A Mental Breakdown V3

Discussion in 'Oracle’s Database (Guides)' started by Greenman_x, Jun 10, 2013.

  1. jamesbopp43 Committed Player

    I have gotten a little (more like very) bored by the monotony of AM DPS. Also, with so many DPSs having power back mechanics, I find trolling a bit less of a challenge.

    To combat this, I decided to have a little fun and make a battle-troll. I was curious to see how much damage I can pump out and so far it's gone well. The other day I ran RtN with an ice dps who was similar CR and SP as me, and I did roughly 25-30% of his damage output while doing roughly 3x the damage of the other support characters.

    I am looking for some suggestions on how I can do even more damage. My build is based around DoT powers, WM and Invisibility. I have all iconic damage crits and my loadout is adjustable for different situations:

    TT, T.Bubble (TB), Pyro, PE, Invisibility, Optional.

    For more damage, I use Menace as my Optional power.
    For raids or safety, I use grandeur instead.

    My stealth loadout includes Mass Hysteria, Vacuum Bubble, and Bastion.

    I currently use HB weapon with explosive shot, and my rotation is:

    TT/Menace -> WM -> TB/PE -> WM -> Pyro -> WM -> TB/PE -> WM (repeat)
    My math indicates this rotation is about 15 seconds which works well with TT. But I wonder if I should use a faster WM combo to keep Pyro up at all time.

    Looking at Shiny's weapon guide, I am very interested in 2-H hard double throw combo. It is about 0.7 seconds shorter, which would shorten my rotation to about 12 seconds. Thoughts?
  2. Greenman_x Steadfast Player

    When I had my extra armory (before I was a stupid idiot and overwrote it) I used DW and my battle troll loadout was: Tendrils - Phantom Flames - Shock - Menace - Bastion - Empowerment

    I preferred DW to HB because it was so quick. You're probably better off with Invis, then I was with Bastion. I think you've got a good setup though. I always swapped my weapon, neck, rings, utility belt and face with DPS stuff, as well as a few of my yellow socket pieces.
    • Like x 1
  3. Greenman_x Steadfast Player

    Throw TT once every 19-20 seconds if you can. That is when POT drops off. If you are new to controlling, I recommend throwing it roughly once every 10 seconds. You can also attempt to double tick, which is explained below as well as on the first page of the guide:

    POT Optimization (Credit to Shady Milkman, Deadpool and Darkman for the info)

    0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 (Blue numbers represent POT ticks, Underlined numbers represent “Double Tick” period)
    To maximize your power back given from your POT move, it is important to know how it works. Once a POT is casted it will remain up for 20 seconds, however it can be recasted after 15 seconds (or 4th tick) to achieve a Double Tick. Underlined numbers note when during a POT cycle the POT can be recasted for a Free or Double tick.
    NOTE: This does not mean that if you cast your POT within the 15 seconds you will lose your opportunity for a Double Tick. Just keep in your head how many ticks have passed on your screen after the POT went up again and recast on the 4th tick.
    Example: You can use your POT as much as you like within the 20 second period and still get the double tick –POT 0 1 2 3 4 5 POT 6 7 8 9 10 POT 11 12 13 14 15 POT (double tick) 16 17 18 19 20

    My other heavy recommendation is that you clip just about EVERYTHING with empowerment. Debuffs, some weapon combos, POT, etc. That way you don't have to sit through the animations for your debuffs, and give power at the same time. If you power gets low, don't even bother debuffing and focus on getting your hit counter up and power.

    Additionally, don't use cryokinesis just because it's a debuff. A lot of new controllers think that just because we have debuffs, we should use them often and on everything, but really anything besides a defense debuff isn't even noticable on 99% of bosses. Focus on power first and foremost, worry about defense debuffs if everything is good on that first front, and if power is really good, then you can use Cryo to your hearts content.

    Lastly, spec crits before vitalization. Critical power chance is far more important.

    Hope this helped, feel free to ask more questions.
    • Like x 2
  4. Infyrneaux23 Dedicated Player

    That did help. Now, to put it to use.

    Thank you.
  5. jamesbopp43 Committed Player

    Thanks for the info. Looks like you are doing more of a burst loadout and capitalizing on the terror PI. I was also considering DW (I used to do Brawling, but I wanted a bigger pop on my DoTs), but I feared I would run out of power easily with no quick way of regenerating it. So I decided I would to HB to slow my power consumption while also getting a bigger pop with my DoTs and further reducing my power costs. HB also offers pulse beam for quick and easy power regeneration. I suppose DW has ultra flurry for that, but I have a hard time counting to 9 then hold lol.

    However, I recently noticed some of the changes to weapon attacks in Shiny's thread, and it seems that the 2-H arrow storm (iirc) compares similarly to both HB and DW. I'm going off memory but the clipped DPS for each are:
    DW: 7.4 (1.7s) +38 crit, x2.5 crit, 15% power redux
    HB: 6.6 (2.8s) +48 crit, x3.0 crit, 20% power redux
    2H: 6.7 (2.1s) +41 crit, x2.7 crit, 22% power redux

    Yet the power refund is the best for 2H, while its crit bonuses are slightly better than DW. I never heard of 2H being popular in ranged WM, so I thought I'd pass that info on and get some insight from the pros.

    Edit: corrected some numbers.
  6. Xzotix Committed Player

    I haven't been on my mental dps in awhile.... wth happened?
    It seems mental is almost back the way it was before the last update. Was it nerfed that badly? or am I mis-using the AM?
    Need help/ clarification. Thanks!
  7. jamesbopp43 Committed Player

    Still hits hard. Depending on how long you've been gone, other powers caught up. So it might appear as less damage relative to other DPS in the group.
    • Like x 1
  8. Greenman_x Steadfast Player

    How are you using it? Too far? Too close? Too much of a gap in between power casts?
  9. Xzotix Committed Player

    Mid-range to close range, depending on the boss and/or the tank.
    My rotation is:
    Resonance - Phantom Flames - Shock - Bolt - Mass Terror - Menace repeat without res if it's active
    I try to keep my rotation
    pretty tight. Too close?

    This could very well be the case. Love my Ice dps, and just remember Mental was the sshi_ when it went live.
    Been working on my main (celestial heal) and now I wanted a change, but not this one I hope. I hope it's me.

    Thanks guys.
  10. Greenman_x Steadfast Player

    If you aren't seeing the regular huge numbers then the only thing I can think of is the timing between the powers. Has to be right after the other, zero breaks. Or it could just be what James said and other powers have caught up.
    • Like x 1
  11. Xzotix Committed Player

    I will pay closer attention to my rotation next time around. Thanks!
    I don't so much mind other powers catching up, just don't won't to be left out... again!!!

    Edit: Think it was partly me. Wasn't using (Mass Terror clipped with Menace clipped with Resonance) at the beginning of my rotation and (Mass Terror clipped with Menace) whenever menace off cool down.
    Sometimes it's in the details.
  12. GalaxySniper Loyal Player

    You also probably played around the time when MT wasn't splitting damage. MT was hitting very high at that time.
    • Like x 1
  13. BigDaddyDru New Player

    I must say, In Competent Hands, Mental can certainly sustain itself very well. Observe the following video:

    Note: Feel free to Skip to the 6:50 Mark to witness Mental Solo Barda & Miracle in Fatal Exams.

    What we are seeing in the above Video is the following ALL being done by 1 Single Player:

    Trolling + Healing + DPSing = Unstoppable

    Now it is impossible for me to ever fail against Barda & Miracle in FE simply because of the Solo Build I designed for my Mental Character in that Video. Feel free to replicate it yourself so you too can share the same success if you ever experience Incompetence in the Final Fight of your Fatal Exams run!

    As always > Stay Competent my fellow Mental Beasts! :cool:


    Here is another Video of me taking the above Mental performance to an ever greater level of Awesomeness by Soloing Barda & Miracle in 7 minutes:

    Trolling + DPSing + Healing + Armories = Even MORE Unstoppable

    Here, we see that I implement the use of Armories which GREATLY speeds up the Rate at which I am able to Solo Barda & Miracle as Mental. Using the Mass Terror Advanced Mechanics PLUS the Unstoppable Mass Hysteria in addition to my Dominance Troller Build, I am able to make quick work of Miracle and Barda Single Handedly by shaving off more than 15 minutes compared to the 1st Video.

    I said it before and I'll say it again > Mass Hysteria is the DEADLIEST Troller Supercharge in the Game. My Videos are the Proof!

    These videos are just small examples of Mental's TRUE potential in Competent Hands. ;)

    As always, Stay Competent my fellow Mental Players! :cool:
  14. jamesbopp43 Committed Player

    Quick question, and I believe it's been covered previously. Is it possible to do a clipped power discharge [HB] in between AM powers? Or is the 0.4 seconds too much of a gap, or simply too risky to consider?

    I recall rifle taps are potentially posible, but isn't that a longer animation time? Or am I mistaken?

    Note, all numbers are from Shiny's Weapon Comparison Guide.
  15. TheDark Devoted Player

    You mean power>rifle tap>power>rifle tap>power>rifle tap>mass terror/lev?
    If so, powers clip weapon attacks so you wouldn't have to wait for the animation of rifle tap to play unless the damage registration was delayed since I made the video below.

    Gadgets and Mental have the same window to use cast another power to register a tag for the AM big burst hit. In the end, what the rifle tap damage totaled wasn't significant enough for me to consider using for Gadgets. Using the Combat Log Analyzer, it showed tap attacks were below 4 to 9% which is what I was getting with the other 3 powers. That's not including the big burst finisher.
  16. MentosTroll Loyal Player

    If your execution is GODLIKE, you can fit a BOW Explosive shot (Hold Range - Tap forward) in between amplifiers. I still can't give a proper determination whether fitting an explosive shot in-between every power giver higher/lower DPS since I can't quite execute it perfectly for 30 seconds.
  17. Absolix Loyal Player

    Just checked this on my Mental alt that conveniently has HB, and no it does no it does not appear to work as Mass Terror was hitting for less than the amplifiers.
    • Like x 1
  18. jamesbopp43 Committed Player

    That is what I mean. Do you know roughly what the clipped animation time for a rifle tap is? I see on Shiny's chart the full animation is 0.8 sec, but nothing is listed for clipped animation.

    Also, is the alotted time between AM powers 0.5 sec? If so, that is why I am curious about the capability of power discharge as a clipped power to use. It's 0.4 sec clipped time barely fits in that gap. However the risk is likely far too great for the reward.

    Wow, you could fit in an explosive shot? Impressive
  19. jamesbopp43 Committed Player

    Ahhh, thanks. Unfortunate, but I figured this would be the case.
  20. TheDark Devoted Player

    Are you able to see the video above? I don't have exact timings on the animation of rifle tap (I don't specialize in weapons) when clipped but it's practically non existent if you cast a power right away after pressing triangle tap.

    I don't have the exact duration of the window in my head. It might be in my thread. Who reported it was .5 seconds?