Dev Discussion Development Update: Artifact Catalyst Consolidation

Mepps

I have 180 unopened catalyst caches

If I open all of these boxes and grab the dionasieum, quantum energy and paradox catalyst and save them can they be used to rank up my artifacts after the update or will they still be transferred into source marks and id have to still rebuy them from Constantine?

While I welcome the switch over (let's be honest it's sensible) .. I, like Nyx, am a little concerned about the 'earning ratio'.

I posted a bug saying that we do not get the mark from 'On Duty' dailies anymore.. I don't know if that was by design or ?
Originally it was to encourage higher players to play lower content and spread out the community to encourage Q'ing so lower players could finish older content.
See: Watchtower Containment & Hive Moon Base.



I mean it's fine if you just have a main.. maybe even just a trifecta.. but I have 17 alts, I am struggling for marks (source) as it is. I struggle to keep the generator fully running on each alt.

With the above change.. which I am enthused about.. I would like to suggest the daily marks instances, be fully rewarded. This seems to me to give everyone what they want.. while people (myself included) will buy catalysts from MP, if.. IF I need to I can play more content to take pressure off me/my alts for marks, which I can spend on catalysts but more likely generator requirements, and the original intent of getting higher players to play lower content.

It still takes the same amount of time to complete an instance at lower tiers (flip Arkham alert takes an hour like a raid).. so to do that all for one mark, I don't think people would go for that, I wouldn't unless I was desperate. It's about how much time is spent vs reward.

To further my suggestion.. I say maybe make this a membership perk like the vault. Access certain lower content daily for full marks.
Make it the longest instances for each tier. I badly want to joke that we should get double for Arkham.. but nope bite my lip!

Depends on the rank level more than the individual cat and if they don't increase the cat count per level. If you bought a level 60 pack (for instance) you'd have 3 reg Mystic Lightning, 2 superior and 1 concentrated. That's 6 cats x 10 source you can trade for so 60 Source. Assuming each rank stays the same for the replacement 'new' cats, You'd need 3x7+2x10+1x15 to rebuy for a total of 56 source....so you'd make 4 source in the bargin. Level 160 you lose some.....the MP pack would come with 21 total cats for 210 source when converted. If you buy the new cats at the same counts, you'd spend 216 source (8x7+7x10+6x15=216)...so you lose 6 source in the conversion. Level 100 is the break even point at 120 source when the 12 cats are consumed (post conversion) and 120 to rebuy 5x7+4x10+3x15 new cats.

Again...that's assuming the cat rate stays the same. Obviously if it goes up, even by one cat, every conversion is a loss. Here's hoping it does stay the same and that you don't have a pile of the MP boxes in inventory.

Reinheld

By 'ahead' do you mean 'spending more'? It's not a lot, but right now a 160 set would be 210 source....the new set will be 216. From a consumer aspect that's 'behind' in the deal. Ranks 20,40,60 and 80 you end up 'ahead' by 6, 6, 4 and 2 respectively....rank 100 is a wash and 120, 140 and 160 are 2, 4 and 6 mark losses. In the end it's not a lot, but if you are sitting on a bunch of rank 100-119 artifacts AND a ton of cat caches...in the end you are behind in the deal.

I guess you could say that overall we are doing ok as new artifacts ranked from 0 to 160 will cost less overall. This is where a single cat would have been easier as it could have just cost 10 and we'd be even across the board.

And as mentioned, it also depends on the cat count per rank staying the same, which remains to be seen.

Reinheld

Worded differently.....if we have a quantity of those 3 cats (forget the boxes) in inventory now....say 5 Quantum Field Energy. Will those remain as is and usable, or will we need to convert pre-change Quantum Field Energy into 10 source then re-buy the post-change Quantum Field Energy?

Reinheld

When the GU launches, those Catalyst Caches will only give you 10 Source marks each so youll get 1800 Source Marks whenyou open them all. You wont get the new Catalysts from those boxes.

If you decide to open the boxes right NOW, you'll get the usual Catalysts but then still, after the GU launches, you'll consume those Catalysts and you'll receive 10 Source Marks.

Those will be 10 Source Marks. Its basically changing out the old guard for the new guard even though the name stays the same.

1.- isnt easyer if the catalyst just drops in instances? that will make us to play more all content in orther to get them...

2.-which is the sense of buy a loooot of catalyst boxes and open them 1 by 1? will be faster if we could open X boxes for X rank with 1 click (like skill point distribution system)

3.- yeah, why 7? isnt easyer 1;2;3 for 1st berak, 4;5;6 for 2nd, 7,8,9 3rd... etc.? will be less but you can adjust the drop rates (i mean if you implement the 1rst point)

idk just saying... right now is not just "confuseing" is hard and waste of time... and that without talking about the experience required to do the breakout btw the artifact experience sys is like farm 999999999999999999999999999999999 exobytes in the old exo sys...

If you are correct, that's a bummer. Wouldn't mind hearing confirmation from a green name though.

Reinheld

Thank you for the Clarification on this

Also Could you look into having whole stacks convert at once and not just 1 at a time please.

Just run the vault every dsy with them and you will have enough source marks.

Drat....I guess I won't be stockpiling those 15 mark paradox energies pre cutover then....

Curses...foiled again!

Reinheld

Right now, I store catalysts in my Shared Bank and any alt can use them when leveling up.

How will this work when you covert my catalysts to Source Marks (which right now are not shareable between characters)?

What happens to my Shared Bank stash? Who gets the Source Marks? (My Main doesn't need them.)

Hi

I do.

I don't.

I have gear and other stuff to buy (catalysts, rare styles)..
35 days = 5 fully lit perks.

Source Marks should be Shared across ALL toons like Replay Badges

change without having the replacement ready. how absurd.

Assuming they stay in the bank before conversion, pull them out on the toon that needs the source marks. You can't open things directly from shared bank. I'd guess you want to do it only one time though, as cat caches may become untradeable after the conversion so whoever grabs them better need the marks. Open them on that toon. If you think about it, during the conversion this works in your favor....but I say think about it because talking about it could be a naughty thing in the forum.

Reinheld

You "being ahead" means "you have saved" being behind would mean you've spent more. Sure rank 160 itself costs more after the change, but to get from a brand new artifact to rank 160 after the change you would spend 854 marks (versus 860 right now). That was the comparison I was making. Individual milage may vary, depending on where your artifacts are currently, but anyone could take the existing numbers and see what the difference is for them. The reason I choose 0-160 as the comparison is because we will eventually be getting more artifacts and that comparison is valid longer than a short term pain switching to a new/better system.

I think the reason they don't want to go with one catalysts revolves around catalysts weekends. The catalyst rarity will determine the likelihood it drops. There's nothing stopping them from making all 3 coat 10 marks either, but then the rarity would only matter during catalyst weekends.

As for catalyst count per breakthrough, based on the numbers I would expect the count to remain the same for breakthroughs 20-160. 180 and 200 may end up with the count we would expect or possibly less to keep the cost in the new plan closer to the expected cost in the old plan. Even if they keep the anticipated number of catalysts for 180 and 200, you are only "behind" by 12 marks leveling a brand new artifact. You can earn over 100 marks a week just doing relevant content (not to mention the mark you can choose from every boss loot table in every raid below relevancy or random chance at a mark separate from the loot picker at any boss in any instance below relevancy), so you could easily earn that 12 by running 3 older raids a week (at least 6 raids with walk-in portals should be soloable by end game players). If there is a change in catalyst count, it would likely be either an across the board reduction, or a rebalance to adjust individual breakthroughs to be closer to their original cost (so lower breakthroughs would end up with more catalysts and higher ones with less). Though I don't see the rebalance being practical since at most an individual breakthrough (from 20-160) is 6 marks more or less than the current design and the cheapest catalyst will be 7 marks.