Test Discussion Damage Supercharge Balance - Update

Right... that means the imbalance or rebalancing needs to occur with the artifacts, not the supercharges.

Wait what? That makes no sense the super charges haven’t been balance in forever with Entomb, Berzerk, Circuit Breaker being miles better then most SC, that has nothing to do with artifacts. You can remove eye, scrap ect and those supers are still the best options. Right now if every player had access to any power sets super charges every Dps would have Berzerk for melee range and CB when they couldn’t be close and that has nothing to do with Artifacts

Even though you have done supercharges being better than others, overall, powers are still relatively on par with one another. Therefore, supercharges being better than others aren’t really making that big of a difference considering that every power has its strengths and weaknesses. The only supercharges that should be changed are the ones that’s undoubtedly underperforming .

Since I don't have access to test just popping in to make sure Earthquake gets some love lol, I really want it to be viable

The power sets are no where near on par. Mental and Gadgets are so far better then the other might powersets that’s it’s not funny. Headlight power cost is to high compared to the damage their doing, Nature average, Rage Dps blows when they can’t melee, Quantum is average, Sorc average, Cele is to slow, Earth is cheeks if they can’t jack hammer and entomb span, Water is horrible no the powersets are not Relatively on par. But this is a Super charge and no their not on par with each other either.

No, you are completely missing the point. If you balance it based on the equipped artifacts, you haven’t balanced them at all. You need to either perform the balance with no artifacts or you will be forcing everyone to use the same artifacts as the testers, and that defeats the purpose of allowing for a “variety of play styles.” It’s one thing to balance them naked. It’s faulty data when you consider them balanced based on numbers seen while artifacts are equipped that can and will alter the behavior of the supercharge or its damage.

Scrap is going to affect how frequently you can fire it off. Eye of Gemini and Quislet will add extra damage. Transformation and Strategist Cards will also add in more damage by improving the frequency of critical hits, increasing the damage from one, and adding a DOT to the target too.

You're so concerned with trying to tell testers how to test that you completely missed his point.

Quislet doesn’t add extra damage to a super charge.

No, I'm talking about how artifacts modify what is happening and that if you are trying to balance out something you are adding a variable to the situation if you don't exclude them. I'm saying that the premise that they are imbalanced is flawed because of the artificial layers and layers of changes made, and how if you balance them in the presence of artifacts you then mandate the use of specific artifacts in order to have those supercharges perform at the base level of expectations rather than the enhanced level that the artifact choices might produce, sometimes to the detriment of other powers (an "all your eggs in one basket" situation... kinda how Big Gun used to wipe out a hallway of adds), and failure to use the artifacts for which the supercharge was balanced will produce anemic at best results.

Quislet and Eye of Gemini are triggered by supercharge use. That's how they add damage... Quislet with his medium multi-target attack (5k) or big single target attack (10k), Eye by providing for how 20% of all damage done by those standing in Pollux's gaze is additional damage done to nearby enemies.

Everyone is saying that supers are tested seperate of artifacts. Once you put any artifact to any super, yes they will react different. That doesn't change how a base super works. So either they're testing without any and recording that or their doing that as step one and step 2 is adding in artis to see how they react. Mydps explained it up above

Think of it like this: right now there are supers you want to spam and supers you don't so you wouldn't use scrap/ eog/ strat for power A and B but you would for powers C and D. Now A, B, C, and D can all have the sameish result for the same build.

What's missing is a "naked baseline"... Check how supercharges behave with no augments, no tactical mods, and equivalent character setups (same CR, same number of SP and their allocations)... because that is where the actual balance has to occur. Players choose different mods, spend time leveling up augments, and choose different artifacts at different levels.

Yes, that is what testers do generally. The players that do this for the community know how to set things up. They aren't trying to see how it reacts to their own personal toons. Tho they can/ may be but they would say something along the lines of "supercharge A reacts differently with eog and quislet".

While they're testing baselines, don't forget that part of testing is trying it all out with different artis and in different scenarios to make sure it's all performing correctly all over. Testers don't get enough thanks. The work AV, OC, Rej, and plenty others put in is days of looking at tiny numbers.

Duh. You're not saying anything new that testers don't already know. These are methods they teach in junior high school science class.

The data isn't flawed if you're testing each supercharge in the same manner. If I'm using artifacts A, B and C to test one supercharge, then I'm testing all the other supercharges with artifacts A, B and C for comparison. If I'm testing one supercharge with no artifacts, then I'm testing all the other supercharges with no artifacts for comparison. If I'm testing one supercharge with just artifact C, then I'm testing all supercharges with just artifact C for comparison. You also have to consider Tactical Mods and numerous other variables.

The proposed supercharge changes were simply tragic. Period. With or without artifacts they did not resemble anyone's expectations of balance or being 'super' in general. If that had gone live, almost every damage chaser would have respecced to Gadgets.

Exactly Hell.

I’m well verse how both artifacts work. You said they add super charge damage. Quislet does his own attacked when a super charge is triggered it has nothing to do with how much damage your super charge does. Eye is triggered off the use of a super charge that has again nothing to do with boosting the super charge damage those artifacts function as intended and are the reasons people use them.

An alternative solution for grand summoning is to reduce its duration to 30sec & greatly increase the damage & frequency at which they hit to make up for the 60sec reduction. Since pets would suffer the same drawbacks as a player whos buff sc would last too long (cc effects, ko possibility, unable to follow 1shot mechanics etc) this seems like the best fitting choice I could think of.

I see your point & I do feel youre right that we should also test without artifacts on b/c some will effects will skew ppls thoughts of what's too strong or too weak. like if someone uses a buff sc with the amulet on.



I do feel its still important use different artifacts after base testing though to see the max potential of a power & that will tell how much further to increase one sc relative to another based on the the highest max found in that sc category.

I'm still under the notion circuit breaker should give increased crit chance & magnitude along with its buff or greatly increase its overall buff.


If a powerset has a buff built in it but its more beneficial to use an iconic then that powerset ability no longer has a purpose in the game.


Iconics should be very valuable utilities to add variety, not mandates b/c things in the powerset don't function properly or at the very least optimally.