GU 41: PvP Season 3 Feedback

I feel pretty confident in saying that the PvP community would be very grateful for this.

Every movement mode has at least one escape skill so I think it'd make sense to give every movement mode a grounding skill as well. (For those that don't know, Swoop attack, Backflip, and Dash Attack all allow you to go to fast movement mode immediately after use.) Perhaps you could consider making Dash Attack a normal tray ability instead of a supercharge too?

A quick question about this.

Does this change the way tank/controller/healer shields work?

The way I could interpret the 25%-changes could be:

- over X seconds 25% total damage is prevented
- over X seconds 25% damage will be prevented until Y damage is prevented. Y= max Dominance + max Restoration
- over X seconds damage will be prevented until 25% of Y damage is prevented- Y= max Dominance + max Restoration.

If I had to take a guess I'd say it's option two. However I dislike the fact that DPS also have a reasonable amount of restoration and dominance (even though this isn't doubled).
But in the end that way controllers and tanks might profit from this most I guess.

I'd appreciate an answer from someone who's more into this stuff than me

Some bugs or annoyances I've seen:

1. As others have pointed out, you still receive a large amount of damage if you block the HB Haymaker WM. I tried blocking it and I was receiving as much damage from blocking it as I was from not blocking the attack.

2. EMP->Distract is producing two ticks of damage: one small, one large. Here are some numbers I saw: 750+4594, 723+3993, 714+4874. The PvE version of that combo doesn't produce two ticks of damage.

3. My chest style changes whenever I exit a scrimmage.
I start with this:
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If I queue up for a 1vs1 scrimmage and exit out, I end up wearing the Imperal Colonist chest piece:

What I also forgot to ask and might have missed, if allready answered:
Will hometurf-mods and trinkets still work in PVP, or will they be turned off aswell?

Some other concerns I have:

(1) The defense debuff removes 704 toughness out of 11,000 toughness. It basically does nothing.

(2) Using a tray ability like Briar or EMP to blockbreak someone does not award you immunity. The vulnerability windows are also really short, making them difficult to counter. I'd still prefer that these abilities not blockbreak because it creates scenarios where you can interrupt and BB simultaneously, and it's really annoying having a vulnerability window just because I used Vinelash followed by Briar.

(3) I noticed that you can no longer acquire immunity from someone who already has immunity. I know that some people wanted this (Clutch in particular), but I'd strongly ask you to reconsider.

I really hated this in the past because there were a lot of situations where I correctly block broke someone, but my teammate incorrectly finished their combo at the same time or a split second sooner. This resulted in my opponent getting immunity from both my teammate and subsequently me. This really discouraged team fights and solo queuing for me in the past.

I can't control what my teammates do so I'd hate being punished for their mistakes. I can only control my actions so I like that on the live server I would have been awarded immunity in the scenario above. It makes it so I'm at least not afraid to try and BB because I know I'll gain immunity as long as I BBed within the block window.

Yes, this creates situations where everyone can have immunity and that's a problem. For that reason, I'd prefer it if immunity duration did not stack so you can't have situations where someone just has immunity for 10+ seconds.

Block damage (ie the damage you receive when you successfully block) is quite unreasonable imo, many debuffs seem pretty ineffective, overall I think combat is really feeling rather sterile and sanitised which is not a good thing.... more than ever I get impression its just a game of rock/paper/scissors.

Reduction of duration fire dots makes many powers redundant there aren't many options for burst damage in that tree so it feels heavily compromised (I'm sure its not alone but as ever why does precision based combat continue to get all the love).

I think the impact of equipment has had too much reduction in import.....we need an incentive to earn it - although I haven't pvp'ed in the equipment myself, it worries me seeing videos surfacing of ungeared players laying waste to other players/devs (who while not great pvpers must be upper tier) fully geared really undermines a sense of progression.

While I am happy to see the back of HT mods in pvp, the loss of utility belts and associated consumables does reduce variety in what you can bring to the table.....battle strategy sometimes to combat the fact you are more subject to lag that your opponents is important and those peripheral buffs are going to be missed (perhaps ensure they can be used in an either or situation with sodas yet keep them on the belt for optional use etc).

I understand that Armories has paved the way for some of us to switch to this entirely specified armour set as we now have 3 entirely different scenarios pve, pvp open-world, pvp arenas...4 armouries aren't enough if you want to mix a dps + support role any more, alternatively infinite sodas and pvp trinkets need to be do 'something' in openworld. Equally for those f2p a single armoury is neither use nor ornament, two should be provided as a minimum imo and that is doubly important given this approach to arena participation.

i think they should let us use dmg consumables, trinkets and utility belts. Even tho i like fighting barebones i still like the option to use belt etc

Yeah the AM counters need to be mutually exclusive of being vulnerable to block, I realize I forgot to add that. Basically you won't be able to get the block breaking effect while you're blockable. We'll make sure Malediction, Benediction and Remorseless Recovery are where they should be and get block back to actually reducing damage in PvP.

Thanks for the help Karasawa!

After thinking about it over the weekend, I'm leaning toward adding a grounding effect to a few of the movement powers.

All players also have access to Iconic Powers.
It could be useful to add a grounding effect to Iconic Powers like Batarang Multi-Shot and Sonic Cry in addition to having a few grounding movement powers.

Lasso grounds

Yes but not long enough to make a difference. You get it hit by it, you break out, and then the ground effect is done. It's literally that quick. The grounding effects need last a minimum of 3-5 seconds. Ideally, I think 10-15 seconds would be the best, considering how expensive it is to cast powers now. Or they could make it so inertial flywheel can no longer be used in PvP during combat, since that is the main reason Super Speed is so great at escaping in PvP during combat.

@Tunso

A few questions for you...

1) Since you will be adding grounding effects, any chance of making them 10-15 seconds due to the cost of power to cast currently?

2) Any chance that you guys can take a look at Super Speeds inertial flywheel in combat? Seriously, that one ability is the reason Super Speed excels at getting away and kiting around in PvP Arenas. No other travel power has the ability to run away during combat like this movement mode. If not, then can you guys look into increasing the speed of Flight and Acro to match the speed of a Speedster utilizing intertidal flywheel to escape?

3) If possible, can you tell us if Safehouse Rescue is in fact coming back to the rotation in GU41 or not?

Thanks in advance. Please keep up the great work. This update is amazing so far.

#1 10-15 seconds would be an eternity. We're thinking more like standardizing them to more like three seconds max. It looks like only Flight was missing a grounding ability between the Movement and Iconic trees.

#2 I talked with our engineers and they were able to fix the core issue with Inertial Flywheel that allowed them to break combat slowdown speeds by jumping. So that unfair advantage will finally be fixed.

#3 Safehouse rescue is fixed and ready but due to the rotation schedule it wasn't going to be turned on for a while. We're changing that so it should be active when GU 41 goes live and on test in a future build.

Hey Tunso, did you by chance see the post I made earlier? Any thoughts?

Fair enough. Thanks for getting flywheel fixed, and thanks for the update on Safehouse Rescue. I also agree that grounding for 10-15 seconds was extreme, but I was only thinking that time frame because of how good flywheel was in PvP, but now that it is fixed, or will be, I feel 3 seconds is perfect. Thanks again Tunso, will the news of safe house rescue, I can finally "beat the game" at least temporarily.

Today we did another 3x 5sv5s scrim with different setups, now with the new gear.
We decided to go with PS setup and PC setups to test and provide a more accurate feedback. Also we tested some powersets and after the scrims we had feedback from people in both teams and here are the conclusions we could get after testing.

Here is the 1st video from my POV. I had to put the video at 2x speed since the lag on my end was really bad to the point i couldn´t complete my combos. But you can see how the power & heals feel in a match..



Directly from everyone in our teams:

Powers in both teams now fully geared, was not an issue at all. Powers with full vit mods have their vit raised to 3k vitalization. (Maybe a little more due skill points).Our trollers in test had 145ish skill points, so this definetely can be increased.

Skill do matters: Now the game evolves with the use of WM. Taking advantages of the WM and their capabilities properly clipped into beneficial powers really improves team performance and power usage. The same happens if you are used to clip 2 or 3 beneficial powers.

With the new changes to controller classes, they lose their vitalization bonus in role. So this affects more USPC setups than PS. Now, the only benefit of having a power class / offensive controller is strictly debuffs, since power back from a dps is similar than in controller stance. (In USPC we used to take advantage of this, because 1 tank can just debuff consistently 1 troller at a time, leaving the 2nd one pretty much with the vit /bonus untouched).

Controllers debuffs feel still by times inconsistent, but we are aware in a 5vs5 scenario, lots of LoS issues can happen. We´ll do more testing tomorrow.

Same case for cleanses, and cleanses should not be affected by LOS of enemy players, but by LOS from in game structures.

With the implementation of AM mechanics, dps can get power back from different rotations. This helps BIG TIME to dps classes. The only problem i see here, is more about limitations of each powersets to use AM. For example, Gadgets has an easier time just using distract into EMP, than fire trying to pull a mass detonation.

About grounding, we note is now 3 seconds, which is fine. In all honestly we while the changes are beneficial, at least in our league we are used to mitigate damage with close formations. Other teams like to jump around although. So even when the changes are in test, i can´t give a proper feedback about it. But one thing i´ll say, i think controller classes (quantum, hl, gadgets and mental) should have their healing debuffed complimented by grounding effect. - This is a suggestion that our team agreed, adds more cc capabilities in a match, beyond the debuffs and restoring power .

One really important thing is that pets are still dying really fast, only with AOEs. Maybe include an additional toughness with the pvp gear can fix it.

Tomorrow we´ll post the other 3 scrims (i wasn´t there since the lag was pretty bad for me) so you can have an idea how the power is actually good.

In the previous testing we did, we realize we had combined gear. Some had vengeance gear (cr99 now) and some went right away with the "entry level" stats. If am not wrong, this means the difference in CR, provides a bigger power disparity (usage vs power restoration) for having higher CR than the rest of the team (The way power cost scales with CR).

One question, we´ve noticed "negative" stats when we enter a match. Is there a cap on stats?

Also, we noticed sometimes in test server, outside of arenas beneficial powers won´t hit 1 person in the group.

constantly getting interrupted when casting emp>distract or stealth>emp