Can we stop using excuses

Discussion in 'Battle of the Legends (PvP)' started by TraylacktheOriginal, Feb 13, 2021.

  1. TraylacktheOriginal New Player

    I have made this comment in an post a few days ago about the current way PvP Arena is. I know this is going to get comment after comment saying " There not going to do anything PvP is dead get over it". Well what if that kind of talk is the reason they don't care. I feel that if enough people make there voices heard on the topic it will get some sort of response. People still enjoy PvP. I still enjoy PvP when I actually play against someone who's not using cheap gimmicks to win. People have had some really good ideas on this forumn to try and fix this problem but they get bombarded by people who just tell them to give up. Stop that your not helping. I'm not asking for one huge update dedicated to just PvP, all I ask is to have an update here and there to show that you care about it.
    • Like x 4
  2. fm0987 Committed Player

    It would be nice, kinda doubt it will ever happen. Too much focus on artifacts, time capsules etc. pve does get quite boring after a while.
    • Like x 4
  3. TraylacktheOriginal New Player

    Exactly I wouldn't expect them to just skip PvE updates all I'm saying is there should be a group of developers on the team to just work on pushing small PvP updates so that the focus doesn't get taken away from PvE. Do they not have enough team members who work on the game.
    • Like x 3
  4. BƖack Dedicated Player

    I agree.
    • Like x 3
  5. ObsidianChill Community "Trusted"

    The issue is that every developer that worked on PvP in the past is no longer with DCUO, even before the whole monetize PvP so it generates income conversation, it would literally take one of the developers learning PvP and Tunso's combat system from the ground up and then after all that they would have to be able to properly create the changes either they think or we think should happen.

    It's like a school taking away Calculus as a subject and all the students really like calculus and kept complaining that they wanted it back so a teacher would have to not only learn calculus themselves but then be able to teach it. Doesn't sound that easy does it?
    • Like x 3
  6. SugarHoneyIcedTeaMix Well-Known Player

    You don't have to give up. Keep hope alive as long as possible
    Arqueiro Robusto had an entire thread with video evidence full of bugs with several legends characters and all it got was a thank you for the report, then he had to make another thread to address the same issues and batuba stepped in to fix a chunk of those issues. Well batubas gone now. So you can hope the next guy wants to sit down and learn calculus(aka or current pvp) But ask yourself pvp has been busted for years now, you mean to tell me they couldn't hire a dev or two years ago to primarily learn and build a decent pvp structure … or is it that they themselves don't care as well
    • Like x 2
  7. Shalayah Committed Player

    The way you put it does sound like a pretty reasonable “excuse”

    Who wants to put all that time and work into learning PVP just to improve it for a possibly that it may be poorly received? Stuff like that could definitely push people away from wanting to work on PVP.
    • Like x 1
  8. TraylacktheOriginal New Player

    I 100% understand what your saying. But what would stop the school from hiring a Calculus teacher to teach calculus. In other terms why not hire a developer who maybe has experience in PvP to come in, look at the system, and do what your saying. I can understand if it's a financial problem but it doesn't seem that's the issue. Btw love your content your a big help to this game.
    • Like x 1
  9. Qwantum Abyss Loyal Player

    My guess is because PVP doesnt directly generate any or much money?
    When you do a cost analysis, part of the equation is time to recoup finds and to get your cost analysis approved. You have to provide an acceptable recoup time for the funds and what the ROI is (return on investment).
    Im willing to speculate the cost analysis just doesnt warrant hiring even 1 person for this. Im betting its just not there. Your talking an vestment well into/over 6 figures.
    By the time you factor salary, benefits, PTO, training, and the endless areay of resources needed its a HUGE in estment even for just 1 new employee and for PVP we’d need a few im guessing. In the end your realistically talking about a million dollar or multi million dollar investment with no guarantee of return and they have data suggesting PVP doesnt make $ so i cant see them being so foolish as to invest.
    Maybe im wrong (i do cost analysis for my job all the time). I hope i am.
    But think im correct on this and if i were them i’d give it an easy hard no based on my off the top cost analysis alone. You’d need to have some good data an a great sales pitch to sway me
    • Like x 1
  10. ClowninAround Well-Known Player

    They won't hire someone to come look at and maybe fix a game mode that doesn't generate them any money.

    That's why PvP had been left to die. It makes no money, so any and all work done on it is literally flushing money away.

    You may not want to hear it, but it's true. Now if the people who want PvP to be fixed were willing to have it monetized somehow, maybe they would work on it. Until then, nope.

    And I know, "but other games have PvP and don't monetize it!" True, but they usually make their money through style microtransactions which this game refuses to do and instead forces us to gamble on Time Capsules.

    So it all comes down to money. If they can't make it off of something, it gets ignored.
    • Like x 2
  11. Mentaldope40 Dedicated Player

    I personally don't think they care anymore, if they're making good profit doing what they're doing currently then I guess they don't feel the need to stress the point, but tbf I think it's a shame since this game was founded on the idea of PvP (Heroes vs Villains), but now that is all a broken wasteland that haven't seen the day in years, like the op said, all it would take is atleast little updates to show that you care about your PvP playerbase.
    • Like x 1
  12. Kimone Luthor Genetech Clone

    Any attempted PVP revamp would require three things beforehand in order to be successful.

    A.) Removal of third-party software access: This is the most difficult item from the standpoint of developer implementation.

    There's no point in fixing PVP when speed hacking is still a thing. And it's still very much a thing, and it still very much doesn't get follow-up when it occurs. At the very least, tightening up access so that only passive software (like parser results collation software) is the maximum involved or allowed type. This has to happen first, otherwise there's no point in doing any of the rest of it, no one wants to play a game where no one cares if you cheat.

    B.) Monetization: This is actually the easiest to approach since it's already occurring.

    Legends are already sold on the Marketplace. Fix the egregious and obvious balance issues (you can start with Two-Face); no one wants to play a rigged game either. Supplement Marketplace income by offering a combined Mark of Valor/ Mark of Legend boost (60 minutes, x2 gain threshold). A Marketplace purchasable that makes the PVP grind less "gouge my own eyes out"? Yes please. Tickets will sell themselves after that.

    C.) Community Consensus: This will never actually happen, but I'm going to outline why it has to.

    There's no point in "fixing" PVP in a community where literally no one will budge from the personal assertion that their way, personally, is best. They removed PSR, people want PSR back (PSR was dumb - learn mechanics and develop a fighting style); they removed cash gear from the vendor, people want cash gear back. OMG Fire is too OP, OMG Mental is too OP, OMG Healing is too OP, OMG... The list goes on.

    Right now? In-game PVP is a loose confederation of people dueling in the respective HQs, a handful of people who still venture into the Arena even though it's rife with speed-hacking bastards, and occasional open-world sniping and ganking.

    The actual dialogue surrounding PVP makes a bunch of 10 year olds gathered around a Street Fighter 2 machine sound like dialogue on the Martha Stewart show by comparison. There is no sportsmanship, there is no shared sense of direction, and there is no common prevailing code of conduct. It's literally just people shouting epithets at each other, then crying foul when they lose even though no terms were discussed beforehand.

    It's pretty much impossible to even WANT to fix PVP for a community that is that divided and that abusive.

    You address A and C, B will resolve itself.
    • Like x 6
  13. Kimone Luthor Genetech Clone

    immediately after that, of course, we run into "it would literally take one of the developers learning PvP and Tunso's combat system from the ground up and then after all that they would have to be able to properly create the changes either they think or we think should happen."
    • Like x 1
  14. TraylacktheOriginal New Player

    Thank you to all that have replied to this thread. I now understand exactly what goes into making this change possible and that was my goal for this. Now would it be possible for the community to step up and make a game plan for this issue so the developers would only need to implement it. There's a large enough community that if us as players could come up with the ideas necessary to make this idea possible then would it work out. Like what if we actually gave them said idea to monitize it and balance these issues could something come of it. If not please explain why thank you.
    • Like x 1
  15. Qwantum Abyss Loyal Player

    Ur never gonna get a concensus. Most arent willing to compromise even a bit
  16. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    There's a simple rule in business about people saying they will buy a product you create. That rule is "90% of them are lying" so the devs would need to see an incredible amount of interest. 30 forum users aren't it. The majority of the player base does not even want/ care about it. If they told us that we could have our monthly subscription cost be $30 instead of $15 and then pvp would get fixed, most would probably say no thanks. I would. Because I don't care about pvp at all. I'm not the devil for not caring, I'm just someone that would rather play something else to fight randoms.

    There's been plenty of posts with decent ideas for monetization and plenty of posts about what needs to be fixed. All have been either ignored or commented on that there are no plans. I'm told I'm a hater because I tell players to move on. Not hating, just trying to get them to literally give up. If it happens, huge huge huge if, it would be so far away with the amount of issues they have to focus on to get the bread and butter smoothed out on the pve side.
  17. Control Creed Well-Known Player

    Well... personally I wish they would rotate the instances like Legends PVE for 4 man and above, that would be a start, you can't even queue for most of the instances anymore. There's a lot of things they could do without too much work a lot of these "give up content / pay more" arguments are nonsense, the game makes more than it has in awhile and they put out less content than they did back during the monthly release days.

    I get what your saying... having said that, I'd be shocked if they put any thought into it since PVP specifically doesn't really have much of a coherent business model from what I can see.
  18. thedemonocus Loyal Player

    All they really need to do for a quick pvp fix is disable arts in pvp and get rid of roles and make everyone in pvp dps so tank and healers are no longer invincible. This won't fix every issue but it would make pvp a lot better than it is now and its something that could be done in 1 quick update.
    • Like x 1
  19. Illumin411 Loyal Player

    There’s always Injustice 2!
  20. Radstark Active Player

    You know what? I've always hated PvP in MMOs... But I could probably like it and play it if they pulled it out correctly. I think that even one big PvP-only update would be welcome in hindsight.

    About not having any more developers specialized in PvP, they've been recruiting people lately, not only for the new game. Light up your blue power rings.