Battle Roles...yay or nay?

I think if DPS's didnt feel so restricted or "clamped" the whole battle roles wouldnt be as big of a debate as it is.

This is my gameplay footage in War Crimes. Tanking is my priority...but the active tanking playstyle is very fun. I was in the instance with lower cr toons. 1 DPS 1 Healer and 1 Troll. The DPS didnt make it into the Dr Fate fight because the healer started it without him making it in on time. So numbers are a bit exaggerated to what it could have been. But overall in the end it was an easy run no real hiccups at all. I would like to see others in battle roles...although Ive seen enough "Jackhammering" Earth Battletanks.

Does anyone else have footage of their battle role in action? I also wouldnt mind critique on what I could improve or change...to better suit my group.

Since battle roles are the biggest way to make support roles appealing. I believe it is the devs best interest to make playing battle roles much easier than they currently are. The revamp did help in a big way. But I still think there are things that can be done to help support roles do more damage in general.

Simply to the point where like in other MMOs where playing as a support role in any content does not hinder you or the group.

Also I do believe all support roles should have a supercharge generator built in their main move.

Controllers already have it in their debuffs.

Tanks should have it in their pulls or shields

Healers should have it in their priority heal

100% agree. It does add appeal. It does make gameplay fun and engaging. It takes skill to do it well. And by that I mean fufilling your support role duties 1st and doing damage second. Tanks have it made for the most part...trolls can pull it off somewhat...healers...well not so much. I wish they could balance those out a bit... Maybe not neck and neck close...but better for trolls and healers. I believe there should be a little bit more bonus to dps role like 5% increase in damage. But at the same time...I've seen some really good dps's. Maybe we are just still getting the hang of it all. I love the idea of sc generators built into main moves for support. I also think that WM combos should have power regen or power regen bonus when pulling off full combo with hybrid focus. As of now...there is none. That keeps the hybrid builds inferior to Superpowered focus. That could help both dps and support roles.

I can see a movement where the only support role, will be battle support. The game already frowns upon all NON-DPS players in alerts.

very little of the actual game is strictly Raids and that is really the only time you need to be in one specific role and play your part. its for the whole rest of the game that we should really have a battle or hybrid spec to greatly ease your gaming enjoyment and allowing people who don't like going into DPS role to still be able to accomplish missions with out taking 3 times as long to complete than if you just ran DPS

I'll point you to my previous statement to cover all that red text you just wrote as simply just being inaccurate

I think you misunderstand the general concept.

Unlike DCUO other MMOs allow tank/healer roles to be able to be completely independent with enough damage to complete regular solo content by themselves. IE they are supplemented with enough damage tools to defeat enemies in a timely manner.

In DCUO Tank/Healer/Controller roles do not have the basic MMO damage factor to do such and thus DPS gear is required for that player to get through solos, duos, and other content in a timely manner. Even alerts are now making it such as when bringing 1 of those 3 roles slows down the run drastically.

Battle roles in their main conception are meant to be able to fill that gap to make it where the role does not become a burden on the group or the player for not choosing the DPS role.

This being 1 key functionality of DCUO is that playing anything other than DPS outside of raid content you will be at a major disadvantage.

I always thought it was kind of silly to have set up the game with 2 sets of gear when they could have just combined the stats into a single set so you wouldn't need to gear swap, though you'd need to change mods.

Battle support roles does offer a different kind of game playing experience. And like the others who have posted in this thread, if they do their primary role first and dps second, I dont have a problem. However, there are poor battle<support> players and people who do not read the group and adjust their gameplay.

For example, I was in FGS regular and the setup was 1-1-1-5. The healer was battle healing and I was the controller. The healer would constantly empty out his power bar and put a strain on the controller to keep him powered up. We had several players die, even during the trash mob battles. If there were 2 controllers, then that would have allowed the battlehealer to play that way.

Other than that, playing battle<support> would be a nice alternative. The devs would need to make some modifications to allow this. I.e. single gear set, powers that do both roles simultaneously (some powers do this now), improved power return.

To simply answer the OP title...... its a huge nay.
1) the fact that a few of you can do it (and i have seen some do it exceptionally well) doesnt offset the fact that the majority cant.
2) your ability on an individual lvl to rise to the occasion and pull it off doesnt justify doing it when its setting a horrible example for the majority (because you do it is why everyone else is trying which means the better you do the more your encouraging this terrible behavior and thats NOT good for the game.

Now that said, i do NOT mean to sound like i am against those who can pull it off because I am massively in favor because I have seen some monsters do it. But for me, its a simple risk/reward analysis and the risk of the majority ruining instances is far greater than finding one of you who can excel.
For me its a nay and that is why. Its truly sad because i think its great when it works. Theres no way i see to allow some of u to do it an the rest be for ex to stick to their actual role.
Best chance at it would be to lock anything thats role specific (gear, augments, etc) so at a min, pll are forced to spec properly. Keep the freedom of SP usage so that u can battle spec even tho it wouldnt be as much as you’d like but keeping the majority functional is more important to the game IMO

Edit: i have to say this as well, someone in full favor in spite of the fact the majority not being able to handle it plz explain to me the real benefit? I have never once seen a raid go faster, better, smoother, etc due to battle rolls. Even the ones doing a monster job werent enough for me to say “wow, that was better”. seems to me the only real measurable benefit is the super rare occasion where a heal an tank (for example) are last ones standing an finish off a boss in which case it can save a few min but even then, is that rare success (that woulda been a success anyway just took longer) worth the vast majority essentially being taught wrong an dragging all the other raids down? I cant see how its worth it personally but i am all ears if im wrong on this or looking at it wrong

Well said! To answer your question the only real benefit I've found to battle roles is if you are soloing something that might be a challenge or to pick up some of the slack in a group. Personally the only battle role I'll use is on my Healer in 4-man content and only if (A) the DPS are below subpar or (B) someone got knocked out and didn't get picked up. I wouldn't use it in a raid because there are too many variables plus it's a melee build and I wouldn't want to disrupt the Tank. There was one time we were running Panopticon Elite, Ultraman had 1/3 Health left and it was down to just me (Healer) and the Controller. We switched to battle roles and had to finish it that way, that was fun.

The first point you make is what is really important. I do battle-heal, and the most important thing you need to know about about battle-roling is WHEN YOU CAN DO IT. There are a lot of builds that can work, but what you need to know is if the strategy can work in a given situation. I will never battle-heal a raid. Not even a low cr one. Not even in a full league run. What will I battle-heal? Low alerts. I don't battle-heal CoP unless I am running with a league group AND we are running with a tank. I will battle-heal adds and first boss in VMF, but no Amazo or Lex. I will battle-heal DC, from the beginning to the underwater part in Drowned fight, there I will switch to pure heal (unless I blind queued and I got 3 cr skipped dps, who won't be able to take her down faster than she heals, but in that scenario, that I lived a few days ago, I will tweak my build a bit to increase my damage without losing self surviving capacity, even if it means letting the weakest die).
But battle-roling is not for everyone. Not only you need a pretty big amount of SP, you need high (and variated) Artifacts, a deep understanding of your powerset, and knowledge about the instance. But most important, you need to know how to read your group and their needings, weaknesses and strengths.
So no, battle-roles are a big no. Unless that battle-role build can solo the instance and keep your team alive at the same. With "soloing the instance" being the key in here.

And see, thats what it seems to me that you and the other pro-battle whatevers get. Issue is you are in the massive minority. You understanding it an being able to do it and plan etc is awesome an i want that for you. Just not at the expense of the rest because sadly the majorly just look up the “best build” and are completly useless but think they are awesome. I have had a few single handedly make the raid fail and literally blamed the other 7 ppl till they were eventually booted.
While part of that is funny because their delusional ineptness is just an amazing sight, its also incredibly sad and it pains me to say it but seeing you guys do it well is where they get the idea, its why they copy you an think they are the best. The general population cant understand That having the fast car does not make them a good driver, often times it makes them a worse driver.

I understand you absolutely, I have had bad experiences with battle-roles. That's why I hide my build, and the data given by inspecting (gear, artifacts, augments) are full healer. I don't want people to copy me, because to do what I do you need to learn.

In my experience, they work very well in open world, where your stats are buffed anyway. They can also work well in Alerts, when the group is aware, especially in those few situations where you find yourself running with both a healer and tank. In raids, they can work when you have more than 1 of each role-- ie the healer can almost-but-not-quite manage to solo heal, so add someone in mostly damage gear who's throwing out a few heals or spamming eye of gemini for the group.

Other than those few, niche cases, you're absolutely correct. They just don't speed things up or make things easier.

Poor argument. You're saying because bad players can't utilize battle roles correctly then battle roles are a bad idea. If you've played for any length of time you'll find most players can't perform their main role correctly, let alone alt role or battle role. I run my battle tank in pretty much everything I can but at the first sign of trouble (either for me or the group) I'll switch to regular tank role. The one characteristic every instance in the game shares is X amount of damage must be performed to clear said instance; if I can speed it along I will.

Well the question was posed do we think its a good idea yay or nay.
My reasons are my own an i dont need to argue it and/or justify it to you or anyone.
Now if you wanna discuss it and discuss if its good for the game then my argument is fine an just as valid as yours or anyones.
I disclaimed multiple times im in favor of the freedom an in favor of players up to par doing these types of things. I think its pretty much factually apparent in the game that it does set a bad example and i dont see how it is healthy for the game. It doesnt speed up content much, most are acknowledging its not very functional in relevant raids. Most seem to be saying they keep it very limited to alert an lower and to keep in their hip pocket for those rare Occurrences when solo’n a boss is needed (which is also cool, yay armories as well).

Im also offering a type of solution in that maybe role gear etc could be locked so players are for ed to spec “properly” and must grind to use their SP for their battle role’n. Maybe that means SP needs some more revamp work? I dunno. I am trying to have a conversation. Im not arguing.

If someone is able to do their role and put out damage then sure. I battle tank on artie most of the time but I can also switch to a full spec tank fast and I battle tank in tank gear not dps. Above all I am the tank first. And it seems the tank role can battle role the easiest out of all roles. So if you can do your job and dps then yes but if you can't heal me or you can't power the healer cause your in dps gear then you gotta go.

For me I've always been 100% against battle support roles, and dont like running with them. Theres only 1 guy I run with that battle tanks as earth and I only run with him still because I know hes a capable player and wont sacrifice his tank stats for damage like alot of ppl do.