Buff controllers against healers

This is response to the other thread but I feel the other thread comes off as a tank complaining against healers when the real issue is that controllers need to be better against healers.

I'm an ice tank in the game and yes I do get my butt kicked by healers, unless they ain't too great, don't have better gear etc but I get beat by healers in general, that's how the system works; however, the issue I have is that I see controllers not do so well against a healer in pvp.

I do lots of 2v2 matches and I do get controllers sometimes teaming with me and I check and they have decent gear but when I see them go against healer, I'm a little shocked at how mediocre they are against them. Now as a tank if I'm facing a controller, I don't have such an issue. So something seems off imo with the balance that controllers have against healers. Obviously I'd like to hear from controllers on this issue because I've never played as one and my evidence is just anecdotal but from what I've seen, I can see an issue.

I run a controller and yes I have issues with healer (not as much as tanks but thats ok)

I keep going back to one issue when dominance was reworked controllers lost out and control effects have almost no bearing in pvp. As I can no longer strip power pools fast enough to remove healing and there is so much burst healing that I can not eliminate.

Reading another thread I suspect there may be some bias in the design due to a developer's favoured role.

I play healer all the time in PvP and can honestly say that against many trollers I can win a 1vs1 fight, so I can understand the possible need for a buff. The problem lies in how exactly to do it without completely breaking the balance, I've seen many trollers calling for the ablility to completely remove a healers ability to heal will debuffed which is frankly stupid. Since a healer is likely to have no powers on his bar that do anything besides heal he just turns into a punching bag at this point.

(As an aside I believe that tanks ability to strip PoT from a trollers is stupid as well, the tank debuff should merely reduce the trollers vita for the duration.)

Just had an intersting idea (imo), what if when you debuffed a healer the amount of dominance you have over his modified resto was added to your damage verses him? This would mean that fully specced trollers can rip him a new one but DPSers in troller role wouldn't change so much.

Thoughts?

My troller alt DESTROYS healers in pvp, i don't see the problem. A good troller will beat a healer ANYDAY. If a troller can't beat a healer than there is seriously something wrong with how they are fighting.

Sorry but it really comes down to the player far more than it probably should in troller vs healer matchups. In at least 2 or 3 matches I have had in the last day I have taken on more than one troller at a time and been able to hold them off.

This.

Wasn't the other thread enough? Had to make another?
Also, devs preferred class is tank.
Notice all Spytles characters are tanks? every single one of them?

If I've noticed anything since returning, it's that tanks are nigh immortal now, especially ice.

Controllers need no buff vs healers.
There are too many other things at play now, and you people keep failing to realize that. I.e. Immunities.
Sure, you can debuff a healer, and they can't heal. But if you can't beat them at counter mechanics, they will farm immunity off you, and take no damage at all.

That is completely unrelated to healing, it's just a mechanic of the game.
When you play healer, and 5v1 becomes the norm, you get pretty good at being defensive.

1v1 if a troller can't take the healer, there's really no other way to say it than, that controller needs to elevate their playing.

Of course, that's everything.
See, the problem is, these people think that their counter classes should just roll over and die, and that doesn't happen for any of them.

I've stomped healers plenty of times on my fire tank. Why? They healers were easy pickings.

ok that's so wrong to say a developer favors healer class.
i wonder how many trolls say devs favor ice tanks (fight an earth tank as a troll and you will cry nerffff)
and what makes you think devs favor healers? i mean look at the control class they are the best at everything damage. its the same corntroll class that people cry nerf nerf everyday.
healers only have shields but troll classes has both shields and breakouts. if i wanted to talk like you i would say the devs favour troll classes. how's that?

On the contrary, when I get debuffed by most healers in PVP most of my health, critical healing, and toughness are greatly reduced by most healer debuffs (mainly Sorcery and Nature) that it practically appears as I am a very low leveled DPS with not much damage period.

A friend of mines is a good decent PVPer who plays the Controller role. He dislikes greatly and feels as though little to not much effort is brought to the table with his debuffs and crowd control skills even against Healers. He prefers to Damage than be a Controller in PVP.

Personally I do agree that Controllers may need a slight buff against Healers, I don't think it is fair that a well 82 CR PVP Controller versus a 82 CR PVP Healer should be struggling whereas a 80 CR PVP Healer can have little to no struggle with a 83 CR PVP Tank.

As a long time Controller is say no. It's not the Healer that is fhe problem, it's all the mods and trinkets that came along with Turf. Against a Healer with equally good or better gear than me. I will take them down majority of the time, with them using everything in their load out, popping sodas, etc.

But, against a Healer that has all the turf mods in his gear like explosive block, shields, etc, then pair that with Henchmen or Supply Drop and on top of his load out and popping sodas. I'll have a very hard time beating him if I even can. If that Healer has another player backing him up, then I have even less of a chance against him.

So the problem isn't the Healers being OP'd, it's the Turf items that make it seem that way.

How many times does this need to be said before they understand.
This with immunities, if you can't counter them, good grief you've no hope. None.

This is more on how classes are designed;

For note, all healer debuff does is remove the tank role buff. So that's the 60% hp/80% healing for fire, toughness/defense for ice + shields.

That is the same as any other role.

Controllers remove the 65% healing for healer role via halving restoration, and can cancel shields etc with powers. They can further reduce it by lowering heals in by 25%.

All the role debuffs are actually very similar in function.

Everyone becomes a 'bad dps' without dps buffs when hit with counter role, except controllers.
They can have shields cancelled, but their power regen isn't subject to a debuff. You can only remove it, but they can recast it right away.

If anything, controllers therefore have it easiest in role vs role. They suffer no debuffs at all.

Don't forget to account for gear, as well as the individual skill of players. On my Tank, I have beaten Healers before and on my Controller, I have beaten Tanks before. While I agree that the RPS system isn't perfect and barring any outside goodies, Controllers have the tools that are more than capable of handling Healers.

Lol if your troller can't beat a healer its you.. So much bs from troller class players. Play a healer you will understand.. If its not you guys crying about tanks then its healers. You are not the be all end all role.


Blame home turf. Then you will understand what pvp leagues are qqing about

It changed a long time ago if you are not a decent troller U will need help...

The problem is just inherent to the classes themselves.

Their debuffed healing is more than your zero healing.

It takes 2 debuffs to cripple a healer instead of just one.

And some powersets aren't lucky enough to have their debuffs also be useful attacking powers.

I did not say devs favour healers.

This is more my assumption and it affects both pve and pvp. The favoured class is has easier target from its submissive target and a good challenge from the dominant role.
Dominance now has more benefit for tanks than it does controllers.

This makes no sense.

Controller when attacking a healer gains confidence, and debuffs a healers restoration by half.
That effectively removes 'healer' role from the healer.

Healer role gains a 65% bonus to healing and protection powers i.e. Boon of Souls gain 100%.

The debuff removes the first bit, and any offensive power cast on a healer will strip the shields.

The -25% healing in, is just a bonus power controllers have, and its use is not restricted to healers. It can be cast on anyone.

You people are grasping at straws.

EDIT* If you people want to 'nerd rage' at something because you can't beat it, look at the mainframes in your lairs.

No.

35% confedence, 7% defence/toughness debuff, 50% resto debuff, 25% heal in debuff, ability to shatter shields, out lasting power pool.

If You can beat a healer with all of that then you seriously go out played.

Lol I did just notice as someone pointed out in here that trolls are usually on the forums crying on both fronts about tanks and heals.

Anyways, you're going about this argument the wrong way. Healers are digging into every role right now because home turf shenanigans are still allowed in pvp. If they removed the pretty much free damage stuff like orbital, henchman, and sidekick you would have an easier time (supply drop and mods are fine in my opinion). And if you're losing to healers one on one without any of that free damage stuff then your argument has no merits.

This is why I always get a little frustrated every time I make a topic concerning real problems in pvp that I actually spent time carefully putting together because I'll get like 4 responses and one of them will be a troll. And then I'll refresh my topics and lo and behold some guy made the same topic only he would be crying about everything instead of putting together solid arguments and of course everyone and their mom has posted in it.

Never fails to baffle me lol

It defiantly has potential, in both tank and troll's case the dom stat is normally lower than the opposing stat at a 1=1 rate.

That edit was entirely unnecessary. Calmly giving an opinion is not nerd raging.