Change to Dodge

Discussion in 'Battle of the Legends (PvP)' started by KodyDerp, Sep 8, 2016.

  1. Karasawa Loyal Player

    You know how tapping block keeps you in the block animation for half a second? And you know how even after your character stops blocking you can still get blockbroken for a short while after? Basically, every time you block there is a short window of time where the game forces you to be vulnerable to blockbreakers--this is the vulnerability window of block, and it's intended this way.

    However, there is an exploit to REMOVE the vulnerability window of block completely, and that is Dodge. Any ability that grants you Dodge can be used to bypass block's vulnerability window. For example, if you block then immediately use Forward Flip it becomes almost impossible to blockbreak you unless it was a lucky guess. You can also block then immediately lunge with your weapon for the same effect, but this is obviously less safe.

    The big problem though was going from block into roll (cancelling block's vulnerability window), then going from roll back into block (cancelling roll's vulnerability window), AND THEN you could even roll again causing the game to glitch out and just put you back into neutral standing stance with no vulnerabilities at all.

    It's this kind of BS that the devs either refused to fix or didn't understand why it was a problem to begin with that caused me to lose interest. These shenanigans came to define "high" level play. You either had to learn how to do it yourself or get the F out.

    Vid:
    https://forums.daybreakgames.com/dc...powered-abilities.264868/page-10#post-3532609
    • Like x 2
  2. Karasawa Loyal Player

    Basically, the devs are kinda missing the mark. Being able to block while in the middle of a roll was never the true problem, and in fact is incredibly useful in PvE when trying to block 1-shot mechanics in time.

    The actual problem is that all Dodge-granting abilities, including Dodge Roll, cancel any and all downsides to blocking. Being able to block in the middle of your roll makes that problem worse, true, but it is not the root of the problem.
    • Like x 2
  3. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    Oh ok, I noticed but that didn't think that it went away from rolls since I caught bb's sometimes right as the roll animation started, guess it was luck xD
  4. Lithiumz Well-Known Player

    Ahoy Kara, I told the developers about these issues more than two years ago. None of them listened. I have reason to believe Loche and the rest of the developers are out right oblivious to the effect this block roll has on the game. It's a horrible mechanic for PvP because you literally have to spend the whole match rolling around and lunging like I said in my earlier post. This makes PvP for many really really really really really really terrible and not enjoyable. I hope you are listening devs, most of your user base is leaving because you haven't listened and this is one of the biggest things people hate about PvP despite the few dummies that defend this "mechanic".

    Anyway, I am really tired. School and work are taking the majority of my time these days. I don't know if I'll ever come back to this game just because of my personal life and the negative feeling I have about the developers of this game.
  5. Clutchmeister Loyal Player


    I'm afraid that this statement is not true. Dodge used to work in this way, but it was adjusted some years ago.

    Currently if someone uses an ability such as front/backflip and their opponent lands a block break during the window, they will get immunity but not land the damage or the hard stun for it.

    Rolling was the only way to truly remove the window (and even then, it still lingered for a VERY short period once the roll had commenced which led to the same effect that happens when you typically land a block break during the block window when dodge is applied)
  6. Lithiumz Well-Known Player

    Regardless, this rolling stuff made the game highly enjoyable for many people and many great players. You know your friend Buzz? Ask yourself why he quit. Ask yourself why most of the great pvpers have quit that despised this mechanic. You know I am one of them. Kara is one of them. Buzz is one of them. There are so many others that have as well.


    The block-roll cancel stuff is AIDS.
  7. Karasawa Loyal Player

    This statement is true. If you block then immediately dodge (using roll, lunge, or front flip) you cannot be blockbroken other than through blind luck.
    • Like x 2
  8. Clutchmeister Loyal Player


    Except you still land immunity when you block break someone who uses dodge, you just don't get the damage or the knockdown (which I already said...). This is completely different from rolling, which does completely remove the window.

    If it completely removed the "window", you wouldn't acquire immunity.

    So no, all forms of dodge DON'T remove the window.

    It's even in the videos you linked kara.
  9. Karasawa Loyal Player

    Okay, and..? Anyone can see from my vid that I got immunity from BBing my opponent even though he didn't get blockbroken. It's just further evidence that he would have been blockbroken but for this exploit. I did not get immunity when he rolled, which just shows that roll is even more broken.. probably because Clutch or one of his friends PMed the devs whining that it's not fair that they still get immunity, lol. Just kidding :)

    Still not seeing where I've been inaccurate.
    • Like x 1
  10. Clutchmeister Loyal Player


    You said all forms of dodge remove the window, which it doesn't. If it did, you wouldn't land immunity.

    This isn't an exploit, it is intended. Dodge was purposefully changed from giving 0 immunity/no hard stun/no damage, to giving immunity/no hard stun/no damage 2-3 years ago.

    That's it really.




    [IMG]
  11. HoiiowDreamz Dedicated Player

    Clutch has confirmed he's the Hitler of PC PvP. Quick, someone make a video like Odyssey did for the original clipping changes but with rolling.
    • Like x 2
  12. Karasawa Loyal Player

    If you block, the game forces you to be vulnerable to blockbreaker for a set amount of time. Dodge removes that time so you can't be blockbroken. This is an exploit.

    It's the same as that glitch with double tapping Enter on a keyboard to open the chat UI that let you come out of block instantly that the devs fixed. These are all little tricks and glitches that let you exploit the counter system.
  13. Clutchmeister Loyal Player


    An exploit is defined as:

    The use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, or speed, etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.

    The devs intended for dodge to prevent block breaks, however adjusted it to still provide immunity when block broken with the counter window up.

    As for the chat cancelling roll/double tapping cancelling block, that was not intended. They are far from being the same thing.

    By the whole definition of what an "exploit" is, you're wrong.
    • Like x 1
  14. Karasawa Loyal Player

    Lol really? All you got for me is "you're wrong"? Sigh.

    Devs please adjust Dodge so that it no longer closes the vulnerability window of Block. Thanks.
    • Like x 3
  15. Soul Dedicated Player

    Clutch starting an argument for no productive reason whatsoever? say it isn't so.. :rolleyes:

    Everyone sees the bottom line here, or at least those not fixated on conflict.. people who actually care about the change itself and not how to wrap it up in empty words.

    Bottom line:
  16. Brother Allen Loyal Player

    No where in Clutch's post does Clutch attempt to start an argument. He simply wanted to correct Kara's statement regarding Dodge closing all windows.

    He wasn't snarky or rude. He simply stated what needed to be stated and left it at that. If you or Kara choose to try and make it out that he wanted to start an argument, then that is on you two.

    In the end, both Kara and Clutch can't back either of their claims up with Developer quotes. They are both assuming. One assumes it is intended. One assumes it is not. Until a Developer confirms yea or nae then it is just speculation.

    So in the end, the question could be:

    "Is Dodge working as intended?"

    Then from there a discussion could be had on whether or not it should be adjusted from working as it currently does.
  17. Soul Dedicated Player

    Do you realize the massive logical gap between this statement:
    And the motive to a statement like this:

    Brice, It's nice and all that you're trying to defend your friend.
    But in our world, when you say other people are wrong for no reason at all, or otherwise call them a liar, you're actively looking for conflict.
    Not to mention It's not very smart either.. no surprise there I suppose, some people care more about being "right" than smart.
  18. Brother Allen Loyal Player

    Souls...if you found any of what I stated or what Clutch stated as an attempt to start an argument then that's on you. That is not the intent.

    You know as well as I do if Clutch really wanted to start an argument he could have been WAY more offensive or smart-***'d.
  19. Soul Dedicated Player

    Honest to god, I don't keep a Clutch smart-*** scale chart.;)

    And although you would very much like it not to be the case, your friend did actively look for an argument, or he would've focused on the change itself / his contribution to the matter, rather then other people making their own. (Especially people with which he has a "History" with.)

    You're welcome to try and spin this towards me as much as you'd like, the act is old, and no one is entertaining it anymore.
  20. Clutchmeister Loyal Player


    It wasn't for no reason at all, I just don't won't wildly incorrect statements being thrown around as truth on the forums.

    Considering that the devs can only spare time for very little fixes on PvP currently, such incorrect statements could lead to the developers focusing on "exploits" which aren't even exploits in the first place.


    No, I wasn't. I simply described why what Kara was saying was incorrect.

    It was you who actually came in here looking for an argument, contributing nothing to the discussion we were having.

    Talk about the pot calling the kettle black eh?