Devs, is there a plan so that we don't have to re-explore the same artifacts x times for our rerolls

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by Tolly, Aug 8, 2022.

  1. DeitySupreme Devoted Player

    I don’t consider a money sink since a lot of the stuff can be grinded without spending. The only issue I have with the game is that feats are on TC. Atm I don’t even buy stabilizer because I don’t like it. I won’t spend money on RNG items. So I use the free stabilizers they give us and also started buying the weekly stabilizer too. Then I’ll spend my 500 points depending on what I need. I’ll either get replays or stabilizers. And I also only buy during a sale since the loyalty vendor also gets the discount. I’ll break down my artifact situation. And keep in mind I did all of this without spending a penny outside of membership.

    Last double nth event I got:
    All my farmer toon arts from 80-120 to 120. So all alts have 3 120 arts.
    Didn’t do anything on my 3rd EG toon
    On my 2nd EG toon I got clarion from 0 to 160, EoG from 0 to 160, and transformation from 160 to 200.
    On my main I got the demon fang from 0 to 160, and I fed 1 art to another art.

    So all together I got multiple arts varying from 80-120 all to 120 minimum. I got 1 art from 0 to 200, 2 arts from 0 to 160, and def 1 art to another

    I had enough nth saved up from the previous event to do all this. And the next double nth I’ll have even more nth since I can now use 5 detectors each week without spending money or buying them off the broker.

    Further proof that you are talking out of pure emotion. If you stopped being biased for a few seconds you’d ask what they did to make things easier instead of just denying any opposing views.

    For anyone else that is emotionally stable I’ll list them out so you don’t get mislead by people like this guy.

    Multiple events are set up to help you level arts. These include:
    Double nth exp week
    Double nth drop week
    And an event that gives a free unstable seal of completion and have catalyst drop in game
    You also get catalyst from some holiday vaults

    You then have events that indirectly benefit arts. Like:
    Double source marks to use to buy catalyst
    Spotlight which also have source mark buffs.

    You also have the daily reward vendor which gives nth metal, catalyst, and destiny/fate tokens.
    You can use these tokens to buy:
    Nth detectors and seals of completion/preservation

    If you have a membership you get more rewards from the daily login. And you get increased nth metal drops. From the membership you also get 500 loyalty points which can be used to buy nth metal, seals, or catalyst.

    What exactly are they NOT doing to help with arts? Oh I know handing them out…
    • Like x 1
  2. GermanM Committed Player


    I have two main characters, a electric and a sorcery. Those two have arts in 200 and 160. Both with 415sp so i can have the full Might because i run powers. I play since 2013 and i try to make a tank but... the hell i cant doit, dont have the time (i have leave the game and return from time to time of course) but still, you must have invest years to do what you have done. Have alts able to do endgame is hard right now. That´s is because the arts system, stat points system. Now ally system wanna go that way too.

    But the point is, yeah they need money, but they abuse in many ways of players. I Wish this game was more like Guild Wars 2, totally alter friendly. And yes, you can tell me, go and play Guild Wars 2 then, but the thing is... I wanna feel in the same way here. Anyway, saying everything is perfect here around the arts, allys etc in terms of alters who can do a decent perform in endgame is a lie and deeply you know it.
    • Like x 1
  3. GermanM Committed Player

    There are more, like the lasso. But those 3 you mention are the best, maybe circe mask in some cases, but is very situational.
  4. coldchilln88 Loyal Player

    yeah no.
    • Like x 2
  5. BumblingB 15000 Post Club

    Players who like alts has always been not in the thoughts of developers since the start. There have been a few things that has helped, but for the most part, it is always designed for a one character account and the rest are mules.

    Lets break down the things we had and have that helped alts.
    1. Undergeared walkins, tradeable gear, ways of boosting your CR quickly.
      • Undergeared walkins were being abused by new players and the outcry was very much real. So it was removed and hurt players who've already played the content and wanted to bring up alts to help friends/leaguemates. It was a devastating blow and affected me greatly, but there were other things that helped. Note, this was VERY early on, I think T4 was when it was changed. (Gates walkins was all the rage...)
      • Tradeable/brokerable gear. Shortly after the walkins change, they changed the gear that was tradeable to character bound. So players lost the ability to sell higher Item Level items or shuffle them to alts. Which would have been lessened of a blow if they made them account bound, because at least the location that these dropped from could be utilized by players who acquired it in the instances.
      • Prom Box Jewelry... These were nice until they were useless because of power creep. They were 78IL and they never updated them. It would have been nice if they revisited them, but we all know the Prom Boxes were not making money of keys and were free to legendary members.
      • All the above things were pretty severe until Time Capsule gear was introduced. The gear that came out of this was fully tradeable/brokerable. The caveat was that it attuned to the average CR. So it wasn't very fast, which was designed so more capsules would be opened. (Yes, you could buy them off the broker, but someone had to open them to sell them.)
      • Now we have CR skips. Which is actually really good. They would be better if they included more skill points, as the 70 or so SP it grants is not a whole lot in the ways of helping bring up a character, but more on that later. I'm not going to get into the impact on learning for new players with this, as it doesn't pertain to alts. BTW, this also includes one artifact with enough nth metal to level it to 80.
    2. Account unlocking. Feats and styles.
      • Feat unlocking was by far the BEST thing they've given players with alts. Before artifacts, skill points were king. So if you could bring an alt up in skill points and shuffle gear to bring them into high end content, you could have an alt help. Which is exactly what I think alts should be. Yes, you are paying to bring them up, but it was definitely something that I was okay with. I wish they really doubled downed on the account unlocking. Especially since CR skips were created, you could skip and buy the feats you already had on your main.
        • Note on this, they also introduced gear reduction when a feat is purchased. This is just one step from actually being useful for alts. Namely, it doesn't include elite renown or weapons/jewelry. Which still prohibits an alt to really be brought up to being actually useful. I feel that they should attach a 0point feat for weapons/jewelry and a point feat for getting max renown that allows you to get those items half price on alts. Otherwise this really still just benefits a secondary role, which not a whole lot of players utilize fully. (They do, but like artifacts, it's still hard to maintain two roles on one character.)
      • Style unlocking is enjoyable if you like to dress up alts. The problem is the cost of rare items. I get it, they want players to get those items on alts, but all it does is make them cost prohibitive and players ignore the feature. (Plus, they don't even follow the same pricing system between styles and consistency is sad.)
      • It would be nice if we had a gear unlocking system, this can include augments, artifacts, and so on. You could price it similar to CR skipping if you do a whole set. At least that way players need to be definite if they want to bring an alt up equal to another or just a single artifact as an example, could be brought up for x number of dollars.
    3. Account bound items.
      • When House of Legends was introduced, they actually gave an overhaul of a lot of the systems. They removed the vaults and produced an account bound currency system for daily login. This resulted in secondary elements that actually helped alts more than some players realized. Not only can you use the daily login rewards to buy a few items that can help alts, some things that were originally character bound became account bound. Of course, artifacts are an issue here, as even if you get nth metal on alts, you would shuffle them to your main for their artifacts.
    In any case, this was just some things that I would see over the years. There are more nuances, including the monthly content being so un-alt friendly, that I ended up deleting a ton of alts. But it's gone, hopefully to never return.

    Edit: I'd like to mention that the EEG rewards has made it easier to get to high level CR than it's ever been. So that was a big positive.
    • Like x 1
  6. DeitySupreme Devoted Player

    It’s not really about time. It’s about utilizing everything they give you. In the post I put above your reply I did a quick list of all the events and everything you can use for arts. Let me a basic example.

    Let’s say you had $10 you wanted to invest in the game for your arts on nth metal. You can buy a perfected nth metal right now and feed it right now into an art. That leaves you with 75,000 experience. Let’s say you instead saved the $10 and used it during a sale that gave 50% off on nth metal. That means you can buy 2 instead of 1. If you use that nth as soon as you bought it than you have 150,000 exp in an art instead of 75,000. But instead you can also save the 2 nth metal and use them during a double nth metal week. Each of those 75,000 nth will then have a value of 150,000 each. If you use 2 than you will have 300,000 nth metal.

    So $10 can get you 75,000 exp or 300,000 experience. That’s the difference between using the resources the devs gave to you and not using the resources they give you. But why am I saying spend the $10 when I said above you don’t need to spend? Well above I said that you get 500 points each month from your membership. I also said that sales are applied to the loyalty vendor. So you can use the same method for free with just a membership. Every months 500 points means 1 perfect nth metal every 2 months or buying them during a sale only and being able to get more. And then using your destiny tokens to buy seals. And using double source marks to buy catalyst.

    That’s the difference. I can literally play 5 hours a week and have all the nth I ever need. 5 hours because that’s how much time you can have with nth metal detectors from the date vendor. You can literally play 1 minute a day and use the above example to max arts. Just login claim your daily rewards and log out. And you can still use your membership to max arts. If you can play 1 hr a week than buy 1 nth metal detector from the date vendor. Play 2 and buy 2. Everything you need in I’m the game.
  7. DeitySupreme Devoted Player

    So nothing I listed there is true?
  8. coldchilln88 Loyal Player

    All of those things listed would be used on your main as well. So again, unless you have copious amounts of time on your hands or a ton of money to drop. The point is all the same. You're not convincing anybody they've done enough.
    • Like x 2
  9. DeitySupreme Devoted Player

    I LITERALLY gave an example of how you can max arts without even playing…

    Obviously then go to your main first. But guess what. After your main there’s nothing left to level so they go to alts…
  10. coldchilln88 Loyal Player

    Again, the having the copious amounts of time to dump into alts. You play a ton. Massive amounts of time is required or money. You're saying the same thing over and over. No one doesn't understand what you are trying to say. We get the concept of maintaining an alt. The issue is the time and money due to the ridiculous amount of systems currently in the game. Listen, you wont convince me otherwise and i wont convince you. Let it go
    • Like x 4
  11. Miserable Committed Player

    The artifact and ally systems are horrible systems and would not be in any healthy MMO.

    I don't know what the situation was in 2017 that made the devs create the artifact system, maybe revenue was low and they were in serious danger of having to shut down the game (that's the only explanation that makes sense to me since the game went 7 years without arts), but I think it would have been a much better move at the time to try and figure out why your players had left/were leaving the game en masse and address those problems directly.

    This game's population has been declining for years and that doesn't happen for no reason. It happens when changes are made to the game that make players feel it's not worth playing anymore.

    I don't think the company is planning to shut down the game any time soon, yet it still feels like they are focusing on how to make more money from the players who will not quit no matter what, rather than creating a game that can attract and retain players, that people will want to play, and that has the potential to thrive. I know this is easier said than done, but I just feel that their focus is in the wrong place.
    • Like x 2
  12. DeitySupreme Devoted Player

    At this point I’m wondering if you’re trolling. I LITERALLY mentioned how to get arts with just 1 minute of playtime. When did massive change definition?
  13. GermanM Committed Player

    i believe you´re Meeps in another account xD
    • Like x 2
  14. RavNoc Dedicated Player

    Many changes were made for the betterment of the U.S. economy as well.

    That's cool and all, but it still sucks massively.
    • Like x 3
  15. Tiffany6223 Loyal Player

    It's not uncommon for companies to have employees use aliases on such forums to help control narratives, gauge customer sentiment, or provide defense for unpopular decisions made by the company. Microsoft uses this tactic heavily.

    I sorely doubt Deity Supreme works for Daybreak/Dimensional Ink as their secret agent but I am sure there are Forum members who do, its just good business.
    • Like x 1
  16. DeitySupreme Devoted Player

    Seeing how he banned me before I highly doubt it lol

    Let’s not bring politics into this…

    So what… you want them to level them up for you for free? You login and all arts are maxed out for nothing? I swear some people on here will never be happy until everything is handed to them (no I don’t mean you).

    What are you trying to say? I’m not good enough to be a secret agent???? :(
    • Like x 1
  17. Tiffany6223 Loyal Player

    • Like x 1
  18. RavNoc Dedicated Player

    A change was asked for. Any change. They did not specify that they wanted free hand-outs. You are making assumptions. The OP asked if there was a plan for any. You speaking for the devs really doesn't help, since you don't know what they are or are not capable of doing/changing.

    For example:
    How the heck could you possibly know that? "Nothing is impossible, Mario. Improbable, unlikely, but never impossible." - Super Mario Bros., 1993
    • Like x 1
  19. DeitySupreme Devoted Player

    Apparently people are asking for free arts because apparently 1min is considered a massive time investment.

    Technically anything is possible. I could wake up and they decide they will max out every single art in every single personals accounts. Just because something is possible doesn’t mean it can’t be ruled out. Making arts account bound would literally mean everyone would only need to max out arts 1 time. That is a direct cut into their pockets. So yes that is so unlikely that it’s basically guaranteed to not happen. Again it’s a business. It’s a for profit business. At the end of the day if they can’t make money from the game than they won’t keep the game open.
  20. GermanM Committed Player

    Maybe you´re the spy... o_Oo_Oo_O
    • Like x 2