Dev Discussion GU111: Survival Mode Season 2

Correction: 4/5 tank powers*

Im not against kiting, its actually fun, but dodge or die is also not the right way to go.

Fixing that issue went like amputating a broken leg rather than give it a proper treatment tho. It was the easiest way to fix it, but not the ideal way. Obviously abusing exploits will always be a thing when theres something at stake, like finishing SM. Not defending anything like that ofc.

Agree, it is easier overall, because we knew most mechanics already from season 1. Just the 2 rounds with the bosses mentioned above are beyond difficult/annoying. Also, just because it has been a tank based endgame in high rounds doesnt mean it has to be this seasion or next. A Troll able to stun statues at zeus is basically the way to go, turning it into an - all role SM - and not into a Tank based one. Idk if the troll is able to stun the statues at Zeus in R30, but i hope so. Its also possible with 1 Tank, so i wont complain too much about the Tank focus in SM. Its just more risk.

one more time i say something to this event guys and now listin and linstin close games are made to have fun made to be challanged right but not made to be work and thats what u get here if u dont got the sp high enough idk what some of u guys think this is gonna be here and esports event ? did we get paid for our (work) in this game no we didnt so why we should do challagensliek this it only separte our gamers more and more bcs of some say we are the best and u are the worst i think u got enough trouble in life so u dont need this way in games too if u think its ok to block rewards for ppl that are not as good as u something terrible go wrong without all this guys who play here this game wouldnt exist anymore i dont know since witch day a game was made to separte ppl but we got now exact this point thx daybreak it not should be a search for the player who got the most sp or anything it should be a search for player who are ready to help noobs but let me tell u guys one point u are that kind of selffish now that u dont see anymore that some of u was noobs someday too and now u happy to say im better than all other? we got enough trouble with things like corona but no not enough taht we can be mutch social in real life now no we get separate in diffrend classes here to thats just a shame and nos kick me for telling u the truth bcs im sick of that kind of acting

It's an Event made for whoever wants a challenge, if you want to just que in and out you still got the Stabilizer Duo I guess.

You really need to accept that you cannot get everything. Attacking the developers because you can't have everything is not the way to go.

SM is meant to feel unbeatable please don’t change anything. Elite raids already get nerfed within 2 weeks because players claim something is to hard.

i accept it better say i dont give a **** of games like this anymore but hey someday u get something u want im sure about that its really easy to say u cant get everything fine u donnt wait since release for some henchmen of mr freeze sure now the in i can never get it mhm is not the problem of the dev no its my fault that i trusted that company and sry but yh its only this stuff this guys block from iconics atm ever other stuff is just easy to get no u got right i should thant daybreak for destroy my hopes of fairness finally

This is something the guy’s been waiting for years to get. Now suddenly he’s told he’s got a tiny window of a month to do some of the game’s hardest content or it’s gone forever, and you don’t see why he’s angry? I agree he’s not expressing himself too well, and Imma try my darnedest to help him get it done via PM, but come on.

We get it. I even feel for him and I'm the type that doesn't care about any of this stuff. He really wants it. The point everyone is trying to make is that no matter what the devs put in here, someone would have a problem with it. Right now, sorry to say this, what they chose to use is upsetting 1 player. That means they chose very well. Hopefully some players can help him get what he clearly really wants but the player base reallllllllly needs to cut this out before they just stop giving out rewards for anything and make everything lame and bland

That’s not entirely true though, is it? Maybe if there was another guy complaining about the Source Eagle, another complaining about the back lightning bolt, I’d see the point. But they could 100% add rewards for this that wouldn’t put anyone out.

sry but now i wanna react on this u talk about help in dcuo? come on u cant be seriouse i mean do me a fav do the lfg chat and say u are not part of the op elite gamers they ignore u trust me i tryred this is just for a lets say smaller group of gamers who worde years together and reach alot together sure they should get challanges butz not on the back of every other underdog i was sometimes 1st in the list of most dps in one round ( older dlcs) but who cares now about this now u reach anything or u get nothing and thats a fact our artifacts need to be payed or we play a lottery witch time we breaktrough the feats well i did nearly all i can do alone without the styles and pvp i spend many money to get replay marks to reset an feat like the arkham bounty were u get a random style and hope u get the complette set someday yh that speaks for feats if u dont got months or years to do all u dont get any chance to close up with other guys im not a noob or a guy who needs normaly help to reach what i want but now this all didnt count now u have to hope that some gamers say hey help him ....and witch league of pros will do that? they all see one team hher own i was help up new guys in the past tell him how that game works bcs our so called devs didnt give alongtime a good tourtial and even if they do this game is english the other leangues are nearly die out her otherwise i would be in a GERMAN forum and not here anyway the point is simple u have to stay on your own to legs otherwise if u do a mistake in any mission all fall over u and call u a noob yes thats fun and thats why i hate that we forced to play with such guys now dont tell me this isnt the fault of daybreak or u live in a diffrend world or be totally blind guys who dont spend her life to this game dont get the same chances

and now its ok im done here thanks to 9001BPM for the help but it wont help u cant talk with guys who dont listin u cant show someone something who dont wanna see the truth be happy with your broken game im out here for now i dont take this i say it before and i say it again we all pay for dc not just some elite gamers we all should get the same chances to earn our stuff but this truns in to a 2 class game if u very need to show up show mutch that u guys be better that u dont care how that hurts underdogs i cant help u anymore

oh and mepps wsend ypur next warning here that we all see it that we all see that if guys say what they think they can get banned

send your*

one thing i was thinking about....an normal raid give u a normal gear an elite raid a enchanced gear ....why daybreaknot simply says ok we do this for survival mode to one version for all and one for you elite guys i dont got a problem if my henchman in that case would be abit weaker as the one u may earn in a elite version i mean thats logical the best option for all i think

It has nothing to do with difficulty in the way you're suggesting. DCUO's counter mechanics, ie. the mechanics around which 8/10 bosses were designed and balanced, are the single most foundational element of the game's entire combat system. It's Rock Paper Scissors. Block beats and protects against Lunge, Block-Break beats Block, Lunge beats and protects against Block-Break, some powers, & punishes Rolling, Rolling protects against projectiles and area-denial attacks while zoning. Removing one of those elements from the game is like playing Rock Paper Scissors without "Rock" and creates a pointless, arbitrary experience. It makes the SM bosses' BBs functionally indistinguishable from having a massive, invisible, unpreventable damage source randomly hit the tank out of nowhere from time to time (if they aren't cheesing)... which is terrible design that promotes ignoring the game's most basic combat systems in lieu of straight running out of range and/or cheesing.

Rolling around to sit in a dodge state with the express intent of completely negating all damage in PvE is no less of a cheesy exploit than lunging around to do the same was... especially when only one tank power has a kit that lets them consistently do that at no increased risk. It's not actually fighting/tanking the bosses and it can barely be considered to be playing the game in that it intentionally ignores the combat system in its entirety. That's how we end up with people at high rounds who don't even know that the counter system exists or understand how it works. "Hard" is mastering the PvP counter behaviour of 10 different bosses to the point you can go an extended period without a mistake. "Press a button and roll around" is not "hard." There's no prestige in content that doesn't have a working combat system... Especially when 4/5 tank powers require active participation in that combat system and 8/10ths of that content was designed and balanced around the concept of a working combat system.

This needs to be fixed because it undercuts the value of SM and turns it into a straight up cheese-fest, even for the kind of people who didn't use the lunge exploit last time.

As someone who consider herself Casual Player, I attempt survival mode on Friday with friends. I wasn't ready with my gemini at 200 so I was at disadvantage and couldn't be much of a help with supercharge spam, but I used my regular loadout and artifacts and we got through to round 14. I had to leave after, hoping to attempt again soon. It felt challenging and at the same time I didn't have to break my head against the wall in impossible situations. Last season I did only 9 rounds but wasn't nearly as better as I am today.
I am not the most perfect or good healer out there, but I feel like I got to experience, enjoy, and learn all at the same time. I got my hands on some rewards, thinking of getting a few more. I've already put the trophies in my base with Season 1 ones so I can be proud of the progress I made. I found harder content, even more than elite, SM, to be much fun and challenging.

I like the Zeus themed style items (I really really hate Zeus though thanks to Greek Mythology lol).
I never ran FGSE [YET] so I had so much fun beating round 10. It was probably one of the easiest for some, but to me it was a great challenge that heck, even regular mode could use. (The roles on effigies). Freeze took a few moments to understand (group wiped) but when we got back in we beat it no problem. Just needed to understand where to stand. I am hoping future SM can have completely new bosses. I want to fight against the big bad and good like Wonder Woman, Circe, Batman, Joker, Superman, Professor Zoom, Flash, Hal Jordan, Sinestro, etc. It will be pretty epic.

Not sure this would be related but Tala in Shattered Gotham can't be lunged anymore. Feel like it's related to what everyone is saying about tank mechanic changes

There's something I'd really like to understand in the developers' logic, we're told that the DM is available from CR 310 onwards, okay, but I'd have to be told why bosses do twice the damage than the available CR, and even when everyone executes the boss strats correctly, I want to believe it's a SM, but still, for example, my tank is CR 326 and yet, as soon as I get in front of the minotaur, it's really hard for me to hold on to his attacks, no, skull, it's not normal, with savage the balance is correct, but the minotaur, it's unplayable. ..

Also I want to add an extra note about the artifacts in this game which has become too discriminating, I hope everyone sees this now with the SM, I don't find the idea of artifacts so bad, just that artifacts have taken on too much importance in the game and it's a real shame!

Just for "fun" (not realy fun...), today I did a small (ha, ha, ha, probably 4-5 hours) experiment.
I got into the queue (not the LFG, but the queue), somewhere around 7 am (I used my alt tank (fire) for this purpose). It took about 20-30 minutes until I was able to get into the SM. During these hours a lot of people changed: someone died 10 times, someone left after the first vipe, in general I managed to reach the 5th round.
What have I learned? I found out that people are damn impatient (it took a lot left after the first vipe, many left even if they were successful 4! rounds (without saying anything)), I also found out that Baron and Joni can be made a solo, which can fail for textures from the Minotaur charge , and also that the lunge is broken again... only now in the other direction (oh yes, the first 4 rounds, not a single boss requires a kite (only manta bombs must be left, but this is not a kite).