Test Discussion GU97: Weapon Combat Update

Discussion in 'Testing Feedback' started by DCAutymn, Aug 22, 2019.

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  1. Aggro Well-Known Player

    You have 11 weapons and your trying to balance all of them, to be able to use in raids etc, but you can't cus it's inconvenient cus majority of these weapons rather buffed/nerfed, it wouldnt make a difference because it just won't work a good example on live server

    Martial Arts into Hand Blaster Uppercut Mastery... last tick hits for 150k high single target can't use it on a boss because it's melee, everyone i know knows that so is opted out off raids completely for flurry that's why these weapons show themselfs in raid/sm settings to begin with.. sure op but convenient so regardless you won't see these weapons hit raids, regardless of wat changes you make
    • Like x 1
  2. CrescentMoon Well-Known Player

    Wolf Form's 3tap hold combo (Double Slash) I think seems to be hitting for 1/3rd or 1/4th of what it should be. 2tap hold was like 5.?K damage, 3tap hold did like 2.?K which is the same as a regular tap roughly. 4tap hold went back up to 10K so I would assume 3tap would be between 5 and 10k. 4TapHold is parsing competitive but having 3Tap would potentially be a better rotation for faster clips. Gorilla form seems to be slightly under smokebomb parsing. I'd increase the damage of the combos by 20% and it should put the total parses where the rest of the "normal" hybrid/wm combos are parsing rn.
  3. CrescentMoon Well-Known Player

    No idea why ice elemental is being compared to wolf and gorilla. It's a temporary supercharge that doesn't even last long enough to do a 30s parse and wouldn't be sustained until you had a gemini battery because it's a 50% cost, it's on buffed damage so we can't even compare it to normal combos, and you can't have most movement speed powers inside of it which makes it not ideal.
    • Like x 1
  4. lllStrichcodelll ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    That is the next step. First balance Weapons. Then realise it doesnt work out. Then rework weapon Combos completely (coming up 2021)

    but since it will take a few years until then, its not related to my initial Question ;)
  5. lllStrichcodelll ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    it should be looked at... but... when Avair is coming up with his Supercharge Revamp. Not now.
    • Like x 1
  6. Millefune PSN Well-Known Player

    Hi, Testers! Would someone be a dear, and post a summary of how much weapons have changed? Are there any more weapons that are now "viable?" I always just used what was most flavorful to a character theme, and am hoping that they'll be more effective in helping take down adds and bosses. Also, is Precision DPS dead? Like are the forums going to be vice-versa of when the Might DPSers cried about not being able to "compete" with Precision DPSers? I hope they're both as "balanced" as everyone says they want them to be.
  7. CrappyHeals Devoted Player

    Can we get the splitting on rifle grenade (tap range) corrected. In revamp it was changed to split after one target and that really brings down the utility of it.
  8. Illumin411 Loyal Player

    There was another thread where myself and someone else were discussing melee combos and we had similar ideas, that perhaps melee combos should grant a defense buff upon successful completion, or something like that. That could make them viable in raids, even elite raids.
  9. Riddim7 Active Player

    When i read this i LOLed so much. What you wrote is just totaly dumb, and sad thing is that like that whole this "balancing" will lead to even bigger unbalancing

    1. When you dont looking on bigger picture/dont comparing to superpowers when you adjusting weapons, you just missing the point why this adjusting was needed in first place. So when you saying that eliminating bugs is more important i must say that you are wrong. Fixing weapons bugs is the same important as comparing adjusted combos to other superpower. Other way after tweaking weapons you will get unbalancing versus superpowers, and whole adjusting would be waste of time because you will need to adjust it again to superpowers to balance game.

    2. Maybe you missed the point of tweaking weapon combos since you dont care about what results of those combos will be looking on scoreboard. Point of balancing weapons is so they be egaually to other playstyles, and if they wont be, whole that tweking would be pointless if wont be done two ways - comparing combos to combos, and combos to superpowers.
  10. CrescentMoon Well-Known Player

    Based on your comments, you're not a tester. I have more important things like dealing with a Category 5 hurricane possibly interrupting my testing for a short time and finalizing weapon standards with Crappy, Obsidian, and Memz than to explain to a non-tester testing protocol. If you want to get a lecture on how wrong your comment is, Obsidian's DM's are open, and i'm sure he'll be happy to explain to you how things work after he finishes giving feedback on the elite raids.
    • Like x 1
  11. CrescentMoon Well-Known Player

    Currently, assuming we can get the Cog passive to apply to hybrid combos, WM and Hybrid dps will both still be very competitive. I've been testing at close to live server end game stats where precision is 26500-27100'ish. Currently, the standing is (with my cog, tetra, and power dump buff from a troll, in a competitive loadout setting on 3 targets):
    1H FlipSlash: 53-57k, occasional 60k (due small nerf from flipslash bug)
    1H Flurry: 55-60k (might get a small nerf to this for balance reasons compared to the other weapons, have to see where bug fixes land them)
    Brawling 3TapHold: 47-55k(getting a small buff when the hold combo bug is fixed)
    Brawling 3TapHoldHold: 60-65 (getting a decent nerf when the 2nd hold combo bug is fixed)
    2H Clobber: 50-60k (due a very small nerf from tap melee's being bugged)
    Bow Arrow Fling: 47-57k , occasional 60k
    Bow Smokebomb Mastery: 52-57k mostly, occasional dip down and up
    MA Spinning Punch: 55-63k (due a decent nerf when spinning punch bug is fixed)
    MA Smokebomb: 50-63k
    Dual Wield 3TapHold: 50-59k
    2H Home Run: 44-51k (decent considering the first hold melee is single target)

    Dual Pistols Sweep Shot, Rifle Flurry Mastery, One Handed Stunning Swipe Mastery, and Brawling Doom Spin Mastery are severely bugged and producing unintended damage but they should eventually be added to the list as well as Two Handed Mega Smash once the scaling of it has been increased.

    For Ranged AoE, I'm parsing 40-50k with:
    various HB Solar Flame rotations (due for a small nerf but should still be 40k+)
    DW Explosive Shot Mastery
    Handblasters Explosive Shot mastery
    2H Arrow Storm Mastery
    Shield Magnum Round Mastery

    And I can reach 35k+ with just spamming Bow->Arrow Storm for those who want the simplest but efficient ranged dps as well as support roles who might be using Bow for power regen but want to contribute damage at points.

    For Single Target, it's still Dual Wield->Flurry. Brawling Enhanced Shuriken and Bow-Flurry(reg) could be buffed to be up there as well but they need a ~20-30% damage increase to be parsing in the 25-28k range reg, 30-33k'ish buffed up.

    Biggest hurdle is just getting the Cog of Mageddon to proc hybrid combos. Opens up dps choices extremely and hybrid dps is back and competitive with weapon mastery.
    • Like x 2
  12. CrescentMoon Well-Known Player

    Not sure what all you're reviewing but wanted to state anyway just in case: Went and used the dcuo log analyzer to estimate the nerf needed for the following to be in the same area as the rest of the weapon combos I was testing previously mentioned in the thread:

    Dual Pistols Sweep Mastery - needs to be hitting for ~1/3rd of the currently bugged mastery combo
    Brawling Doom Spin Mastery -needs to be nerfed by 30% of its current damage
    Rifle Flurry Mastery - needs to be nerfed to 1/2 of its current damage
    One Handed Stunning Swipe Mastery - needs to be nerfed by 1/2 of its current damage
  13. POWERCORE New Player

    Can someone please tell me what regular HB SCISSOR KICK is hitting for on test? please
  14. Great Architect Loyal Player

    Because this is a Weapons balance parse, not a DPS balance parse. Once Weapon Combos are relatively balanced (i.e. they behave in the way you would expect them to - with comparable combos doing comparable damage, based on length of combo, and relative risk to using the combo) then DPS as a whole can be looked at from known baselines. At the moment, that is not the case.
    • Like x 3
  15. CrescentMoon Well-Known Player

    Hitting poorly. I think Staff Focused Spin (w/ sorc) was the best hybrid combo I parsed so far where I can still break 25-31 depending on crits buffed up, which is slightly below flurry wm but still. Bow Flurry and HB Scissor Kick (using acro moves) are like 22-23 top end with occasional dips down to 18-19k. End combos would need to be doubled in damage for them to be competitive to most might based powers done correctly. Although we're still waiting on an official response on where they want these mixed combos that are ST and AoE to perform at. Everything I've said up to this point in the thread in terms of some of the different factors that go into how weapons perform have been based on things either said by a dev in a thread during original stats revamp testing or were in patch notes as explanations for a change, but intended behavior and intended results are technically different.
  16. stärnbock Devoted Player

    when compairing brawling with dual wield, the damage of the ranged attacks were easy compairable:
    on single target, i got somewhere around 70'000 for both shuriken mastery and the flurry shot mastery
    however: the damage of shuriken storm was 90'000 on multiple targets, bow into explosive shot 130'000
    in my opinion, shuriken storm needs a huge buff for being in line to other ranged multies, it is just to weak.
    • Like x 2
  17. stärnbock Devoted Player

    while HB scissor kick hits multiple targets,
    the same attacks variant hits only one target,
    performed in LPVE training room with HB legends.
    the animations however often show multiple projectiles.
  18. CrescentMoon Well-Known Player

    Shuriken Storm can be sped up/clipped more in a hybrid loadout than Dual Wield Explosive Shot. It's already beating it in that situation.
  19. CrescentMoon Well-Known Player

    Non-traditional weapon masteries that are technically bugged and doing double on the WM ticks I think:
    Rifle Slip Shot Mastery
    Staff tap melee, hold melee, hold melee, hold range WM combo (doing 1 iteration of hold melee is fine, just the 2nd tier)

    DP Ultra Flurry Mastery I think is the opposite spectrum of the Bow->Full Auto decimal mistake. Might be a 5x or 10x damage increase intended because rn it's barely matching tap damage.

    Two Handed's Flurry Mastery on single target:
    1st hold - ~9k damage
    2nd hold - ~16k damage
    3rd hold - ~18k damage
    WM - ~28k damage

    Given the non-clippability of the WM, single target aspect, and the animation time, it should be hitting harder than just 2 single/aoe holds that are clippable.
  20. Predicament Well-Known Player

    What were your numbers of Single Target Enhanced Shuriken Mastery vs DW Bow Flurry mastery single target
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