Cr relevancy&Source marks.

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by Lord Jareth, Apr 19, 2019.

  1. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    From what it sounds like, you are looking at it right. Today, you can go in out of relevancy, run the 4 weekly outdoor 8 mark things (3 if you couldn't get Big Starro done), and get 32 marks a week. Doing just that, you could buy one of the 100 mark auras for the style feat, or to sell in about 3 weeks. Post change those 4 outdoor mission will drop an Alt rewards box, where you MIGHT get a source mark depending on RNGezus's smiling on you or not. You CAN run 'in relevancy' content OR older content to get the onesie-twosie source drops and then use your source marks to buy the aura...but don't forget those marks also need to be spend on caches....vendor 00/22 styles and anything else you missed along the way from base game to ep 31....

    Now....will alt boxes reward MORE source marks than the current alt boxes drop MoV? Maybe.....Will out of relevancy loot choosers allow for more than 1 Source mark choice? Maybe.... but all things being equal, are losing a greater amount of episodic marks in favor of a very limited number of source marks. This works out badly if you need the episodic marks still for those collections/auras/styles. For those who are done with everything in the episodes it's only a loss of revenue from selling those items and could even be looked at as a benefit as all content will drop marks that you can use for Cat caches, etc...

    Funny thing is I don't even need the episodic marks...finished all of it up to TT anyway. I just don't like the idea from a standpoint that it makes running the old content pointless...or at least not worth the time/effort...much like < Ep27 is already looked at...."why run it? No rewards".

    • Like x 1
  2. TheLorax 10000 Post Club

    Take into account the Source Marks you are getting from CR relevant content. What are we spending those on? My rent is only 21 marks and everything else goes to Catalyst Caches and I already have a surplus of caches saved up.
    • Like x 2
  3. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    Well luckily we are playing TheLoraxUO....otherwise some people might need them other old styles, or 35 on rent, or extra cat caches to support multiple toons artifacts. Things you don't need them for. Personally it's not me. I also have those things done...I also have a pile of Cat caches, but let's say I like to buy and sell 10 cats a week for an extra 3-4 million income? Wheeee! I get to now spend my source/MoV on a Starro urchin aura to sell or send to an alt who needs the feat or goodie gum drops...I can use those same marks to buy a collection piece to finish the Minotaur head piece collection, assuming I needed it.

    If all it concerned was MoV=Source, no problems. I don't care what they are called. It's the removal of 100+ easy marks a week for the different episodes that can be gathered by doing the 'kill count' or other weekly missions in a short amount of time. Missions that a lot of people do to get the episodic marks...sometimes to buy episode styles or the high mark collections...sometimes to buy things to sell at a profit in the broker...sometimes just to feel like what they are doing actually amounted to something....sorry, but 1 'possible' mark from an alt rewards box does not make 410/411/333/303/329 worth the effort, or giant starro, or the AoJ invasion force bounty. These things will all join the ranks of the Hand of Fate raids....NGN...BN...LnW...or Bombshell. As soon as the feats are done, and relevancy dried up, why run any of those things?

    No, I don't really think that any of us who knocked out these things at relevancy will be greatly impacted, but not everyone is us....I'm looking at it from a big picture level. The player who is just getting to Ep 27 on May 1....does not have a surplus of old marks to combine into Source marks....and does not have the 800 marks to buy the collections + the 200 (or whatever) marks to buy 1 set of gear will lose that AF3 source of marks likely before he gets that stuff done, and unlike intended he won't be able to keep getting those marks as time goes on because he's out of relevancy and into the next DLC....where he picks up another 350 or whatever mark collection + 200 mark gear set.

    • Like x 3
  4. (EU PC) WyckedGamesTTV Level 30

    Okay, so after watching the YT video (which ends early), reading the pts patch notes and now playing on PTS, this is my take...

    Source Marks are a great idea. They consolidate currency for all but the current episode.

    What is NOT a great idea is removing any incentive for high CR toons to run lower level content.

    To explain...

    As a 269 CR Deeps / 268 CR Troll, I currently do JLD, Atlantis, Titans, Earth 3, Deluge, Riddled With Crime and Age of Justice content (in that order and depending on time available) daily.

    The reason, while CR Relevancy means I don't get MoVs, I do get gear drops towards style collections, and Episode currency towards base items, vendor gear, mats, auras etc for personal use and for Alts.

    With the changes currently on the PTS, this becomes pointless.

    Anything below JLD rewards cash that barely covers repair bills with next to no other rewards... just the fairly useless Alternate Reward Box which contains ONE of...

    Compound Omega - Still semi relevant, but growing less so
    Exobit Cluster - Pretty much irrelevant
    Mark of Victory - Replaced with a single Source Mark
    Token of Prestige x 100 - Nice but frankly minor when the league earns 250,000+ Prestige per cycle
    Victory Token x 100 - Useless once you have the final feat (which I do)

    In other words, a 1 in 5 chance of getting anything remotely useful/relevant.

    This gives the typical JLD ready toon no incentive to do anything else. Why waste time doing content that costs more than it rewards?

    Furthermore, farming past Episode currency for that episodes styles to complete them towards feats made doing the content relevant to current tier, as Skill Points are always relevant. But now we have to split the Source Marks earned across only 2 episodes, across all episodes for styles and other rewards from vendors. So at best you might see an increase in Replays being used for Atlantis and JLD, but nobody queuing for anything prior to Atlantis. This leaves new players and alts struggling for queues even more than they do now.

    The result, new toons/players will skip the episodic content and just do the current Episodes dailies/solo/duo/alert etc for the easy gear and the content becomes deader than the dodo (or new players will not realiae this is an option and just uninstall the game in frustration). This would be a travesty and unfair on the team for all the work that went into the episode content.

    So, I would say to the devs and decision makers, rather than make old content LESS relevant (and make queues worse for new players/toons in a patch that is CLEARLY aimed to make the game more accessible to new players), why not include rewards in the boxes that ARE relevant?

    A good idea might be to make the Source Mark 100% drop rate and then a 1:4 chance of one of the other rewards as well, this will give the content some guaranteed rewards of value, without being a short cut.

    A more complex, but maybe more balanced route, if you are CR Irrelevant, the Alt Reward boxes could have a chance to drop Vendor items from the Episode. After all, gear at that point would ONLY be for the style feats, auras, mats, base items etc well, sometimes RNGesus loves you, sometimes he doesn't.

    Just my two pennies worth, but it seems there is a large portion of the dedicated player base that feels the same way.

    • Like x 6
  5. TheLorax 10000 Post Club

    Thank God we're not playing TheLoraxUO, that game would be boring af. Everyone would be fashionable and pugs would bring their A-game. L A M E
    • Like x 3
  6. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    I guess what I don't understand is those who think this is great because the few sheckles of source marks they can get in non-relevant content can be used to buy other things MoV can buy...but that is really no different from today. If you run out of relevancy content today you can pick up a few MoV for the loot chooser and MAYBE in a alt box. There appears to be no difference from that aspect and your 21 Source will be grabbed up the same way you get MoV now. The difference is the loss of the Episode marks...which is a total loss. -10 marks per raid....-8 marks per weekly and we trade that for a slight decrease in gear prices and the ability to avoid some content completely if you want (couldn't do that before) which we all know only increases queue times and makes the old content less popular.

    Other than the cap raise, I don't see how anyone is behind this being a good thing.

    • Like x 1
  7. Mepps Sr. Community Manager

    Since you are not in CR relevancy for Deluge, you won't be able to/will have to run Deluge for those rewards (except some marks continue to drop in the alternate reward boxes). You would be able to/would have to run whatever (later) episodes that you are still in CR relevancy for.
  8. (EU PC) WyckedGamesTTV Level 30

    And that's the issue Mepps, once you've "finished" an Episode, there is no reason to go back and do it any more, this results in a player drought for the content. See the problem?
    • Like x 10
  9. TheLorax 10000 Post Club

    I see the issue with removing CR relevancy altogether, any chance it could be tweaked to benefit players that are past relevancy?
    • Like x 1
  10. Tygerfyre Committed Player

    This is a colossal change from what we have today. You're making it much harder to go back for rewards in those episodes, for no apparent reason.

    If I run the Olympus raid today, out of relevancy window, I get 10 Ancient Coins. Those would translate to 10 Source marks.
    If I was IN relevancy window, it would be 10 Coins + 10 MoV, which translates to 20 Source Marks.

    Why is that same run going to only be worth a couple of Source Marks for me after next week? And why should the in-window players get half as many Marks (as previous comments from you have lead us to believe)?
    • Like x 5
  11. 9001BPM Steadfast Player

    The Deja Vu here is so real :D
    • Like x 2
  12. MsTickle Fate Devoted Player

    Here's an example of what we're asking about: I have almost everything on the Teen Titans vendor that I want, except I don't have the Ikon material. So I still run Titans content at times to get those special marks to eventually have the 200 Titan Creds to get the Ikon material. This for my primary character who is now CR 272.

    After the new GU, how will I be able to purchase the Ikon Material? Will it and all similar materials and collections and furniture and such currently on mark-specific vendors be made available for Source Marks instead?

    Or what?

    Where are we supposed to run content to earn the marks that will now be missing from each of the Episodes that are currently currency-specific? Do you see that by taking away those marks, you are taking away a huge part of why we bother to play the game?

    Previously relevancy meant only that we lost Marks of Victory. Now it seems it will mean not just no Marks of Victory, but there will be nothing to replace the specific currency we could previously earned.

    This is a huge subtraction from why we bother to play. What's your reasoning as to why this will not make us play far less?

    This is a huge deal, and so far, the responses we're getting suggest... a lack of awareness of the issue.
    • Like x 3
  13. FoolsFire Devoted Player

    • Like x 2
  14. FoolsFire Devoted Player

    Obsidian Chill released a video about this. You'll have to run NEW content in order to get the marks for the old stuff.

    • Like x 1
  15. ObsidianChill Community "Trusted"

    You would still use titan creds........................... Teen Titans is episode 32 which has absolutely zero impact from this because that is still in the cr relevancy window, only episodes 27-31 are impacted which the devs have already stated in the update notes. If you still need any gear or OP items from any episode before 32 than you will have to use source marks and in order to get source marks you will have to run Teen Titans, Atlantis or Justice League Dark content.
  16. Tygerfyre Committed Player

    Yes we get that. The point is that that is a Bad Thing, and being done for no apparent good reason. I could understand if there was some kind of upside here, but there doesn't appear to be one other than neatening the Currency tab in inven, and that could still be accomplished without crippling our ability to play old content and be reasonably rewarded for it.
    • Like x 3
  17. ObsidianChill Community "Trusted"

    What is the reward of running that old of content that you wouldn't get from running the newer content?

    • Rare loot drop items? still there after gu update
    • episode marks? why would you even need episode marks? any styles you still need are drastically cheaper after the gu
    • marks of victory? mov's are practically useless anyways and are only used for 3 things in game base affinities, catalyst caches, rare style vendor all of which are even easier now with the huge influx of source marks which can be used to in place of mov
    • desire to help friends/leaguemates? unless you are saying you were only helping said players for selfish reasons to get loot and marks then yea, but aren't you simply queing to help said player despite being locked/no rewards?
    so really "crippling" ability to play old content and be rewarded is a pretty flaky argument that is all but baseless.
    • Like x 3
  18. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    You are applying your argument from the aspect of someone at endgame today. Yes...I run Starro to get some extra Starro bucks to buy a few auras and sell them for profit....I'll lose that ability (or it will become more difficult...sure) big deal, right? Well for the guy who is just coming up those 800 marks needed for the AF3 well as the few 100 marks for a gear set...maybe 2 if you play both roles or want Elite for the title, mean you need to stay in relevancy longer than would be required by natural CR progress, or you will lose the income you need to get them from the content where it's applicable. What "Huge influx" of source marks will that guy get? Assuming the reward rates are the same, that guy now has to buy his episodic stuff AND pay the rent or get old styles or cat caches with the same income. Fine the gear is cheaper, but the net mark income is as well.

    What is the upside, other than the raised cap (they could have done that without this change) and a neatened up currency tab? What... now you can get a few random source in Deluge that you can buy cat caches with, that is unchanged as you can get a few MoV today? You even say MoV are 'practically useless' yeah...let's standardize those across the board and force value on them by making everything cost MoV/Source.

    I see you listed the 'CON' column and shot those all to share the 'PRO' column with us?


    EDIT...I did just finish your video...and it does seem like you realize there is some drawback here...Not sure why you are seeming to respond otherwise above. Yeah, there are some very limited reasons to run the old content still, but the main one....getting paid...will be removed.
    • Like x 2
  19. xPhantom Atom Well-Known Player

    Does this mean that players will get the option to hide all previous content from their 'On-Duty' tab? No point in running it so no point in having it clog things up.
    • Like x 3
  20. GoldenDodge Dedicated Player

    I am not sure how this will play out as I will be stuck waiting until this is live other than any vids people may load since us PS players have no access to the test servers. And until I see it live and how this affects my mains and alts will be a strong decision maker for me.

    But I will say that this pending mark overhaul is yet again making the game feel uncomfortable. I do not have time to play non stop on this game. Heck, I even took almost a year off as the game was no longer fun - it turned into a boring tedious grind that was sucking the life out of anything positive about the game. There is a lot of vendor items/gear I still need to get and this seems like it will be making the game more of a tiring and pointless grind and less fun in order to get those items/gear/feats.

    I will say that for me, other than the prestige coin the alternate reward boxes are a joke. The one possible shot at a mark is not worth the effort on some content and that keeps me out of some older stuff. It is too easy to fly past relevancy in newer content (ex, right now - Teen Titans is on the bubble) and I may still need to have items from those vendors. The possible chance of a possible mark from a possibly irrelevant alternate reward box makes the running of older content more of a turn off for me as it becomes a possible waste of time that can be best utilized elsewhere.

    I understand the mark change is going to happen regardless, but please look into updating the alternate reward boxes to actually give what can be considered a real reward. At least give choices when opening these boxes, something similar to the newer loot box system.
    Promethium Lockboxes give a choice, why can't the alternate reward boxes give one?
    • Like x 1