For those who think the sky is falling

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by coldchilln88, Feb 15, 2020.

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  1. BumblingB I got better.

    I appreciate your knowledge, but that's not the issue. Having popular characters come into the comics was a good and positive influence on comics.

    It's the downright changes to try and get the movie goers to buy comics (which they don't) that is the issue. The comic industry has been on a decline for a while now. They've been trying this and that to get a boost to their income. Most of it is the time we are in, because the digital age has and will change print media. But they start to alienate the fans that they've had for years by just straight up changing something to match the movies.

    I'll use Harley as an example. As you said, she got her roots from Paul Dini and Bruce Tim's animated Batman series. She had enough popularity that they introduced her to the comics during the Cataclysm Aftermath Batman crossover. (I own the issue.) She was very one dimensional. Just Joker's arm candy that was just doing whatever he wanted. No personality that we knew in the cartoons. She didn't start getting her voice back until the early 2000s with Gotham Sirens, then when Jimmy Palmiotti got to write her comic. But before Jimmy, there was the New52 Suicide Squad, which she went to just being edgy. Thankfully shortly after, Jimmy got to write her and really brought back the essence of the original animated version of her. Margot Robbie modeled her attitude after this version. The costume that Margot wore, was the creative team's doing. And she was not very pleased by the scantily clad outfit she had on. This costume change was popular by the movie goers and it changed what we saw in the comics. For the negative. A lot of the artists weren't happy with that, but drew it anyways.

    Having adjustments due to the ever changing comic lore isn't the problem, it's the quick fixes or sudden changes that just jar the heck out of readers that turn them away. We see that with DCUO, we see that with a lot of things.

    Your knowledge is good, I knew most of that, though I didn't know Jimmy was not in the comics first. (Well he was, but not named.) I never was a superman fan though. Probably why.

    In case you are wondering. All the Batman movies have influenced the comics, but not to the degree of the recent ones post Digital Age. The impact is very severe and the choices really have hurt the industry to the point even Dan Diddio admitted that New 52 was a bad idea and why we got Rebirth. Is it because of the movies or the fans that would never buy comics outcries?
  2. Balton hero Committed Player

    It's not that I don't think they should implement other media versions into the game, it's that I don't think they should implement *crappy* other media versions, and imo, that's exactly what the movie Harley Quinn is. Again, my opinion, but if any multimedia version of Harley should be implemented, it should be the newest cartoon version. I despise the changes from the black and red Harley and the Harley from the Palmiotti/Conner run into....whatever that is in Suicide Squad.
  3. Lantern_AdamK4 Committed Player

    The example you provided from Proxystar is indeed a great example of constructive criticism. However, the majority of what I see here, on Facebook, on Twitter, and in Livestreams is not like that example. Most of it is without reason or logic. Lets take Time Capsules for example. LOTS of people love to complain about those, but offer no alternative solution. Despite the complaints, Time Capsules are incredibly successful and profitable. Who do you think a business is more likely to listen to? The income it brings in, which shows that they do sell so they must, for the most part, be enjoyed, or the rowdy people on the internet who come off as just being cheap and not wanting to support the game? Furthermore, if the number of players is declining that means the number of subscriptions is declining of course right? So if they listened and they completely stopped Time Capsules and Artifacts, and Augments, which are arguably their three best products, how will they make money? How will they keep the game going? Say they listen to the people who don't want to support the game and just stop making any sort of attempt to make a profit. Then what? Do you think the number of subscriptions will skyrocket if they stop trying to make money? I don't. How else will they make a profit. In the old days when the game was shiny and new, there was a massive player base, so subscriptions and the like were enough. Now that the player base is not as high as it was, they have to still make money. So then, what would you propose? How can this BUSINESS attempt to make MONEY to not only keep this game going, but also make some sort of profit?
  4. Proxystar #Perception

    The issue here is that time capsules are sold in a manner that is somewhat predatory and this isn't just Daybreak.

    Time capsules put in highly desirable cosmetics and sell them through a gambling RNG wall.

    The question isn't really can Daybreak make profit, but rather how much profit and what is acceptable.

    A player for should never be subjected to spending even $100 and getting nothing and currently that's easily happening.

    You can't tell me for a moment opening 100 capsules will get you enough other stuff to sell to make the 1billion+ you need in game to buy a neon you didn't get despite opening 100 of the things because you saw an advert on Twitter and thought it looked amazing and they acted like it was easy to get. It simply isn't true, at all!

    The items could be sold on the marketplace, subscriptions could be remodeled to motivate subs rather than letting people sit on premium status.

    People don't actually want capsules, they just want what's in them, the rest of it, is just physcological games and maximizing profits past the point you would have otherwise had you just sold it more transparently.

    Time capsules are honestly atrocious not to mention the outright selling of stat point progression effectively.

    They're a terrible addition to this game and loot boxes industry wide need regulation because they're out of control.
    • Like x 7
  5. Proxystar #Perception

    You could could also be selling time limited direct sales, for example if you chucked the OG Phoenix material on the market for $10-20 for one weekend only, do you think they'd make some decent money?
    • Like x 1
  6. Lantern_AdamK4 Committed Player

    While some of your points make sense, one thing I disagree with is the mention of paying $100 and getting "nothing". This isn't the case. Within $100 time capsules, one should easily have the complete style set, all of the emblems, and all if not most of the collections, as well as whatever item is received for opening 15 Capsules. Also, while I can't say they don't make a profit, I'm sure they do. We don't know how much is profit vs how much is being spent to keep things running and invent new content. We can't say they're making "Too much profit" because we don't know. Though speculate away.
    I say that I agree, if you spend $100 you won't be able to sell things to make enough to buy the Neon Chroma. But the devs don't set those prices. We wouldn't have to spend over a billion dollars for this chroma if a.) people didn't sell it for that outside of the broker and b.) if people didn't actually buy those items. If an item doesn't sell for a billion, eventually the cost comes down when nobody is buying it. A lot of people cry "Greedy Devs" but there's also PLENTY of "Greedy Players" that cause problems as well.
  7. Proxystar #Perception

    Sorry to make my position clear, I don't mean you get nothing, you don't get what you want, nor do you necessarily get the most desirable items.

    I know people argue that desirable is subjective and sure, i agree, but let's be honest, just for a moment, the most desirable items in the time capsules are the rarer ones and because of the skewed RNG are also the hardest ones to get.

    If we're honest most people were without a doubt opening capsule recently, solely wanting the neon chroma and that was all they wanted.

    The drop rates are not good enough, they're actually if we are honest beyond atrocious, I'll tell you this as well, how long have capsules been out now? You can work that out, it's largely rhetorical, but not once, not even once have I got one of those straight rare drop items, is that supposed to be acceptable?

    That's one of the problems with capsules, there's no proper redundancy in place, every time you open a capsule you might have say a 0.3% chance at that thing and it doesn't improve each time... that's absurd, absolutely absurd!

    The quark vendor as well is built with the best intentions but is honestly updated far too slowly and is horribly, horribly overpriced with the source mark conversion rate absurdly low.

    To also be clear, I don't really need to know what Daybreaks profits, the sum of the profit isn't my point, merely the fact that whatever that profit margin might be is the key, does the company want profit or do they just want to maximize profit in every case and interaction?

    How much profit is too much profit and again that's rhetorical so you don't need to answer :)

    And you're right there's a lot of issues with players as well when it comes to the economy, but the point remains valid
    • Like x 2
  8. BUDOKAI101 Committed Player

    I think this may very well be our last time cap. Because jack said after this ep they plan to start giving the players what they want
  9. Proxystar #Perception

    I highly doubt that.

    I mean, i should be clear too, i don't begrudge Daybreaks desire to make money or even its requirement to do so.

    I just think the time capsules are horrible nasty things from a customer centric perspective, they deliver cosmetics, absolutely, but theres better ways to do it that don't just entirely stack the odds away from the player...

    I mean honestly i don't even come to this game with gambling in my mind, it's not what i want, if i did I'd be playing the lottery, so pushing that in my face in a video game ive been enjoying for 9 years, mostly, will always result in a negative response from me.
    • Like x 3
  10. MsTickle Fate Devoted Player

    Oh, god, though, the howling there would be from people who missed that weekend.

    And not entirely unfairly, since only forum fanatics check in every day or every other day. But even if it were advertised as coming by in-game messaging for a week, the screams of "unfairness" would be deafening and never-ending.

    I think the only way to do something like this would be similar to the way they handled other limited-time materials, which is to say, give people a couple of months or so. There would still be subsequent complaints, but "you had two/three months to check in on the game" is a better response than "sorry, you had an entire weekend, tough luck."
  11. Proxystar #Perception

    The strict answer to that is of course tough ****.

    People miss out on sales all the time, doesn't mean you don't do them off course.

    That's why you also do it with items that can be gained other ways.

    You also don't have to do it once.

    It could even be structured weekly rather than weekendly to help with that and they could even do a Christmas sale at the end of the year that brings back all items previously on direct sale for a week.

    There's all sorts of better ideas that can still thrive on FOMO but be infinitely more transparent.

    Edit - technically speaking and you might find this interesting but those exclusives you bought aren't actually exclusive, the Daybreak terms of service actually stipulate these can be brought back in to the game at any time at Daybreaks sole discretion. ;)

    They're not as protected in right as some players might think.
    • Like x 1
  12. WilderMidnight Steadfast Player

    this thread is fun.

    just to add barbara gordon aka batgirl aka oracle actually debuted on the 60's tv series before making her debut in the comics (although her comics debut was planned before her appearance on the tv series).
  13. BUDOKAI101 Committed Player

    But daybreak doesn't call the shots anymore. Dimensional ink does and the game was in the best interest of daybreak not us. Now it's another ball game. After this ep the devs should be listening to the player base and what they want not what daybreak wants. That was talked about in the interview after the new ep they start doing what we want. Let's see if that happens though lol
  14. Proxystar #Perception

    My use of the word Daybreak is interchangeable with Dimensional Ink
    • Like x 1
  15. FoolsFire Devoted Player


    Just to add more...the original Bat-Girl appeared in Batman #139 in 1961. Six years before her appearance on the TV show.

    [IMG]
    • Like x 1
  16. Jacob Dragonhunter Steadfast Player

    The developers are never ever going to listen to people who don't support the game, that's not even remotely what I'm suggesting. To go even further: most of the people during the twitch livestreams who complain are the ones that are getting muted for spamming; so their feedback never shows up anyhow.


    Time Capsules should be able to sell themselves, they got lots of cosmetics; Iconic ones at that. Or... Do you mean to tell me the developers will put out something like the Batman Beyond suit and that won't sell by it's self?

    Anyone with a sense of reason aren't complaining because these products are selling, they are complaining because the products have a lot of crap in them that makes them annoying to deal with.

    Time Capsules: Remove the feats. Most common complaint you'll ever see.

    Artifacts: Catalyst Breakthrough failures, unbalanced setups, and etc.

    Artifacts could still generate plenty of revenue, even if DCUO is intending on making money; One could argue that having catalyst breakthrough failure continue to be a thing is actually discouraging players from upgrading their artifacts post 80 and thus hurting revenue.

    Even if you want the devs to make money, I think everyone can agree; Catalyst Breakthrough failures are a low blow that's unwelcomed. The failure is there for people to buy seals of completion but why not just remove that and have players spend their money on an artifact upgrade pack instead? It seems completely counter productive in my view.
    I've even read so many posts that people stopped bothering with their alts because they don't want to go through the trouble of dealing with the artifact RNG system for a second time and I don't blame them.


    Like Proxy said, it's how these products are being sold to players that's the issue.

    Granted yes "there's greedy players" but it never really went outside the norm of people going replay badge happy on content release day and the usual power respec tokens. Something that with patience could be overcome as people would wait on a power balance or the next episode to come out. Time Capsules and Artifacts however throw that logic out the window as you can't play catch up unless your willing to shell out hundreds of dollars to be "top tier".


    Sure, you get what you paid for at the end of the day. I'm not denying any of that.

    Is there room for improvement in these products? sure is.





    Also on a sidenote: Didn't you just claim how "Ridiculous" it is for everyone to claim that we know everything about the playerbase and how the devs generate revenue? Your contradicting your own talking point.




  17. WilderMidnight Steadfast Player



    [IMG]

    well barbara gordons version of batgirl!
  18. nawanda Loyal Player

    No I didn’t. If you want to reply to one of my posts in a way that makes sense, I’ll happily explain why I am not contradicting myself.
  19. Jacob Dragonhunter Steadfast Player

    Wasn't talking about you.
    I was replying to AdamK4 when I said he was contradicting himself.


    I only quoted your post as a reference when I said a lot of people just want the feats gone from time capsules, sorry for the misunderstanding.
    • Like x 1
  20. BumblingB I got better.

    I'm pretty sure he was talking about future episode stories. Like Legion of Superheroes or maybe a Villain themed one. Things like that. I doubt it was related to the cap$ules.
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