserted. And don’t we have that initial episode thingy now that takes us through the literal mechanics???

But even that can be non-helpful as my lowest alt in the 475cr range with like 200sp with a regular loadout and still be top dps in the new raids. Granted I have 4 wolves equipped, but still, it’s crazy. There are just too many variables to consider some viable solution to the “must have white mods, arts above 80, so many sp, non-rainbow origin mods” as someone could play without those and be better than someone who is maxed out on everything.

As others have already mentioned the main argument would be too subjective to implement, there are too many variables there. Especially nowadays with how much gameplay related stuff you can buy. At times i've seen some of the more max geared damage dealers are also some of the more incompetent/lazy players mechanic-wise i've seen (as you said even in pre-made groups it happens). Also funny enough, at least on EU i think the elite running crowd itself would find the run regular before elite more annoying than the people that rule would be aimed at, because of new content drops and people wanting to go straight into Elite is quite common among those groups.

What i will support is the Elite name change to Hard, which i've always been supportive of. Elite has always sounded pretentious to me and it imo keeps the ''this content should be for the 1-5%'' argument alive for some people.

The game needs a relaunch dcuo doesn't know how to value your time. it's still using a mark system which was meant for the old school vision for the game. which wasn't just a pve mmorpg it used both modes. They didn't just come out with pve content and allow for players to get bored from giving them to much of one mode.

Unfortunately dcuo has alot of changes that are due and time is not on their side. so much has changed and bad blood has been added to the game like arts and allies. limiting you has a player leaves an open feeling of being exploited as a gamer. because you have to many choices with arts and allies you can't wear.

You invest into an art or ally and a new one comes out it doesn't make any sense at all what a dumb idea this whole thing is.

Make it make sense lmao then people won't have such a problem in content

Ladies and gentleman, the average DCUO player keeps their exits gated, not their entrances.

That's not how gatekeeping works for rational, logical humans.

I for sure have had awful times in elites. I am usually a healer as my DPS has little to no artifacts as ive focused fully on healer, so i run Clarion, Fang, Trans, Strat and whatever else i can get my hands on. That said, my damage isnt bad IF i have to be dps.

I get put into lobbies sometimes with healers with no artifacts or game knowledge, even to the point i had someone complaining i use Trans card as a healer and "its useless" for healers.

I ran ABE+ as a dps, a healer was already there demanding they were to heal.
First red flag: CR was entry level to the DLC.
We load into the content. I inspect the healer as i know some healers havent played in a while but have artifacts to keep them relevant.
Second red flag: User was running Gem of Horus at 120 and no other artifacts to even level 80, granting no benefits at all
I let them heal, gave them the benefit of the doubt but let my group know of the situation. I assume they were all friends because i was met with backlash after saying "healer is low level and no artifacts".
We get to first boss of ABE+. Healer dies instantly to something extremely avoidable with using either a shield or having more stats
Third red flag: Died instantly, forcing me to heal
We complete the boss and i try to kick the healer. They all declined so i left the group because i am not going to carry someone undeserving in E+ content when they have no gear, no artifacts, no skill and are in general rude.
About 5mins later i get a DM from one of the players in the instance asking me to come back, i asked if the healer was still there, no reply.
I go about looking for another group and while doing them im ninja invited by the person DMing me. I decline and add the person to ignore list.
2 minutes later, i see the same healer in LFG ranting about why they were kicked and targeting people, calling them names

This sort of situation has happened to me 3 times now, not exactly this situation, but the constant ignorance of having no gear, no skill and expecting to be carried by everyone in what is supposed to be the hardest content.

I have a suggestion on what would make things better. Back in the day, elite content REQUIRED you to complete normal mode in the week before to unlock elite for that week. I say bring that back but change it to Elite needing to be complete the week before to unlock elite+ after. Give E+ slightly more rewards and call it a day. That way it forces all these players with no skill or artifacts to complete elite modes consistently to unlock the content they want, hopefully teaching them a thing or 2.
This doesnt fix the problem but sure does slow it down. Do i want 200sp, no artifact, no skill players in elite+ where they know they will be doing nothing and expecting a full carry? no. No i do not, i kick them at every opportunity i can but you cant just deny content to those who are bad at the game, even though we should.

It was a terrible idea back then. And its a terrible idea now.

We all know that if Devs do this again it will be badly received. Everyone will complain and scream "greedy devs forcing us to use Replay Badges..." and stuff like that.

Kinda ends right there, then, doesn't it?

If the devs have at the very least a range where they figure a player could complete the raid (not guaranteed to finish, mind you, but could finish) and set the CR entry bar to reflect that, it's kind of a "done and done" situation. Especially since a good chunk of player stats come from gear, which determines CR. Add in the detail that player ability can and does at times count for more than raw stats in this game, and the argument becomes tougher, I think.

You may not exactly agree where the devs have determined the entry bar should be set, but they have set it, likely knowing how much is too weak for elite and elite plus.

I don't understand what would be the point of some arbitrary requirements. If there are "minimum stats required to complete E/E+ content" - they're much lower than people imagine and they're dependent on powerset, build, artifacts, skill, et cetera. Besides - one, or two good players, who know what they're doing can carry a whole group of "weak" ones through most Elite content - especially considering how easy it has been recently. As an EU player, who blindly queues most of my runs, I'd rather do that, rather than wait for hours until the game decides that the group is good enough.

If you queue Elite by yourself - you take your chances. If you know the game enough, you can see whether the group has a chance of completing the instance within a minute - just leave and requeue, if it's not up to your standard. Or LFG a group - it shouldn't be too difficult for a hero on USPC/PS server. If you blindly queue E+ content - you're out of your mind and should just accept, that you're not going to finish it that way. Experienced players who are good enough tend to have friends/league to run it with and those who have to rely on matchmaking system to find them a group for the most challenging content are simply not ready for it.

On the past we had this... Like u need to do reg b4 elite.

They removed it for some reason.

Also if u struggle with groups prob because u dont used LFG for it...

When i use its very hard to find a tank like that...

No problem running it any of those weeks.

It can be frustrating but you really thing these bad/weak players haven't already been carried through the normal version without knowing what to do?

It annoys me during the Atrocitus fight that people rarely switch to Bleez when she spawns, even though she revives Atrocitus. The maze used to annoy me, so I took the matter into my own hands and now I do the controls and haven't failed once since (obv helps that typically people have better gear by this point).

I don't like to form groups, I think it's impractical - when pug works, it's much more practical. And, as I said earlier, if pug isn't viable for elite, it shouldn't exist for elite.

So why are people ok with CR-locked tiers?