Breakthrough Failures, what gives?

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by DesertMP, Oct 15, 2021.

  1. DesertMP New Player

    Tried to get a breakthrough on artifact item. After 10 consecutive failures, I stopped trying. What gives? What is the actual rng equation used that determines the success or failure outcome?
    The lottery system of so many things in this game is annoying. [Took a character of mine years to attain the get all collections feat.] It would be nice if a player had to do a checklist of things to grind away at something and, if all items have been accomplished, then the achievement result WILL happen. No, don't give things away, but make it so effort put into grind actually pays off.
    • Like x 2
  2. TheLorax 10000 Post Club

    The Success Chance is listed right there above the catalysts. If the Success Chance is anything lower than 100% you want to use a Seal of Preservation to protect your catalysts from being destroyed in a failed breakthrough OR use a Seal of Completion to guarantee a successful breakthrough.
    • Like x 6
  3. Steamboat2302 Well-Known Player

    All it is is a random number generator I'm sure. With certain numbers, whether high or low numbers assigned to be fails.
  4. Catastroflare Well-Known Player

    Yep, that's RNG for you. I was in a similar boat too. Just had enough to take 3 arts past 80. Two of them were fine, the last one failed @ 80%. I don't know if you play Diablo 3, but the RNG reminds me of levelling legendary gems. Nothing like getting a failure @ 90%. haha
    • Like x 3
  5. Irvynnge Dedicated Player

    RNGeebus. I've had one fail on 80% multiple times, I've had one go through first try on 10%. it's how favourably or ill the Lords of Random look upon you at any given time. always use seals of preservation ( at least ).
  6. zNot Dedicated Player

    I wish they removed the fail chance for episode augmemts because artifacts already have this future that should be enough
    • Like x 2
  7. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    Well RNG is RNG....and it can be kind or evil from day to day. The best you can do is use seals and go slow as not to make a mistake when breaking through. At least they finally put seals back into the game other than MP purchase (used to be tradable so you could get them in the broker), which is a start at least. Not sure what level your 10 fails were at, but if it was 140+, that's not a surprise. Personally if I'm on a low one like 60 or 80 and get more than 1 fail, I stop. Some days you know you are just being hated on. Try again later or the next day and maybe the sun will shine on you.

    And they do have a feat checklist you can work's the 250 STU Raid feat. You can work on that for the next 10 years and it will pay off with a feat.

    Seriously though, trying to get RNG 'stuff' strictly by luck is a fools game. That same time you'd put in grinding a random collection drop, you can probably go hunt some other valuable things you have a much better chance of getting and buy your way to the completion. Judicious buying and trading of items will always work out faster than straight grind + RNG drops.
    • Like x 3
  8. PsySomatic Extra Life 2020

    Yeah, I had one fail back to back with a 95% chance to succeed, I literally got up and went outside when that second one broke..

    But later that day on another toon I had one go right through on 120 and 140.. RNG is one crazy biiiastard! :D
    • Like x 1
  9. OnlyNomad The One Above All

    I failed the breakthrough for an Artifact on my alt last weekend, it was a 95% chance of success too. Glad I used a seal but It was so frustrating to see that happen that I just shut my game off. That system is very predatory and scummy in my personal opinion but it's also part of a bigger problem plaguing the video game industry.
    • Like x 3
  10. SethZoulMonEl 10000 Post Club

    I am surprised it hasn't had more attention as a form of gambling. Sure, they put things like the Seal of Completion into games, but the overall system is still tantamount to gambling.
    • Like x 2
  11. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    I'd say it's less gambling than TCs as you don't really 'get' anything from Augment/Arti breakthroughs that has a 'value' to it. TC items have a straight cash (in game and sometimes IRL) value. You can't trade or sell artis or augs, so the only real benefit is progression.

    If something were to come around to address the TC gambling issue, maybe breakthroughs would get lumped in, but as a specific target...nah, TCs are the more egregious issue.
    • Like x 2
  12. SethZoulMonEl 10000 Post Club

    I agree with your assessment of TCs, but I disagree about artifacts. If artifact elements were not monetized through the Marketplace with a chance of losing that money on a breakthrough, I would view it differently. In my opinion, seals of completion are too necessary as a part of protecting investments in catalysts.
    • Like x 2
  13. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    I would have agreed 2 months ago, as they were ONLY in the MP. Now that you have a shot at getting them in game, the only difference is how long you are willing to wait to get those items vs spending money to accelerate the process. Not sure how you do it, but I can wait a loooong time. And honestly assuming you only do artis at 2x XP weeks which are about every 4 months or so, a member account can net 16 Destiny tokens in that time. That's 80 SOP and 8 SOCs you can have by the time a 2x week rolls around. Granted, that's spread around your full account, but so is the XP, so it should work out 'around' even in a needs vs supply scenario. Premiums are only 4 destiny tokens, but premium life isn't for the faint of heart....never has been.

    Stabilizers are also available in game, which is why I think neither will ever fall under a 'gambling' restriction. You don't 'need' to spend money on either...only to increase your chances/supply.

    As much as we hate them, I'd guess artis and TCs bring in a lot of money that keep the game going. I look at them as a necessary evil and only spend as much as I have to in order to maintain things now that most everyone has their 200s or 160s at least. I'm hoping that will be less with the in game seals. It would be cool if they could be replaced with cosmetics and things that would truly be 'optional' but my guess is it would severely impact the income and the game would suffer. I suppose it's one of those 'the evil you know is better than the one you do not', situations. I know Artis and TCs and know how to control things with them....what would replace them? Who knows? Allies it looks like for now, but what's next?
    • Like x 2
  14. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    Side Note: It's funny you say that about 'glad I used a seal'. A 95% is (I believe) level 40, which would cost 24 marks to replace the cats. To me I look at that as 3 OW bounties. Personally I take the hit on up to level 60 (costs 56 source to replace...or 7 OW bounties) and If I need some source, another alt just does a OW bounty round and buys the replacements. Seals cost money or destiny tokens, source is free and plentiful, so as long as it's not a TON of source lost, I'll save the seals.

    But yeah, a fail at 90%+ always stings a bit. Imagine going in for foot surgery and the Dr says "there is less than 10% chance of complications", then you come out of it hearing "well....I DID say there was a chance...that's RNG for you Hoppy...would you like to try again on the other foot?".
    • Like x 1
  15. the solowing Steadfast Player

    I have an idea! Scrap the breakthrough system entirely as its a arbitrary bottleneck.
    • Like x 1
  16. Bipolar Diva Well-Known Player

  17. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    That's great. So let's say 10% of the game revenue comes from seal sales and cat sales, what replaces that loss of revenue or are you figuring they'd just say 'meh....we make too much money, 10% less is fine'? Cosmetics would be nice, but we've proven as a group when pure cosmetics go on sale we complain (Batman cowl?) Again, that's the 'devil you know' scenario. Before pitching a revenue loss, come up with what will replace it and make sure it's something everyone will get onboard with.
    • Like x 1
  18. Tiffany6223 Dedicated Player

    How about this, with purchase of a membership breakthroughs are 100% guaranteed. I want to see more uptick in membership than Seal / TC sales. Those are all well and good but as a perk to encouraging membership sales perhaps this could be one?

    I really love this game and want it to succeed.
    • Like x 3
  19. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    Might work, but I'd guess many would just sub the week we are getting 2x weeks, do a ton of breakthroughs, then drop sub. Maybe not, but I know I would. So +15 for that month, whereas I would have spent at least $20(smallest MPC pack I'd buy) to get the seals IF I was buying any that round (depending on how many destinies I have saved up at that point). So for my premiums, they'd lose money. And for current members it's a straight loss as they'd never buy seals again. Still, not a terrible option.
    • Like x 2
  20. SethZoulMonEl 10000 Post Club

    What they could do is increase the percentage for breakthrough success based on the length subscribed with +10% per month or similar. 95% becomes 100% after one month, 90% becomes 100% after one month, etc. where 10% would be 100% after 9 months.