A little confused about this quote

Discussion in 'Battle of the Legends (PvP)' started by Saint Nutella, Sep 13, 2017.

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  1. Saint Nutella Loyal Player

    I'm not exactly sure how videos can be so helpful yet you don't understand how PvP is broken. There have been several posts that demonstrated video proof, accurate numbers and stats. Why most of them haven't even been responded to is beyond me. To me either the videos aren't as helpful as you claim, or you guys aren't really analyzing the videos (or at least the good ones), or you're just not adjusting PvP for various reasons (doesn't bring in money, too risky/dangerous, low priority etc.).

    Also, IMO it wouldn't be so hard to understand why PvP isn't as good as it was before (unless of course you're new or haven't played it).

    I have a few videos that I may post along with stats but I'm not too good with the numbers so I refrain from trying that incase they're inaccurate.

    SN: @devs @mepps @moderators I mean no disrespect with this thread. I'm not trolling either, just curious as to what's going on.
    @Mepps @Moja
    • Like x 4
  2. JasonIsley Devoted Player

    They're trying to encourage players that don't post videos or data to do so. They have made some PvP adjustments, Atomic and Shields for example. They are looking at the videos and the data people are posting.
  3. Moja Developer

    Details are incredibly important because 5 people can say "pvp is broken" and mean 5 different things. For one person it could be that shields are too strong. For another it could be that supercharges deal too much damage. For another it could be that certain weapon combos are too weak, or that interrupts can sometimes be cancelled, or that power regeneration is too high. These all have very different solutions. Some players may have difficulty articulating what the problem is at all (we have many players who don't speak English as their primary language, for instance). Videos are extra valuable because they give actual repro cases for the issues players are experiencing, and sometimes uncover bugs or problems that no one ever mentioned.

    Does that make sense?
    • Like x 10
  4. Proxystar #Perception

    With due respect moja you only have to go and read around in the pvp forum section to see the talk of why it's broken.

    Examples but not necessarily limited to include.

    Weapon imbalance
    Power imbalance
    Broken debuffs
    Debuffs not doing enough
    Healing being too powerful
    Tanking self heals being too powerful
    Shields being too powerful
    Broken counter mechanics
    Weapon counters not being comparative.

    And heres a massive one very little reward for grinding the gear when complete noobs don't even have to buy gear anymore and get scaled.

    I mean even taking away counters too powers where you can't block jackhammer anymore etc etc.

    This might not be the case now but also powers that have excessive cc's like celestial and nature in the past.

    I mean where do you even want to start.
    • Like x 6
  5. Lionxoft Committed Player

    I don't know how long you've been around but PvP was actually fun right around Origin Crisis and all the way through WotL pt 1. It was absolutely obliterated at the Weapon Mastery update. Interestingly enough it was also the update that the servers started to empty. If you watch PvP videos from those days (Origin Crisis) take notes of all the good things that were happening.
    • Like x 2
  6. MrDevilz Well-Known Player

    Problems with Arena PvP
    • Mental's/Gadget's invisibility attacks hit far too hard (Takes half or more of one's life)
    • Tanks can pull people over and over. (Please make it to where tanks cannot pull people)
    • The power regeneration for superpower is way too high. It allows players to spam OVER AND OVER. Please force hybrid play style while in PvP gear and arena
    • Rage's revenge power is hard to break out of.
    • Shields still need to be reduced. (Shield stacking is meta)
    • Nature's roar does too much damage in PvP. This needs to be reduced massively.
    • Quantum's time bomb does too much damage in PvP. (This needs to be reduced)
    • Constructs need to be blockable - Celestial needs to be vulunerable in some way to prevent spam
    • Water's super charge Flood of Power gives full power, picks you up, and mitigates damage for a short time (This will need to be reduced in pvp)
    • Water's dehydrate and Call of the Deep one shots
    • Jackhammer damage is too high
    • MA to handblast uppercut does too much damage. It has the highest damage of all the WM. It needs to rebalanced
    • Arc Lightning is healing too much in DPS role
    • Damage debuff in arena does nothing (not really a problem but it could be improved upon)
    • No reward for playing in DPS role. 10% damage is meager. There needs to be more done to encourage DPS role. Right now it's just better to be in role. Role bonuses are king. Being in a role should see a damage reduction for PvP. -35% DPS.
    • CC seems to be too high. There needs to be more CC resistance.
    • A lot of weapon taps do more damage than weapon holds. Rifle slam, for instance, is unblockable and does more damage than a lot of weapon holds.
    • Earth's brick tanking mitigates too much damage in PvP.
    • Pets die too quick. This kills pet powers for PvP. Sorcery is useless in PvP right now due to the fact watcher dies too quick. The same can be said for Earth's Crystal.
    • Execute moves in PvP are terrible now
    • 3 taps should lead to a counter. The current 5x tap counter encourages tapping in PvP without landing holds.
    Legends Problems:

    • Out of combat regeneration is REALLY low
    • Heal barrels aren't healing in Legends PvP
    • Catwoman/Cheetah hit way too hard. They were not rebalanced. (Oversight due to having unique weapon set)
    • The rest of the legends characters seem to be hitting REALLY low
    • Batman's drone doesn't give very much power like it use to
    • Wonder Woman/Wonder Girl's Amazonian Deflection isn't working properly
    • Saint Walker's super charge doesn't work at all and he has really low health
    • The rest of legends seem to have REALLY low precision damage now. Killing a opposing player takes forever unless you're Catwoman or Cheetah.
    • In combat power regeneration needs to be a bit higher. It's really low right now
    • Like x 11
  7. High Troller Loyal Player

    an example of what pvp was...february of 2013 i recall...before weapon mastery (you're welcomed to mute the music):

    • Like x 1
  8. MrDevilz Well-Known Player

    To add:

    • Nature, Sorcery, and Celestial are outclassed in PvP due to the burst Water and Electricity has. HoT need to be buffed in PvP.
    • Defense debuff needs to be buffed in PvP
    • Countering is really messed up right now. You can double counter players due to immunity be lowered.
    • Catwoman's shuriken causes characters to seize up and you are unable to breakout a times
    • A person can throw shurikens with Catwoman and sometimes it takes to lunge 2x before you can get the counter.
    • Catwoman's shuriken has a knockdown effect that's only suppose to be active when that person has full super. (This effect should be removed all together)
    • Catwoman's reflect is way too strong. It needs to be changed to just a shield and the reflection on it removed. She is powerful enough with her powers.
    I know I said a bit about Catwoman but with weapons hitter much softer, these changes are needed to bring Catwoman in line with the rest of the legends.
    • Like x 2
  9. MrDevilz Well-Known Player

    If you want footage of what pvp is really like, I have hours of footage of being different powers. I have pure examples of what the meta of pvp is like.


    This should be all the video you need. You can scour through the 9-12 hours a day I PvP and hear my frustration with broken mechanics/powers. I am mental right now to stay competitive against players in PvP.
    • Like x 2
  10. DarkAya Dedicated Player

    Oh PVP poor PVP, it's easier to say what's working there than what's broken LOL

    When I see Tanks 1v1 fight that last 20+ mins or when the time's out, what kind of sane person can play this?

    You [devs] say 'we do not fix things people do not play', well, put some valuable, atractive rewards there for a change and you'll see. Make awesome PVP episode, encourage people to compete in PVP rather than on a PVE scoreboard (which is really sad and pathetic btw)
    • Like x 1
  11. Shifty Committed Player

    THIS^ he got everything right. Please listen to this guy cause he's literally the first one to hit all the issues correctly!
    • Like x 2
  12. light FX Steadfast Player

    This^. Bullet points 4-7. Catwoman. So much cheese going on with that character. Even with legends pvp there seems to a never ending fotm cycle. Its great to post feedback and all of that. But how does stuff like this slip through? Ive said it before, the players are relied upon way too much when it comes to all of this. This stuff repeatedly happens. Year after year.
    • Like x 2
  13. MrDevilz Well-Known Player

    I wouldn't mind if they just made Catwoman regular MA. This would avoid potential balances issues in the future.
    • Like x 2
  14. Saint Nutella Loyal Player

    Well said. There's even video proof demonstrating some of these issues. Of course it wouldn't be necessary if the devs PvPed from 2013-2017.

    Thanks for your contribution to this thread.

    I really appreciated how you laid out the problems with arena PvP (hopefully it'll be considered here. PvP section apparently doesn't get the same amount of attention and a dev responded to this thread) but on top of that you've even listed some major issues with legends PvP. Kudos to you man, let's hope this feedback is reviewed, analyzed and discussed upon.
    • Like x 1
  15. Golden Spartan New Player

    Shields are too strong if you can´t counter them
    Power regen is too strong if you can´t counter it
    Heals are strong if you can´t counter them

    We need RPS back or else, balance becomes a cat and mouse neverending game. We never asked RPS to be removed.

    We need RPS to bring balance.
    • Like x 1
  16. Soul Dedicated Player

    A place to start would be RPS being reintroduced to balance things out.
    Although it will matter very little since PvP cannot and will not be fixed as an after-thought. You can't patch your way to success here, there's only a 6 year track record of evidence to showcase what happens.

    This isn't about semantics, a language barrier or a consensus regarding what players define as problematic..

    If you guys are finally ready to "Fix" PvP, it will be a project, it will take time and understanding on your part of how your own game plays out in the competitive scene, which directly translates to a Developer spending their own free time learning from competitive PvPers, and gaining a solid understanding of what PvP is, and what PvP needs to be.

    The PvP community as a whole had been giving feedback since 2011, starting with the fiasco on the Counter Windows adjustments + Immunity System placement, throughout seasons 1-3 and the horrible RPS tweaks (movement mode debuffs to complete removal of the system), and ofcourse.. WM/AM validation in a format clearly not meant for it.

    The only way to "Fix" PvP, is your management/development team coming to terms with the necessity of them understanding the Meta of the game they created. We can't feed you information you can't comprehend.. This isn't just technical data, the person handling feedback needs to have a grasp of the game, not in the broad aspect of it, but as a competitive PvP player.

    Once such individual shows up, willing to collaborate with PvP players during testing... language, terminology, semantics and different view points will matter very little.

    If you or someone else in Daybreak would like to discuss the possibility of this happening, perhaps with a certain individual in mind, you can contact me through Email or Discord (Mepps should have it), and I'll gather old accomplished PvPers (Hopefully) still willing to help in their free time.

    Here are competitive PvP videos (2011-2017) as a reference:
    Link 1
    Link 2
    • Like x 4
  17. Saint Nutella Loyal Player

    Im super glad YOU are aware of my thread! Thanks for commenting.
  18. CaptainColdJr007AKAFreeJohnson Committed Player

  19. MrDevilz Well-Known Player

    You are wrong on most of your statements. You just seem to want to negate everything that everyone is saying when there are MANY people agreeing with me. You call roar "fixed". Your credibility, Cold, is out the window as soon as you said that. Moja, please do not listen to CaptainColdJr007. He clearly hasn't been pvping.

    Videos will be coming since you want to refute everything players are saying.
  20. Proxystar #Perception

    I didnt ask for your response you're not a dev.
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