8 years after Weapon Mastery can PvP population be brought back?

Discussion in 'Battle of the Legends (PvP)' started by AllanPage, Feb 4, 2022.

  1. Trykz Dedicated Player

    Power respec tokens heh. There’s your flavor of the month pvp loved so much. This is Bork fix it, screws up pve, fix that, screws up pvp, fix that, all the while selling respec tokens? Naw hard pass on all that nonsense. Never again lol.
  2. thedemonocus Loyal Player

    PVP was NEVER good, even before weapon mastery it was more about the gear and exploits than skill. You pretty much had to lose every fight until you could get the better pvp gear and then you could stand there and laugh as your opponent who didn't have high pvp gear could barely do any damage to you and you could practically 1 shot them, not exactly a fair fight. There was also certain weapon clips you could do that did huge damage and healers and tanks always had an unfair advantage as well.

    If you want to fix pvp make it like other fighting games like mortal kombat for example. Make everyone dps (no more invincible tanks and healers constantly healing) and disable artifacts and sodas. Just fight until that health bar is down no crutches.
    • Like x 1
  3. Trended Active Player

    of course pvp gear is gunna give advantage lmao what you think happened it made you worse? Thats the whole point in grinding gear so you can be op
  4. thedemonocus Loyal Player

    thats all fine and good for pve but for pvp its stupid, pvp fights are supposed to be fair not 1 sided
    • Like x 1
  5. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    I’m pretty sure I’ve asked this question before but no one’s ever really answered me. I’ll preface it by saying I spent minimal time in pvp back on the day. I only healed back then so I’d just get jumped constantly in group content so didn’t care for it at all. But I’ve always wondered why pvp isn’t just base skills/ armor. Like every toon becomes lvl 30. You can pick whatever role (maybe?) in group content but can only dps 1v1. All white mods, artifacts, gear, sp, utility belts, whatever that isn’t base level 30cr is shut off. You get your loadout/ rotation/ skills vs the other person that has no advantage. Make it so marks go to style sets only. Attach feats to them. Day one player would have all the same stats as a level 900 or whatever, only difference at that point would be actual skill. Maybe? At the least, it wouldn’t affect pve additions I’d think.
    • Like x 2
  6. thedemonocus Loyal Player

    That would be great but most pvp players like their cheap exploits and op roles so they can pretend they have skills so it probably wouldn't happen.
    • Like x 2
  7. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    I’m sure it brings balance issues up but I feel like it would be a lot easier to balance things if they’re just set to cr30 ability. Like don’t even allow iconics. Pure powerset load outs only. Prec vs might would be players choice but both should be doing the same damage. I’d expect it to be minimal upkeep on the devs part and then anyone can play vs ops picking on newbs.

    Plus it makes for good testing. Like if one powerset just gets whooped constantly, clearly that powerset needs help. If one becomes clear fotm, nerf it down a bit. We have pretty good balance imo in pve at the moment but it’s more because of artifacts and builds vs actual powerset balance. Like sorcery is not going to keep up with munitions barebones but put a few artifacts into play and suddenly they’re close. So this would be an entire player base testing.
    • Like x 2
  8. Rejchadar Inquisitor


    Because this is just another illusion... not even a day will pass when it will become obvious to people who are now engaged in riveting another "meta" for pve which of the powersets or weapons is most promising in the basic form and who will always be an outsider, the old system: scissors , paper, stone was not created from scratch ... well, with all the changes that were, this system was broken at the most, most basic level ...
    • Like x 1
  9. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    Well, even if certain powers are better, they’ll get back to constant respec token sales haha. As long as each role has a possible fotm, there will still be roles for pve. It’ll just be rage/electric/gadgets dcuo haha
  10. Operation Failure Well-Known Player

    If gear is the real issue most people have with pvp then legends exists. All you need nowadays is half of the 98 set to do well.
  11. Solarbound Committed Player

    This argument about fairness is a funny thing. If I'm someone who was willing to put in the work as a PVPer in order to seperate myself from the rest of the competition, I should be rewarded and compensated for that. DCUO is an MMO world. That gear grind system is a method many other games within the same genre follow.

    This isn't Injustice, this isn't Mortal Kombat, this isn't Street Fighter. If such a system set in place was that much of a problem for you to the point where it became an excuse, then you have the option to go play those if how things were originally presented here doesn't meet your preference in terms of how you believe PVP in any game should work.

    Regarding your stance, though, there is one thing that I do believe the DEVS had screwed up from the very start. The failure to implement CR based queues to control the range of what PVP CR players would randomly match up against in Arenas. It's the kind of thing that would have given PVP a much longer lifeline had they done that early on.

    Yet, instead, years down the line around 2015 they decide to scale the gear to where everybody now has a "fair" chance to win in Arenas. Including those who are fresh off of the Brainiac Ship. Yet, that went into shambles because those changes catered to a casual audience that wasn't making the PVP side thrive in the first place.

    Honestly, when I read comments like yours given the era of DCUO that I come from and what part of the community I mostly surrounded myself with, it feels like a slap in the face. A lot of you don't realize how to bridge the gap of fairness between giving casuals handouts and stripping top CR players of everything they grinded for. I don't think that discussion can be had until all of you do. It's the kind of attitude within the community that killed PVP.
    • Like x 1
  12. Lovora Liaht Well-Known Player

    The removal of Rock<Paper<Scissors balance HURT sooo BAD.
    I can't even explain how much it hurt my entire PVP experience.
  13. Drathmor Unwavering Player

  14. Ksan New Player

    I remember being SO Excited for this game when it was first releasing on Playstation. I pre-ordered and was there for Pre-release when the whole server lost to the dev's playing Brainiac and the server wiped and started for the first time. I stayed a long time for PvP. It is what kept me. made a villain named Mr. big in a tux and LOVED Roaming and finding good PvP matches.

    I'm old school PvP, started when you could lose it all in Ultima Online. Played through all the MMO-PvP games spending almost 5 years in DAOC, beening playing a long time on WAR RoR and had the itch to come back to DCUO for that old Fun PvP. I downloaded the game a couple weeks ago, made a Subscriber Act (Because I expected PvP) nly to find PvP dead. I wont be sticking around for PvE, it isnt my cup of tea.
    • Like x 1
  15. Lovora Liaht Well-Known Player

    Have hope.

    They just might revive PVP one day.
    • Like x 1
  16. Drathmor Unwavering Player

    I would suggest it made them a lot indirectly as it had its own community of players and they all paid to play the game at the time and bought things like all other players and most also played the PVE aspect of it along with loving and playing the PVP side
    • Like x 2
  17. Lovora Liaht Well-Known Player

    Yep.
    They'd play the PVE portion of the game for the Skill Points to improve their PVP stats.

    They'd also constantly switch their powers just to keep up with competition.
    • Like x 2
  18. Henoshock Well-Known Player

    There's not enough incentive to start PvP for new players IMO. And the population isn't big enough to support CR-based queues so that there won't be complete stomps. It's a positive feedback loop.

    Of course the easiest way to bring it back is to increase rewards. I really like how you can buy old PvP styles with MoV, and given that there's now a rare styles vendor for PvE in HoL, I think it'd be a great idea if they just did the same but now with MoV. They can make it fairly expensive, like 2000+ marks a piece, but at least a reason to PvP. I'd also like to see the bigger queues have increased rewards so that people actually queue them. Just like how raids give twice the amount as alerts which give twice the amount as duos/solos.

    As for actual PvP balance, some powers are just inherently strong which would be hard to balance without separating PvP and PvE balance. Mostly thinking of Rage spam, Mental spam, any Stealth, etc. Basically power spams. But powers are a core part of the game and a lot of people like them, so I'd propose attaching counter mechanics to them. Like Rage melee combos, they used to be blockable but not most of them aren't and they can just spam you to death. For other powers, they can just add a general rule that using 3 powers in a row is lungeable. Also make the vulnerability windows bigger... finishers last less than a second, same with Absorb Heat, you basically have to be blocking the pull part to block the Eviscerating Chain combo.

    Lastly, support roles are too strong and take much less skill. In DPS vs Heal/Tank, the DPS has to be so much better to have a chance of winning, while Healers can just spam and Tanks can just tap. I think this is less of an issue with Controllers, but the most popular Controller powers themselves are broken (Stealth). And make Rifle tap x5 blockable. Or at least have the damage come later in the animation so we have an opportunity to block and reduce the damage.
    • Like x 2
  19. Lovora Liaht Well-Known Player

    Yes, Yes, and Yes.
    I like how specific your are with these examples.
    If most of these (if all of these) were fixed, PVP would be on it's way to recovery.
    ....on it's way. Not fixed completely. LOL! XD
  20. Operation Failure Well-Known Player

    All this. Its some of the reasons for the current imbalances in pvp and these are some of the best ways to help fix it.
    • Like x 2