10yrs and dps scorecard chasers are still ruining the game.

Discussion in 'War Room (Powers, Artifacts, & Builds)' started by Spartanknight, Sep 4, 2020.

  1. MsTickle Fate Devoted Player

    I don't know how much of an outlier versus typical player I am, but I have this wacky idea that when in group content, everyone's focus should be on successfully completing the instance, not in running up numbers that are meaningless ten seconds after you're finished.

    But that's me. YMMV.
    • Like x 8
  2. Stanktonia Committed Player

    People do in elite, everyone’s main focus is to complete content, but in reg, dps’s want to compete, and there’s nothing wrong with that
  3. KneelBeforeZodd Well-Known Player

    It is impossible to bring all powers to the exact same level in any game with a variety of weapons or abilities, even if you balance them in a way the math in the abilities is the same (Like they tried to do with AMs). And..Hiring 5 or 10 people just to keep redoing things that bring in no revenue or quality is a nice way to bankrupt a company.

    Powers will never be 100% balanced, even more with artifacts in the equation. And while I agree they are keeping some powers left in the dust (like mental) for too long when they could just get a cooldown buff or a dps increase, we are talking about specific issues, not something they should be fixing in a endless loop to try and please everyone.
    • Like x 5
  4. Og Snupe New Player

    Mental is overpowered in pvp so imagine giving it a pve buff lol think wisely but maybe a aoe buff will be good single target is excellent , and with shields and improved stealth survivability is phenomenal
  5. Og Snupe New Player

    Respect finally I see your colors thank you actually the best feed back I've seen from you. It's not tolate this game still has some life with good attention with both aspects of the game will improve
  6. Illumin411 Dedicated Player



    I’m a serial entrepreneur and business owner and the thing about that is, hiring more people would almost always be the best way for a business to address most problems if it weren’t for one little pesky issue...every other Friday the new staff actually expects to be PAID! And I’m talking real actual US legal tender dollars! And even when you remind them that money doesn’t grow on trees and that Harry Potter is fictional and money can’t be magically conjured by a wand and a spell, they STILL expect money. And you try to remind them of the high fives and “great job!” Compliments you paid them...but they STILL expect money. I even tried calling our accounting firm on speaker phone so they can explain to the new hires that if we paid them money we’d be operating in the red...but they STILL expect money!!!

    As the saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make em drink...especially when what you want them to drink is unpaid slave labor.[/i]
    • Like x 2
  7. Illumin411 Dedicated Player

    To one degree or another I agree with and/or understand the logic. But I do feel like there are some holes/disconnects that I believe are wondering about and a little good ol healthy dissension and debate never hurt..

    In most cases I would assume this to be true. But that means that after you guys carefully evaluated and considered the flurry shot precision damage in context of all other damage options, your conclusion was, in an extremely improbable coincidence, that flurry shot just happened to be overperforming by the exact same percentage that a single flurry tick represented in the combo as a whole. I mean, of all the numbers and decimals between 50 and a 100, the odds that those two figures would happen to match up perfectly... I asdume that, hypothetically, had you concluded that Flurry was overperforming by 12.3%, that the combo as a whole, start to finish, would have just been reduced by 12.3%,


    Obviously in a broad context this is absolutely true. It’s fairly simple math and economics. But the calls to buff might ST instead of nerfing prec eingle target (Flurry) weren’t coming from a place of “I don’t like my scorecard results!!!” Self centered whining. Rather, it came from a collective belief of what obviously an utterly glaring mismatch in play philosophy when every single powerset except for maybe two or three are significantly more effective with AOE than they are in single target. Meanwhile content is continually created that doles out rewards based on players’ ability to kill one single “boss” enemy who had a ton of health. And notice I said “powerset” and not “powerset+iconic ability+specific artifact. I have as much fun buring mobs of adds between bosses as the next guy, but ultimately the goal and reward system is centered around killing one single target and 80%-90% of players who might dps would feel extremely inept at accomplishing this goal if not for Heat Vision and Solar Amplifier which, again, is not actually part of a powerset

    This is a game about immersion in to the world of superheroes and supervillians. That is a world where the Batmans focus on beating the Jokers, not the goons, The Supermans wanna beat the Lex’s, not the autonomous Lexsuits. But right now, most powersets can barely tickle the big bad supervillians without Heat Vision and Solar Amp.

    So yeah, I totally get that you giys have to budget your manpower which means you have to focus on maximizing efficiency in hitting your goals and productivity benchmarks. And in that context, OF COURSE the smart play is to nerf one as opposed to buff 15. But this is about more than balance or fairness. This is about making your product which was designed, created and maintained to provide your customers with an immersive experience as a superhero or supervillian...actually feel super when attempting to vanquish our ultime arch-nemesis’. Right now, for most players who prefer using superpowers over weapons, that feeling is sorely lacking unless they decide to appropriate Superman’s signature move. THAT is why buffing might ST would have been a much better solution over the Flurry change. And while I know full well how tempting it is in business management to apply a “close enough” solution that costs 1/15th of the manpower that the ideal solution would cost. In this case, I really think it wpuld have been worth the investment.
    --

    That all makes perfect sense. And I know full well no business ever has the option of applying the perfect solution to every problem existing at one time.
    Finding the best available combination that minimizes compromise in balance with maximizing productivity is the name of the game and it’s never perfect. I just really think you guys would have seen a greater return on investment in terms of customer satisfaction and loyalty had you gone the other way and strengthened powersets’ single target abilities and made them feel as “Super” as us Flurry shotters used to feel. The finishers buff was a great start in the right direction, even if it was partially motivated to sell nth metal and seals for the La Mort. Still a great move (though, as is typical, the playerbase was sorely under-informed about it). You really should have forged on down that same road and built on that.
    • Like x 1
  8. BUDOKAI101 Well-Known Player

    The scorecard is dcuo biggest eye candy that holds my interest in the game. I myself scorecard chase because I have other alts to run and can't be a cheap dps. Time is money in dcuo if u take too long to beat something and ur not top of the scorecard. Ur not someone who has alts and trying to get ur memberships money worth from the game. Take a look at the cost of the membership for 1 year. ur crazy to be running content at the bottom of the scorecard. The faster u run content the more ingame money u make. the faster u run content the less u should care about the cost of the game membership artifacts and other stuff. If the game wasn't so expensive I would play it with one hand but its not so i play it to be the top dps everytime i play it. By expensive I mean the broker and the actual cost market items and membership. u cant expect to get everything in this game and play with one hand. U can't be soft on the scorecard u gotta go hard everytime.
    • Like x 1
  9. Illumin411 Dedicated Player

    A lot of people have this same mentality. The irony is that, at least in my experience, scoreboarding mentality is responsible for more missed mechanics that cause wipes than anything else. Similarly, Ya gotta love when a group is on it’s 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th 8th, etc wipe because they insist on solo tanking and/or solo healing because, you know, “extra DPS means faster burn so we can run this raid faster!!!” How’s that working out for you as you wipe for the 9th time? Meanwhile they coulda 2-tanked it and been out of there in one shot.

    One of my favorite sayings of all time...

    “If you don’t have time to do it right, how are you gonna have time to redo it a second time?”
    • Like x 4
  10. Kanmaru Dedicated Player

    No one is going to leave because a scoreboard is gone lol.
    • Like x 2
  11. xxHELLSTROKExx Committed Player

    Will completely disagree with you. 1, someone up top already said they would. 2, pvp is an absolute dumpster fire that 90% of us believe should be deleted and forgotten about so if player a and b want to square off, you duel. If players a,b,c,d, and e want to square off, you go to a raid. Would I leave if the scoreboard goes away? Nope, but you can be dang sure I'm kicking a lot more often and offering 0 help to the struggling player cuz I won't know for sure they're struggling. But if I'm in a raid and it ain't going right, I'll inspect and kick the weakest link based off the build. If that wasn't the issue, well that's a bummer but it's how it would be based
  12. xxHELLSTROKExx Committed Player

    I can't understand for the life of me how everything in the world has become so black or white. There is grey area people, you don't like someone else having a different opinion than you. Ok, but no one cares about your opinion either tho.
    Some people like scoreboard, some people don't. That's ok.
    Some people pewpewpew, some people only play roles. That's ok too.
    Stop trying to change the game to suit your own personal desires. It's not your game. It's something you play. Don't like the scoreboard, don't look. Don't like people that do look? Mind ya business and shut it. It's pretty simple. If someone is screwing your run cuz they're obsessed with being top dps, kick them. If someone's screwing it cuz they don't care about their damage, kick them.
    • Like x 3
  13. Magg Redd Well-Known Player

    Ok, so I am one of those people who hate Hate HATE the scoreboard, but really in hindsight it is not fair to say I hate the scoreboard as much as I actually despise the scoreboard chasers....the scoreboard just gets a bad rap. There is nothing really wrong with the scoreboard itself, it is a great tool I look at my numbers all the time along with the parser to see if changes and tweeks I have made make a difference, not necessarily for damage (I could care less if I am the top or bottom of the DPS damage as long as I am not out DPSed by a role), but when I troll to see my power out, also what powers and players are using more power to help me figure out if the healer is out of power cause something I did, or they are just spamming powers trying to make me sweat and give me a heart attack.

    Problem lies in the community, too many people use the scoreboard as a bible having to be on top of it, having to rush through everything, and ignoring mechanics and teamwork to think they have something special being on top. There is nothing wrong with competitiveness, but alerts and raids are also about teamwork, which is really lost lately because of people's fascination of topping the board. It is ok to be competitive within your own team, but when the competition gets negative it hurts the team, not helps it. I am an older gamer, I am in upper management and run a business, sometimes you don't always get to pick your team, but when that happens, you analyze, strategize, think quick on your feet and instead of chastizing or punishing someone for their weakness, your find and play towards their strengths.

    As far as the comment about "getting your money's worth"...I paid $130 for my annual membership, which breaks down to $10.83 a month, or 37 cents a day...if you play for only two hours a day that is like 18.5 cents an hour, why do you need to rush through everything to gets your money's worth with that? 2 people to go to the movies, with snacks and a drink is easy $60 for 3 hours, or $20 an hour. Once a month I take my husband out to nice dinner and spend on average $400-$500 for dinner and a few drinks, so over a 4 hour period that is roughly $100 per hour....I don't see how someone can't "get the most" out of 37 cents a day without rushing through everything.
    • Like x 4
  14. The Doctor Time Lord Committed Player

    100% Agree!
  15. xxHELLSTROKExx Committed Player

    Well said reply. I think this was the key part. Also liked your business approach to raiding. I also run a business/ have run a few so I get the comparison. I know things resembling scorecards have helped make plenty of my decisions irl also. But yeah, back to my 1st response to the op, the scorecard isn't the devil. Just some people use it wrong, both the chasers and the haters.
  16. BUDOKAI101 Well-Known Player

    Well simple answer here would be just dont run anything the devs make thats gonna slow u down too much. Mechanics can be this games worst feature with mind control and the enemy returning the dmg u do down to puzzles. All and all some mechanics are there to slow down ur progression. If i wipe even once or twice i simply leave group and jump on an alt and do open world and que up. There comes a point when u notice you can get the same progression done even if you don't beat it. Just move on to the next toon and don't wast time trying over and over. If I get mind controlled twice I leave group if I ko myself twice I leave group thats what alts are there for. Mechanics are there to slow u down but they don't have to just leave. look at the timer if it doesnt add up leave. If it was up to me there would be only two ways to get koed and thats from a crit. or the dmg out the ememy is doing is higher then ur health. also there wouldn't be a soda cooldown but I didn't make the game or these dumb mechanics. So know when to jump ship its all in the timer and scorecard.
  17. Control Creed Well-Known Player


    Makes sense, and I get all that but it seems that since revamp "difficulty" has been reduced to one shots, massive health and getting tossed around like a ragdoll while you do the same rotation.

    Counters have basically been removed from the game so now your just doing the same rotation after your camera flies all over the place over and over... there will always be scoreboard chasers, I get it, but mechanics lately is pressing circle based on looking around thet map for items or matching colors or something.

    In other words...

    Nerf Add willpower please.... lol.
  18. RylynneHelm Active Player

    its simple really. the scoreboard chasers are the people that spend the most money on the game. they are also the smallest group of players. but, as in real life, only people with money matter on this game.
    • Like x 1
  19. HurricaneErrl Committed Player

    Damage comps are definitely fine. But when your are in a pug raid when everyone else is just trying finish content, who are you really competing with? Of course I want all my dps in my group to rack up as much damage as possible, but I also want mechanics to be followed and and not have to see 10+ pick ups on my scoreboard line either. There are plenty of instances where more damage does not equal faster completion time.
    • Like x 1
  20. HurricaneErrl Committed Player

    Skipping content. Now thats really getting your moneys worth lol. Sounds like you would be better off topping the scoreboard in event runs if you just want to mindlessly press buttons and not actually play
    • Like x 1

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