How can we spice up Tank Artifacts

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by DuffleBagBoii, May 27, 2022.

  1. DuffleBagBoii Well-Known Player

    Recently we've seen a lot of threads about how tanks are as easy to come by / or good due to people not being attracted to the role. I see that power reworks/animations are not on the table, so lets talk about something that is, artifacts. Other roles get cool artifacts like purple heal ray and birds of prey debuff, what cool truly useful artifact have we gotten? as much as people think manicles is needed its really not i fed that into lasso when I went earth ( earths grab needs the fling removed btw) and tbh only reason I use lasso is because I'm lazy and don't want to pull adds 11x

    What are some ideas for a Tank artifact that would not only make life easier like RAO, let us diversify like Claw and look cool like purple healing ray.. by now you have to realize what im saying, tanks just get boring stuff! what was the last one that circe mask? is that even useful on any power but ice?

    Here is a easy one that I thought of seeing that were in the pet universe online stage, give us a tank pet that at level 80 he acts sorta acts like all the other pet arts, but at 120 he gets the ability to shield the group & those that get shielded get a defense buff close to what earth skin grants for three seconds( have it scale like how arts usually do) if the tanks health drops below 40% give it a minute or so cooldown. I personally wouldn't give the option to buff or heal this pet like we can brick, but because it doesn't grab agro im not sure that you would need a heal.

    Visually I would have the pet look like a paradox monster that way its not aligned with any power, and would look good with all of the current tank powersets

    I think a tank pet artifact would be cool because well, we need something visually cool. also I really miss running a group shield like I could on atomic and in my troll days, it used to feel like I was the groups gaurdian sort of speak, and isnt that what the role of the tank is supposed to be?
  2. nawanda Loyal Player

    I agree that there needs to be something done to make the tanking role more accessible, particularly at the elite levels. The lack of tanks in the game is beyond a joke at this point. It is gating a lot of players who are capable of playing elite, but in other roles, from accessing the content.

    I also agree that artifacts would be a good way to address this, but I don’t have any ideas about the specifics.
  3. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    I kind of think they tried this with Lasso, but not a lot of people use it (I do...as a switch in). While not specifically FOR tanking, it's great with adds and pretty fun when used on the right ones. However, it's not really a help with boss fights so it gets put aside for the 'better' ones. Personally I don't really like pets around me when tanking as they can get in the way of a dodge or roll (yeah...I'm talking to you Man-bat Commandos or Guardian), so even if they made a pet one, I'd probably avoid it unless it was stupid OP over the main 3 most use. (MoF, symbol, everyman), or it was smart enough to stay out of my blind spot.

    But it's not a bad idea.
  4. Trexlight Devoted Player

    Speaking as a Tank, we have a pretty good list of Arts (NOT YOU LAZARUS) and with wearing 3 gives us that solid protection and ability to do our jobs. Adding more Tank Arts will certainly come down the road but I dont think they'll be appealing to make folks want to tank. Players NOT wanting to Tank, as we've seen in multiple other threads, is that its not much of a design issue, its a community issue. Hell you can almost apply that to all the Support Roles because players are just unforgiven, ignore there's a learning curve, and kick immediately if there's one issue or if there's 1 wipe. But I wont rant on that as that horse is kicked a lot and can be found on other posts by fellow Tank players.

    I'll stay on topic regarding Tank Arts. Like i said, There will be more but our toolkit of Arts is pretty solid either across all Tank Powers or even specific ones. You Tank Pet idea should be applied to Earth but Im also going to say no other Tank should have a Pet Artifact. Its certainly a Purist idea but Pet Tanking is specific and should stay with Earth only. As a Rage Player, if I can run with a Pet, Earth loses its flavour and uniqueness. I know Controller Powers dont have a Uniqueness now (which is certainly awful) but I dont want Tanks to fall into that either. And on that token, if there was a Pet Tank Artifact, it would only enhance 1 Power instead of all which they try not to do.

    Now with that said, as a Tank, you can probably get away with really only using 2 Tank Arts and use the 3rd for Utility or more damage. For example, my Main Self Heal Tank Arts are Manacles (which is pretty much BiS in my eyes), La Mort, and Amulet. As Rage, damage I take I get healed so Im not threatened but this spec may be Rage specific. A good Safety Net I also run Manacles, Mystic 7, and La Mort (Finisher is my Rage Canceler). A Proper Tank Art build I use for some hard content is Manacles, Mystic, and Refractor (I like to give group buffs). On Fire I brought in Clarion for extra healing and its group shield. If you pick out 2 strong Tank buffs, use the 3rd however you like for your build.

    I think giving Tank Arts more Group focused buffs and protections would be nice. Gen 1 Arts, while weak to a degree, were more group focused. Arts afterwards are kinda more player focused (outside of the Support roles). Even as a DPS Ive put Tetra back in my build to give all players more Might to help the group.
  5. FreezyPop Well-Known Player

    I’ve been moving away from the Lasso Art, but I was drawn to it in the first place because of how tough it is as a(n ice) tank to pull adds quickly and efficiently, especially on large boards like the source wall fight. Something that extended pulls / CC might be a nice tanking art. Especially if it has any kind of ability to short circuit scripted aggro / drops.

    (While we’re at it, an art that made our breakout actually able to break us out of the growing number of unbreakable boss CC moves would also be lovely)
  6. DuffleBagBoii Well-Known Player



    your right about it getting in the way. maybe it would work if it were a ghost and had a appearance similar to boo and you could walk through the pet, because well, its a ghost.

    your right, the current tank arts do cover all the necessary grounds, but theres really nothing out there to help diversify your gameplay, the main 3 are just passive buffs and the others are boring. right now there are three ways to play troll and they just recently added a art for healers to dip into damage a bit, sure tanks could throw on a dps artifact, heck i since i went back earth i switch between EOG and trans instead of having everyday mans taking up a slot. the current tank arts are probably 100% must in elite, im not sure i dont run Elite, but in regular runs I want something fun that looks cool it doesnt even have to be op
    • Like x 2
  7. Jcal Dedicated Player

    Tank artifacts are very boring for sure. The problem is that the tank artfacts worth their salt are all passive. Manacles, Mystic, Everyman (Circe's Mask for Ice) all work on their own. You don't do anything to trigger them.

    Lasso's the only active Tank specific artifact and it's a problematic one, what with the lack of group crowd control and the issue with aggro on multiple bosses - (I don't consider The Clarion to be a Tank artifact, but it certainly works for Tanks) - It's unfortunate that our funnest artifact just isn't very good.

    I'd really like to see another go at a Pull artifact, this time working with all Pulls. I'd also like to see a Group Breakout artifact. Provide some real, impactful benefits on use, something that we as players actively control.
    • Like x 2
  8. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    SIDE NOTE on this one: I had such high hopes for Laz. It was one of my first ones I leveled up on my tank after refractor because I know how many times you might go down and NO-ONE can get you up due to where you died, covered in adds and bosses. Being able to rez myself and SAVE a run seemed like such a great option. However...at least using a controller...the opportunity to die and auto hit the button because you finger was on it already or it was the next button you were pressing (maybe doing a lunge or if square is your shield power or whatever) when you died made it almost useless...then the fact you come back weak as a baby, probably still in the same situation that killed you. The long timer basically meant wasting it for the next few raids if you mistakenly hit it or hit it on purpose and died immediately after.

    If they wanted Laz to get some love, they'd need to make it so it comes into effect 1/2 way through the pickup timer, not immediately or make it a 'press and hold' action vs just a button press. And bring us back with 1/2 health or a shield. If TV and comics is to be believed, someone rezzed in the laz water comes back an OP berserker...not a baby kitten. Keep the timer so it couldn't be abused, but make it so WHEN you use it...make it count for something good.

    Until then it is probably the absolute worst arti they ever made.
    • Like x 4
  9. 9001BPM Steadfast Player

    Not a tank, but same. I would have appreciated the ability to correct some of my mistakes myself. But it’s practically unusable with a controller. :(
    • Like x 1
  10. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    Yeah, it's not for every instance. I love it in FGS for the hallways as there are a lot of hallways and lots of spread out adds. Dragging them along like balloons on a string is fun as heck, and makes it go a little smoother. For the bosses though, small rooms and low numbers of adds don't really pose a problem for most normal tank pulls. TSW, I'll have it in for the 1st wave of adds and the One Who Laughs fights for the minions, and pop it in for Perpetua for the 2 add/titan waves, but it's useless for the titans, DKs and Perpetua herself.

    I've noticed as of TSW though, that it seems to have decreased in range. When it was introduced around FGS, it seemed to reach further...not sure when it changed, but it definitely decreases the usefulness if it did.
    • Like x 1
  11. Tolly Committed Player

    The problem for tank is not the artifacts, because currently all roles have a significant number of artifacts and more than enough to offer combination possibilities between them, so why would the tank artifacts currently present not be enough for this role?

    I think it's the mechanics and damage violence that is wrong for tanks in this game, not to mention this extremely stupid idea of DLC increases that ruins the whole balance of the game and thus depriving many players from accessing the elite, this is most certainly the devs biggest fault and I don't know about you, but the last DLC shocked me greatly with the gap in the stat of the stuff.

    Sometimes the tank doesn't even have time to perform an action after the previous one, some attacks are sometimes way too fast and sometimes barely visible, let's not forget something else at some point the terrain is unreadable for the tank sometimes overloaded by the pnjs summoned by the players or sometimes also because of the power effects, it's really a big visual mess at times

    I play tank and at the beginning of a new DLC, in the elite content it's extremely annoying with the icon announcing a dangerous attack, sometimes, some attacks have this icon, but they are not dangerous, sometimes and with that we never know what to really block or not, the tank has already quite a lot to do on the field and things like that really don't help.

    There are also some weapons where the animations are sometimes slow creating sometimes silly mistakes and therefore not really our fault.
    • Like x 2
  12. spikeat Well-Known Player

    The recent tank shortage threads are mainly for elite raids where the tank actually needs to know how to play their role. I've seen many RPG players in reg including tanks who "customize" their stats/augs/arts to their personal play style which may or may not fit a team setting.

    I'm usually geared for elite so when choosing artifacts I look for ones that increases my durability and survival chances. Imagine in an elite raid where we get the boss health down to 20% and I happen to slip up. I don't have to describe what would happen if I wasn't using the manacles and what the recovery rate would be if the tank went down. I put all my novelty arts like lasso/eog away for harder content.
  13. VariableFire Loyal Player

    I think another part of the problem with more Tank Artifacts is that all the tank powers work differently so designing an unique artifact to work with one may not benefit others as much. My Fire tank has a lot of self heals, I'd love to spread that healing around. Wouldn't benefit the others as much besides Rage though.
  14. Illumin411 Loyal Player

    I would argue that what’s really gating those players is a general toxic attitude towards tanks who are anything short of perfect. I’m at a point where I all but refuse to tank for any group outside league runs. I’ve main tanked and 2nd tanked SWe runs with little to no wipes. But I’m a human being and am capable of making mistakes. I’ll be damned if I make a mistake in a PUG group and subject myself to their toxicity as a result. Screw that noise.
    • Like x 2
  15. nawanda Loyal Player

    Can’t argue with that.
    • Like x 2
  16. NeoSelkie Active Player

    I kinda wish there was an artifact that would serve as an alternative to the kiting meta in high end content. Something along the lines of a damage reduction when block broken. Lots of different ways this could be implemented, from just adds not being able to block break you, to not being able to be block broken but getting less of a defense buff while blocking. Not arguing for a specific thing, would need to be looked at and balanced appropriately, just think it would allow a different playstyle.

    Kiting and countering isnt hard, it just gets kind of stale after a while.
  17. Pale Rage Dedicated Player

    I gotta stand with what Trex said about it basically being a "community issue." I have one tank power left, and I don't tank with it.

    I have also stated before, that "roles" (although DPS is a role, I'm talking about the other 3) would be awesome with a pet artifact as well. Something unique, not OP, but definitely useful.

    A tank pet, that would taunt enemies to the tank, or even to itself if it was tethered to the tank. Maybe one that would stun all adds when using a shield (cool down pending), or something unique.

    A healer pet that would heal allies, randomly cast a shield.

    Troll pet that would debuff, supply power every so often.

    Something unique to each role, since DPS already has 2 artifacts that they can use, would be fun.
  18. Proxystar #Perception

    I disagree entirely with other tank powers being given pets, that just destroys any uniqueness Earth has while allowing all other tank powers to then gain a pet along with their own unique tanking mechanics and attributes, talk about double dipping.

    At that point we may as well introduce an artifact that gives everyone quantum tunnel as well.

    Couldn't be a more excessive "no" for me on that idea.
    • Like x 1
  19. xxXIRolandIXxx New Player

    While I'm all for cool new artifacts for tanks, that will not resolve the tank population. I switched to tank role back in January. I've played tank in the past but usually switch to another role due to the reason why I believe, from my experience, why the tank population is so low.

    As has been mentioned in other threads, player toxicity is the major issue. Groups wait forever trying to get tanks. Everyone wants seasoned, experienced tanks. Problem is, no one (almost) wants to work with new tanks and help them get to that level of playing. When it comes to tanking elite content (except duos maybe), making a single mistake generally wipes the group. Similar to healing, smooth runs comes from tanks and healers knowing when to spam the right power to mitigate significant damage (lunging bosses at the right moment for tanks and groups heals/shields for healers as an example) as well as knowing the mechanics. It also helps when DPS are more concerned with passing the content rather than scoreboard chasing, but that's another topic.

    While I have had a fair share of patient groups, there's a lot more of the not so patient groups. To be fair, my tank arts are not maxed and are generally low (all 80's, waiting for next artifact bonus exp week). As such, I know not to attempt elite raids (not talking elite+ anything either). However, elite alerts and duos aren't a problem. Can't tell you how many times I've been kicked from groups because my arts aren't maxed. Contrary to popular belief, you don't need maxed or even high arts to pass elite alerts as a tank to have a smooth run. Even at level 80 arts I can solo the new elite duo, but would obviously take forever. Not saying that to show any kind of prowess, it's just not that hard. Yet I still get the occasional duo partner that questions a tank with 80 arts. The elite alert is far worse with regards to toxicity (even though I've successfully tanked both since the GU dropped).

    Knowing others who haven't tanked since launch, but picked it up to help with the shortage are scared to even attempt content for fear of getting kicked from group for making a single mistake (and they have max arts!).

    If the player base as a whole wants more tanks, then that same player base needs to help the new tanks get to the level of tanking they want. We cannot get experienced at tanking elite content if no one runs with us. And yes, I have a league who are good at running content with me. But our play times do not always overlap and I LFG for most of my content runs.

    A point many players seem to forget, everyone runs something for the first time (including elite content).

    Just my 2 cents.
    • Like x 1
  20. Great Architect Loyal Player


    Just fixing the pulls to not have that weird "throw them all over" effect would be fine. I mean you definitely DO have aggro, but they're still all over the place.

    I don't think tanking is in a place where it needs a new artifact. What needs to be fixed is the attitude towards a wipe - more personal responsibility, and less "HEALER!!!!!" or "TANK!!!!" when people go down.

    That's why people Tank and Heal in known groups. There is no shortage of Tanks, or Healers, but you rarely see them in the wild. Because they're sick of the BS.