Dev Discussion Better Membership

Discussion in 'Concluded' started by Mepps, Apr 29, 2021.

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  1. TKMcClone Steadfast Player

    Why? Premium members might have some insight as to what it would take for them to see value in a Legendary Sub. I would sub up again if I had access to all content scaled for solo play.

    I also think you're under valuing vanity items as a unique member reward. Removing things from premium is just as valid a possibility as adding things to the sub. It's smarter to let Legendary members keep somethings they already have as a members, by taking those things away from premiums. Access to free vanity items is one of those things. Do you want free access to all earnable vanity items in the game? It's going to be difficult to maintain the longevity of new content if the Membership rewards eliminate too much grind. Vanity items fill the gap.
  2. Apollonia Dedicated Player

    There's some logic behind it actually. I don't think many people have thought it through. We wouldn't be here discussing this if the bulk of their revenue was coming from DLC sales and there's an argument to include memberships in that statement because they wouldn't risk subs downgrading to premiums if they were the bread & butter either. This essentially telegraphs that a significant bulk of their revenue is coming from TCs, replays.

    For the record I'm not advocating removing the cash cap on prems -- I'm staying out of that debate you have going between you both. Incase that wasn't clear.

    I only replied to your post to the other person because you were getting the thought process on this specific aspect of the issue, but it didn't appear you were applying the same reasoning to the rest of the issue when you were supporting Socrates' replies. I may be misunderstanding some of your posts tho.
    • Like x 1
  3. SocratesGS Well-Known Player

    1) LMAO why so aggro? Just because someone is calling you out on an internet forum for your foolish misconception of what is being asked of the community? Don't come here and talk about game development and strategy when you can't understand a single line asking for ideas on a specific topic. You're a consumer, not a developer. I'm not going to play the credentials game. Mepps knows what is on my resume from past conversations and that is the only person that would need to know about my professional background.

    2) Speaking of the request made of the forum community. Here's the criteria from the OP, it's really quite easy to understand.
    3) Sorry if you don't understand English very well. I surmised that as such when you mistakenly started to ask for the items below. I've taken the liberty to highlight things that are "one time code changes". They are not going to create new powersets and movements modes every month. They aren't going to make a style manager every month. They aren't going to revamp PVP every month. If you don't think those are one time code changes than you really are proving you have no idea about game development or sales and marketing of games. I suggest you sit down and let others discuss the topic seriously.

    On another note:
    It seems you are the one really triggered here. Are you trying to create a conspiracy theory of people connected to me in some way? *Gasp* Am I the illuminati to you? LMAO :D Watch out though, I don't need another stalker...
    • Like x 1
  4. The VL Active Player

    Because, if you read the original post from Mepps and understood it, or what I wrote right above the portion you quoted, this thread asks what people want included in their subscription.

    If you are not subscribed you can't have anything included in your subscription because your subscription does NOT exist in the first place. This is not the place to be asking for Free/Premiums increases.
    Its asking what people who are already subscribed want included. They take the priority here. Its off-topic and derailment to be requesting for improvements to Free/Premium when they have not taken any loss while Legendary subscription will be. They're getting the Free DLC Access.

    And no, I'm not undermining the value of vanity items. The reality, like I said earlier, is that the main draw for subscription is the DLC Access and Unlimited cash.
    They aren't going to take anything away from Free/Premium given the direction they've already went. You guys are getting Free DLC access.
    They're also not going to give away the Vanity items that people want such as OG Nimbus/Materials when they're long gone(making them free now is unlikely and will definitely be met with a storm of arguments).
    There also exists the concept of Booster Bundles and Time Capsules where these items are more likely to be. And lets not kid ourselves by thinking the marketplace items we currently have are anything you see people seriously going after in this game.

    Vanity items are incredibly less likely to please everyone than additional membership rewards due to the very nature of vanity items. Not everyone finds every vanity item desirable. Its subjective, its extra. Even adding new vanity items wouldn't cut it. They are one-off. A new vanity item would need to be added every month and the devs aren't going to be able to keep up adding vanity items let alone please everyone every time. Its not smarter, its silly and not all-encompassing. Plenty easier to up subscription rewards and please more of the subscribers.

    Also, membership rewards don't remove "longevity from content" or "shorten grinding." More replays for example don't necessarily mean the grind is shortened. Its not like they'll be granting 5000 replays a month to cause a significant impact nor does any reasonable person expect that many to be granted. People will go at whatever pace they desire due to the fact replay badges exist and can be purchased.
    • Like x 6
  5. TheWrecker Well-Known Player

    I think 1 of the Best ways to improve membership it's to improve the artifact system. When you have armed the materials A break through should be guaranteed. You put in all this time grinding and then you just lose it. That's not cool at all. That would be an easy change that wouldn't cost you a dime And every person who pays a membership would love that. In September I will be purchasing my 10th year long membership. I have seen many changes come and go. You guys have done awesome things with this game, thus me still being here. My point and saying all this is, as a long time player this would be such an improvement to the current system. Thank you for listening to the community and for your responses. This new era of transparency is refreshing.
    • Like x 2
  6. KneelBeforeZodd Dedicated Player

    Premiums and frees should also have the right of getting a artifact to max level, it makes no sense to (keep) lock (ing) 100% success rates behind a pay wall
  7. Zoe· YouTuber

    There is no such thing as Premium Members. Devs said it a couple times. You are either a member or you are not.
    • Like x 3
  8. Proxystar #Perception

    It does to the developers, for every artifact leveled there's a good chance each one done is giving the devs around $30 in seals alone, not including any purchased nth metal.

    let's say 40,000 players level just one artifact each, that's $1,200,000USD

    If those same members are buying a subscription at $10 a month each that is $400,000USD per month

    The only reason I say this is to outline the rationale where the devs are likely to not be too keen to surrender too much of that additional artifact revenue for membership, although its quite possible they might give a little it's unlikely they'll give the extremity of assured breakthroughs every time.

    The reality is there is massive revenue coming from these artifacts.
  9. KneelBeforeZodd Dedicated Player

    Yeah, that's true (And never done that math, most players have more than 3 artifacts, with at least 3 breakthroughs that require completion seals or dozens of preservation seals, so they may really be making a few millions on them).

    But I tried to say it more in like "we shouldn't trade a paywall for another paywall". Giving out free seals is cool and I suggested it as well, but if they tie the only free breakthroughs we may get are to membership only, then I'd rather keep it the way it is and keep begging for a better system, because once they do, we might never get a chance of in-game seals again.
  10. RunfromDanger Man Dedicated Player

    Oh I absolutely agree people put too much emphasis on artifacts. I do admit I have 3 artifacts leveled up to 200, but only because I wait until bonus artifact xp to use nth metal. However, you’re right there are people that are almost obsessed with making their artifacts max and finding the perfect combination of artifacts to make them as powerful as possible. That is actually why I suggest it though. Not for me, but for those that put too much emphasis on it.
  11. Proxystar #Perception

    Oh right, well yeah I mean to me the better system would be in game seals for members, not a free token seal each month, we can already buy that using our monthly DBC.

    I would much rather be given the opportunity to obtain seals as drops in game themselves, even if its just seals of preservation.
    • Like x 3
  12. Proxystar #Perception

    The people that put emphasis on artifacts don't need seal handouts though. I get it's a particularly beneficial perk for newer players and those building artifacts, but I myself and I'm certainly not the highest in terms of artifacts have 10 artifacts at rank 200.

    There are now very few artifacts I require to level, if I'm leveling any it's only a new one, any perk surrounding artifacts for a player like me would be very negligible.

    As I said above though a perk where members actually receive seals of preservation as in game drops though where I could use them for augments in DLC's as well or even alts would probably be far more beneficial than a free token seal once a month. :)

    That and if members had the penalty removed for feeding one artifact in to another, would be appealing, but would be less perpetual in its nature as opposed to receiving drops.

    Having to be subbed to receive the drop of seals would help keep people subbed ongoing.
  13. spikeat Well-Known Player

    I haven't read a lot in this thread and I'm here to throw in my 2 cents. I'm not going to speak for everyone but just on what my friends and I've been discussing for a long time.

    We've been playing on and off for the past 10 years and we have 600 SP. The value of the current membership is very stale for us as we have completed all style feats from time capsules, promethium lockboxes and vault. A few of us are missing 1-3 styles from old content and waiting for the old style vendor in the WT to be updated. Over the long time span, we have spent money on expanding our inventory slots (some maxed), additional character slots, replays, artifact components, armories ETC.

    We only run the newest Episode and are well stocked up on source marks, quarks and stabilizers. Personally I don't log in everyday to run stabilizer event since 95% of the time I choose the quarks option. As for the vault, i run that once a week, where i would just break open the box nearest to the exit for the art XP and leave. We've joked for years that IF the cash cap is ever lifted we would all drop our subscription. This is the only reason we still subscribe, to access unlimited cash cap in order to buy items and use on the broker.

    Speaking of cash cap, we find it annoying that while we are in an instance, premium players have to sell items to the vendor in order to repair their gear. With the current amount of money in game in relation to repair fees, either raise the cap high enough so premium/free players can repair or make repairs FREE.

    The main problem we struggle with in game is keeping up with the artifacts "SETS" for our alts. Content difficulty is created with artifacts in mind but leveling them up takes too long and the requirement of seals needed. If we could get monthly, a seal of completion and artifact xp, this would greatly help us at our tenure. We have OP gear every episode, where there is enough time to level up til the next episode, yet artifacts are also released every episode that cannot be completed within the same time frame. What's the logic behind this?

    If I was a new player, TWO free armories should be given. As a member they should be able to swap between both roles with armories. The current system baits them with one free armory and then gets them to buy another one for armories to be relevantly usable. Compared to the past, there are now a lot more items dropping from bosses. Along with holding onto crafting supplies from this Episode, new players with membership will need a lot more inventory space given.

    This request is a stretch but if you can grant us our 600 sp on our alts without buying replays, we would greatly appreciated.
    • Like x 1
  14. boibrion New Player

    A membership should entitle people to a section of the game that is reserved for members only, scrubs not allowed! I don't know what the new upcoming feature is but a membership should be a new feature too, and just open the game as much as possible for freeloaders. Your either a member or not, and members should be able to do something extraordinary that makes it a total game changer.
  15. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    Not that I'm advocating for cash cap removal or changes, but even if they took it away, membership still gives you $5 worth of MPC/DBC and $5 worth of replays already + 4 extra stabilizers a month. Assuming you subbed annually at $10 a month, you are still ahead if you plan on playing every month. Cash cap is for sure the biggest value item in membership OUTSIDE of those other 3 things, AND we don't know what they will add in to make membership better yet. Let's say its a monthly SOC or SOP pack worth $5 or maybe it will be bonus Nth, or better breakthrough chances as some have suggested. Assuming some value item is added that adds $5 or more worth of something everyone actually buys frequently, a sub will probably still be worth having, even if cash is made open to all or the cap is significantly raised.
    • Like x 1
  16. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    That was one of my original suggestions (and I've suggested it before). Put seals in Promethium boxes...maybe at the same rate as the auras or a vault ticket. Members can open up to 3 a day with membership and 'earn' them getting the shot at way more than 1 a month given in a 'grant'....and the promethium boxes are already programmed....just add them to the loot table.
    • Like x 1
  17. Miserable Committed Player

    Respectfully, you're missing the point when you say "that is not what they bought."

    You know what else Premium players haven't (explicitly) bought? Four character slots, additional inventory slots, additional bank slots, broker slots, and the ability to trade and mail items.

    Then why do they have this? Because those are the things the devs decided to include in this Premium "package." All people are saying is that the current cash cap is outdated and goes against the current direction expressed by the devs, that the Premium "package" in 2021 should include a slightly higher cash cap.

    It sounds like all you're saying is that it shouldn't change because it's the way it's always been.

    As for it making your membership worse, it really wouldn't. You are grossly exaggerating the effect that a slightly higher cash cap for Premium would have on membership. In fact, you haven't actually made it clear that you understand that we're talking about a slight cash cap increase and not unlimited cash access. Most of your arguments would be better applied to the latter.

    As for a higher cash cap affecting the amount of people who sub, this is doubtful too. It would be silly to think that any significant number of players subscribes for the sole reason of ease of repairing (do not confuse this with unlimited cash access) and nothing else. Who has exclusive access to the benefits of unlimited cash access right now? Only members. Who would have exclusive access to the benefits of unlimited cash access if Premiums got a cash cap increase? Only members. Those who subscribe for the cash access now would continue to do so after a Premium cash cap increase.

    I've realized that I was probably wrong to bring this topic up in the first place and that it has less relevance than I initially thought. In my previous posts, I said that a higher cash cap should be taken into account in the balancing act of the new membership plan, but in reality, an increase from 3k to, say, 20k, 50k, or even 100k is so insignificant to members that if it were to happen, it probably doesn't warrant any extra sauce on this new membership.
  18. Big-Daddy_Serius New Player

    I would like to see yall do something about our orbitals,backups,supply drops like let them be in that vendor in our base but only if we equipped it first and let us be able to pick which one we want to use.

    And please let us have a shared money bank and make the shared bank bigger
  19. Shark Dental Devoted Player

    I think people are forgetting that this is a feedback thread versus a thread in General Discussion. Some of these arguments seem about to get the thread locked.
    • Like x 7
  20. TheWrecker Well-Known Player

    I 100% disagree. That should be 1 of the many parts that comes with membership. If you want that you should pay a membership. If not enjoy your 10 years worth of free content
    • Like x 1
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