Congratulations On Nerfing TOTDe into the ground.

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by LukeĀ©, Oct 28, 2021.

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  1. Mentaldope40 Dedicated Player

    If players in game were more coherent towards understanding that the essence and tanks are one then i would kinda understand uproar with the changes.
  2. TeflontheIcon Well-Known Player

    Also, the debate over TOTDe has always been a vigorous one. Even back in 2015 I believe it was, we were animate about this raid and it's difficulty. I applaud the community for it's love of the game, difficulty and in voicing said love. Biggupps to all (Obsidian, Luke,zNot,Hell stroke,etc) who went to war over this raid. Cheers!
  3. Arwen Skywalker Loyal Player

    December is back on Episodic content, Legion of Doom.
  4. Jurandyr Ross Well-Known Player

    If only we had more testers that weren't sweaty dps using only the meta artifacts setups, a buff troll with 200 artifacts, broken superspeed, tac swapping, doing everything they can to show their e-pen... That's who we have testing the raids, and look at what a great job they did testing the remaining content, like that joke of an elite duo, or the Wonder Woman fight in TDe.

    But that's how it is with test only open for PC, and even then, only a small amount of PC players test stuff.
    • Like x 7
  5. BaelinFishman Well-Known Player

    As far as meta's go , the people who discover these metas, use them ad nosium, and force it on the community as a whole are most of the time people who are begging, b***hing and moaning that everything is too easy and needs to be harder everywhere for everyone.

    I used to be like you, wanting hard content always ran with the elite 1% leagues and finished off DLC feats long before the next DLC came out....then the game and the rest of the community changed and slowly became more casual overtime. And thats what I think you're failing to see is that the self-proclaim elite players/1% skill crowd are an extreme minority of players and logically speaking you cannot design something around the minority and have it apply everywhere effectively. You cannot design a game around the minority player base. Think about it this way, the harder you make a raid, the less people that are going to replay it, then Daybreak loses money on replays and I assure you that is a huge source of micro-transaction income for them.

    As far as metas as a whole go, its like exploits and cheating in a game. Its a game of whack-a-mole or whack-a-meta in this case and unfortunately, they have no incentive to stop with the practice as long as schmucks keep giving them money for power respec tokens when a power just happens to become OP again. Then they attempt to balance it and something else becomes super OP and that will happen in a game that has 15 different powersets with about 30 or so abilities each. Basic math dictates the shear amount of work that goes into balancing. The revamp was the closest the devs ever game, although thats more sad than anything because at the end of the day you still have imbalance. I mean hell I remember right before the revamp where you had maybe only 4 or so powersets that were the best for DPS (Mental, Gadgets, Ice, Munitions) and everything else was middle of the road except for Nature and Electric was like shooting a dear with a bb gun, you start DPSing the boss with those power and he'd just look @ you and laugh. But now you have many powers that are viable for DPS mainly bc of artifacts but still, sure some still underperform compared to others, but not to the extent they used to.
    • Like x 5
  6. zNot Loyal Player

    Ok so you want to talk about it again,
    Can you tell me where you have the numbers of that the population got more casual? Based on the content the devs have given us your statement is completly false and by the amount of players that have complained about low difficulty on elite raids shows that if anything the number went up.

    We have elite versions for Solo,duo now which we didnt have few years ago we will get a new choose your own difficulty for the elite raid in the next episode which shows that the devs have a reason for this so your claims of casuals are completly false based on these facts,also most casual players do not care about elite raid content why would they make elite raid content for the casuals? Do you think the devs would invest ressources and time into multiple stages of elite raid difficulty and by making elite duo,solo,alert per episode if it wasnt worth it? I think they know way more about this topic then you.

    Again you seriously fail to see the entire point,endgame players asking for harder elite raids not for harder regular raids and not the game to be 10 times more difficult you get it? This is about just one piece of content not all or multiple,Elite raids original purpose was that its supposed to be difficult and you gotta accept that fact. You wont even see as you call elitist try to make elite duo or solos or alerts difficult just the elite raid and i think the endgame community that plays elite raid deserves that one piece of content thats difficult (how difficult thats arguable based on the imbalances in the game) and Theres also plenty of casuals who turned elite as they got more endgame. At the end of the day dcuo is a mmo and you go and see what mmos offer.

    Any mmo that is being designed like your ideology i say,Good luck trying to retain endgame players without challenging content :p
  7. zNot Loyal Player

    I would still like to see them do something against the meta maybe counter it with content design in elite raids,or nerf it or something. i feel like it hurts all players even those that use them caus u will see them complaining about the game being too easy and some of them stopping the game and i dont think that dcuo wants to lose out on money spending,SP lovers with max artifacts and max everything.

    Most of the meta is about doing as much DPS as possible which means a Elite raid thats dps centric and allows us to use a buff troller and 5 DPS and has DPS checks will not really be a great choice of a design.

    But i dont know if the devs even think and agree that gadget prec,eog spamm,buff trolling is OP? Would be nice to know
    • Like x 1
  8. KHALONofOGUN 10000 Post Club

    A PS4 test server is not possible, and has been said many times. The reason why is that it would be useless since every client side update has to go through an approval process with PSN. That takes time and costs money to publish each time. Test server updates (based on feedback) could be as frequent as 5 or more times within one week. Can you imagine the publishing costs alone for that? Or how long it would take to see the changes be approved by PSN, and then how long it would take to implement new changes based on the feedback for the last set of changes? Basically it would render the PS4 test server a useless expense.
    • Like x 2
  9. Kimone Luthor Genetech Clone

    ehhh, we're already doing that many hotfixes a week now.

    also "build into current client".
    • Like x 1
  10. BumblingB I got better.

    Hotfixes are different than Client side fixes. Hotfixes are server side and don't alter the code that you, the player, have installed on your game. Client updates actually update your game files and always have to go through the 3 big company's approval to be released.

    On PC, they can do a client update as the download is directly from them and installed with their installer. So if they have to do a huge map fix, as an example, they could do it the same day the update hit test.

    So a PS4/XB1/Switch test client can happen, but they would not be able to do client fixes, only hotfixes.

    Edit: They could treat it like live, but the turn around for approval is very long, which is why they set it to be once a month for client updates. Which would result in very little testing being able to be done, since if a client update is needed to fix or adjust something, it wouldn't get proper testing before it had to go to live and defeats the purpose of test.
    • Like x 2
  11. Siramez Well-Known Player

    thats basically 99% of test server playerbase, they actually dont know what they're doing to make it more "hard", if you want a challenging raid, maybe dont be a sweaty dps? have you ever thought of that? test the content using different methods rather than the meta themselves since they make everything a joke, no wonder every new dlc have came out, it became easy on the second day because of those playerbase, nothing can be hard and challenging when you have a broken meta ^
    • Like x 1
  12. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    Well, all I really cared was Ares losing some overall health and that happened so I'll call it a win. The rest changing seems like maybe the completion rates were low. Git gud is the normal argument but there is limited time with this one so whatever. If it was sticking around forever then I might jump on the wahmbulance. Which brings up the question, is this for the upscaled elite or the clamped elite or both? If it's for clamped elite, are these changes forever? Were the changes done to regular also forever changes? I will admit I'm not a fan of things being changed to old content after all this time. I get why things happened to this particular raid in the last month but I'm really hoping everything will revert back once StU is over.

    And since meta and raid design was brought up, there are already mechanics that stopped them a bit. CTE, while still possible to eog, was all about get away from each other. Other raids share that mechanic. Some require lots of movement and that favors some powersets and builds more than others. There's even still raids that do no orbitals or no SD's and artifacts exist for those. So I'm sure we'll see raid mechanics again that can negate some of the meta.

    Yeah, there's nothing that can really be said in prec gadgets defense but I will say again, they really only "crush" top might players when they eog and work as a well oiled machine. Might players can get sweaty amd do dang well against them. No matter what gets done, all it will do is shift things. There is no perfect balance to be struck when players can make tiny changes that differentiate themselves to someone doing almost exactly the same thing.

    Test related topic, still think there should be testing boxes. Somewhat randomized if possible. 1 power token but locked into something random. Maybe you get 350sp, maybe you get 550. Maybe it's full vendor gear, maybe it's a mix of blue and purple. Artifacts should be included in testing but again, make it so they can't max them out. In the end, maybe you have 3 dps with 140 artis and a tank with 160s and a healer with a mix and a troll with 180s. Either way, test that group out. That group, having knowledge and skill, should still be able to be elite. Testing with max artis and all that is fine too but yeah, should be much easier maxed out. Because that's how not being pay to win works. Again, we whine that the game is p2w then force the devs to make it p2w every single time
    • Like x 2
  13. AV Loyal Player

    The irony is that what the public considers the meta with EoG isn't particularly smart or good, especially not for most boss fights. I don't know how it got so ingrained into peoples' minds it was the best/only way to do things outside of some specific fights in specific raids. More often than not it's just straight-up general category cheesing and contributes less to boss damage than what the same player would do if they hadn't SC'd w EoG at all. It's not a universally good offensive artifact (aside from SC feeding). There are very few players using it correctly and otherwise good DPS running it all the time is horrible min:max and reducing their meaningful performance where it matters most.

    The degree to which people have built Prec such that its current performance is dependent on other players feeding their EoG is silly but top prec and top might were balanced a few years ago... then prec got nerfed a few times while Might got new toys (Amulet and Pied Piper's Flute). A bunch of sweaty precs EoG stacking with all the "look at what they need to do to mimic even a fraction of Might's power" silliness (eg. OMAC Trinket), and I guess even macros (but if someone's macroing combat they may as just outright hack at that point really...) can't generally hope to tie a top-tier might player who's not running EoG in boss damage anymore, regardless of power, and there are only certain powers with extremely clean Might ST where they'll beat it in the general category (and then only if the same Might player makes the correct choice of not cheesing AoE damage in a fight where EoG is just overtly cheesing AoE damage).

    As long as there's this public perception that prec is better than it is for some reason, it's gonna remain stagnant.... which is especially crummy for players who actually enjoy Prec, given our current artifact lull.


    If good players are testing, the results will be the same no matter what they're using. The gap between powers in the right hands is pretty negligible overall and the gap between most of the testing community and the general population is so extreme that testers could practically just spam weapon taps and still outperform most pugs. The key is in understanding that adjustments tend to be a bit overboard, so feedback notes need to be extremely careful and extremely specific (which is the exact opposite of the feedback they get once something goes live). There also needs to be some reality checks in regards to what the content is for (eg. "this is only around for a month or so, people need to do 50/250 of these, it should be balanced relative to other STU content, and there are no feats in it so maybe crusading for it to be an above-average challenge isn't going to go over well.") In-content feats have always been where the challenge is supposed to lie. Not sure why there's been this weird push to make simply clearing content at all insurmountable for all but the 99th+ percentile but it's dumb and wouldn't be healthy for the game at all if that became the case.
    • Like x 5
  14. Darth Piper Loyal Player

    Well, being outright technical it is possible. However, it requires a special profile, license, etc, in order to install it and licenses for those cost money and can only be installed on registered PlayStations. These are specifically developer licenses and they need them internally for any personnel working for Daybreak to be able to use them on the PS4s owned by the dev and QA teams. They probably have to use Sneakernet in order to install it too... which means you would not receive the updated client for 24-48 hours, and there is no guarantee that the client will install on your PS.

    It's like doing app development for the iPhone or iPad. You can actually install the app on your personal device for testing, but they also have "developer" and "enterprise" licenses that allow you to install a developer or company profile and then further install it on any device that has such a profile. The price for such license make it cost prohibitive to anyone outside of your organization. The enterprise license is usually for in-house applications on devices owned by your employer.
    • Like x 1
  15. Illumin411 Loyal Player

    He's probably referring to Save the Universe's return as a seasonal event with new upscaled content.
  16. KneelBeforeZodd Dedicated Player

    I think the Ares health buff was a bit too much, the raid already requires 3 tanks and nobody wants to spend 1 hour blocking and spamming orbitals/supercharges, there isnt a lot of skill involved in surviving 5, 6 or 7 essences, its pretty much pure luck.

    That said, everything else was ok, I dont see why nerf it. Even more because at this point everyone has a decent amount of renown and all raids will be coming back soon for those who dont. Having TodE has a more challenging raid isnt really a issue.

    Now some people here are expecting too much, its not because you beat a elite raid with a full group of 200 artifact, maxed allies, meta loadouts and tactical spamming that a raid is fine, the game isnt balanced around the top 32 players. Elite should be only for a small % of players, but not that small. You dont get to test a raid with your group of people and dictate its outcome.
    • Like x 3
  17. MsTickle Fate Devoted Player

    "We" do?

    How do "we" "know" this? Because I've played with Mepps in the past five years. More than once. I played with Spytle a couple of times, back in the day, as well. You're going to tell me this never happened and I was hallucinating?

    "Know" doesn't mean what you think it means. What's your uncontestable evidence/proof?
    • Like x 2
  18. Proxystar #Perception

    Finally someone else with a common sense approach - well said

    [IMG]

    to be honest though we both know likely that the push to gate 'clearing content' simply comes from a place of toxic elitist narcissism stemming from a few less than friendly end game sweaty's ;)
    • Like x 12
  19. Kimone Luthor Genetech Clone

    oh snap...
    • Like x 3
  20. 1 ncmike Dedicated Player

    I know that and I also know they said Save The Universe will be back in the future...
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