Test Discussion Episode 43: Artifact M.E.R.C.Y. Amazotron Matrix

Discussion in 'Testing Feedback' started by Ranmaru, Apr 1, 2022.

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  1. TeenWuulf Well-Known Player

    Sorry to be repetitious, but since the OG drone takes up the same "summon slot" as RSK and the two power pets, I'm still wondering if this artifact will have an effect on it, because it seems like an interesting build option if so.
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  2. BumblingB I got better.

    That's the preorder one, right? I don't think it will work with it, because this specifically was designed for RSK, Crystal, and Fury. No other power pets are buffed by it. I suppose Ranmaru would have to answer this, as I don't think we can get this pet on test nor do I have it on live.
  3. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    After retesting crystals AoE attack with mercy went up to 17k. This is up from 14k. Crystal seems to be doing as expected. However fury is still doing worse. Looks like fury is also doing 17k which is up from 13k. However fury without mercy does 21k making it not worth using with fury. It seems that both fury and crystal have had their attacks combined and they do the same attack with just a reskin of the attack. Was this intended?
  4. Aerith Rose Committed Player

    Would be nice if they could include the bat drone for those that have it. It is basically a weaker robot side kick. Has not gotten buffed with robot side kick. Probably because not many people have it.
    • Like x 1
  5. BumblingB I got better.

    Yes, to normalize the numbers, Fury and Crystal got the same beam attacks as RSK did when you hit MAP.

    It's kind of worded wonky, but it's mentioned in the OP. You can also see their names in the combat log. All 3 have a targeting beam that scans if single target or multi target and then a big hit. The problem, which is the same reasoning I mentioned to hellstroke, it does lower the damage of Crystal and Fury significantly. Which is kind of opposite of what I hoped. Because it needs to scan first before attacking, there is a delay to attacks. So speed is causing the discrepancy between with or without MAP.

    I don't know. I like the idea of having MAM work with more pets, but balancing something that isn't available is kind of weird to me. We can let Ranmaru and Charon decide.
  6. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    I am not talking about the ST beam. The Beam used to always be the same for both. But the Aoe was stronger when used by fury originally because fury was designed to hit harder. It was then changed to do the same damage and was wondering if them doing the same damage was intentional.
  7. abdul qayyum New Player

    Hi @Ranmaru, can you not replace offering and fortify golem with M.E.R.C.Y. Attack Protocol ? Cause both is already available. Instead, i suggest M.E.R.C.Y. Attack Protocol to Suppressor Turret and Robot Sidekick, because these two cant buff it.
  8. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    It has to replace Fortify and offering or else players will be able to use both making sorcery and earth broken. This artifact was specifically designed to work with RSK. The only reason it affects fury and crystal is to make sure they get buffs from this artifact so that sorcery and earth pets are not over shadowed by rsk. And Turret is not allowed to work with it because it has other benefits that other pets do not have and this would make gadgets even stronger.
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  9. BumblingB I got better.

    Sorry, they are not called a beam for both.
    The AOE is called M.E.R.C.Y. Power Detonation and all 3 pets use it when you hit MAP on multi targets.

    So the order that happens when you hit MAP is Targeting Beam to decide if ST or AOE then goes into M.E.R.C.Y. Extended Projectile Beam for ST or M.E.R.C.Y. Power Detonation for AOE.

    When you hit Offering without MAM, it would just do it's big hit, which I think was Transmutation and Fortify Golem was Striking Stones. There was no targeting.

    So damage wise, hitting MAP was normalized between the 3 and really the difference in damage is the non MAP Mercy attacks. Unfortunately, because of the "Targeting Beam", it also nerfs the overall damage versus just hitting Offering/Fortify. It is slower because of the delay on the decision of AOE or ST.
  10. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    This raises a question that maybe someone knows? If not hopefully a dev can answer. How often will it scan? Is it every single time mercy is triggered or is it every 10-15-30secs? I’m thinking that if it only scans on occasion then in a fight like grail fgs it may only see one target and not attack any adds/ switch to AoE when she calls in reinforcements 2secs later. Or vice versa and stays AoE when there’s only a boss left. But if it’s every activation, we’ll need to really wait on triggering source after mercy to insure the big hits. Right? Am I overthinking? We also need to play around with weak adds in raid groups and see if it even gets a big attack in when 8 players run into 3 adds. I get one chance on live in most groups to trigger source but fury hits instantly.
  11. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    I think you’re confused by what I said. I’m aware how the art works and how it targets. As well that they have new moves. That’s not in question. Originally these attacks were present when it was first introduced. Each one of these pets were made to do these attacks. However the damage that was produced by said attacks were different because of fury and crystal. Crystal and fury doing these attacks was always a thing. However the damage done by these attacks was different. And the attacks being normalized didn’t mean they were flattened to be the same. They were normalized so that the damage done was within a range. Look at the original numbers I posted and you will see that even thou they were the same attack they did different damage because of the pet that used those attacks.

    Fury always had the strongest followed by crystal and rsk was last. This was done because they did not want sorcery and earth players who were pet classes to be outclassed by other powers that were not originally pet classes. And fury doing more damage than crystal was also a thing. Up until the last full update the damage was balanced even if the attacks weren’t all the same. Fury and crystal using mercy attack protocol were originally doing more damage than they would without mercy. Currently they are doing less damage.

    And I’m not talking about dps. I covered that separately. The damage done by these attacks is what I am asking about
  12. BumblingB I got better.

    It uses Targeting Beam every time you use MAP. Which is why there is a net loss. It's slower to the attack so it's possible GW may not hit the Detonate/Beam.

    I just looked through my logs from the last time I was on last night.
    • Like x 1
  13. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    It scans whenever you use attack protocol. This goes for all 3 pets. Crystal, fury, and rsk. When you hit attack protocol you will see small numbers when you hit attack protocol followed by the actual attack. This is what is causing the delay in attack that isn’t present when mercy is not equipped. It’s the mini damage ticks that they use to scan how many targets there are. I believe it was stated early on
    • Like x 1
  14. BumblingB I got better.

    I don't understand your question then. All 3 got the same attack so they could be normalized.
  15. abdul qayyum New Player

    Talking about balance, you are correct. Jus wanted to suggest that M.A.P is only available to RSK, Collector's Edition Bat Drone for Heroes or Joker's Flying Jester for Villains. But then again, maybe no?
  16. xxHELLSTROKExx Loyal Player

    Thanks y’all. Guess I need to go back to testing it with source. I may have had more mis timed parsers than I thought.
  17. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    Even thou they had the same attack they were originally doing different damage because of their intent. Fury and crystal were meant to get a damage buff when using attack protocol. This can be seen through various post from devs. However the updated damage values for these attacks make it so that fury and crystal do less damage with these attacks.
    My outs focusing to much on the name of the attack. This is why I’m asking about the damage values. Crystal and fury are doing far less damage with this artifact for aoe than without it. Since the artifact is supposed to buff these 2 pets it has to be concluded that this is a bug. It is intended for these 2 pets to do more damage than rsk. This was done to make sure that these pets aren’t outclassed. That’s the reason that damage buff was added. Currently it is not working.
  18. BumblingB I got better.

    ...

    That's actually what I've been saying... Fury and Crystal are doing less with MAM than without. When it should be at least equal.
  19. Rejchadar Inquisitor


    Thanks for the detailed answer ;)

    Why 2 Boo? Well actually several reasons....1. Many tests, little time....2. To be more systematic, I first test builds with similar loadouts...3. For 3 -4 boo you need tack-swaping, and if without it, then additional boo does not compensate for the loss of damage due to the lack of other trinkets....

    Another point, to maximize the potential of the artifact, you need to use the mercy protokol exactly on the CD (not for the robot, for the trinket pets) ... this will not happen in real content, so the more mechanics in the raid, the difference in damage between the regular build and the mercy build will be higher (in the crawl of a regular build).

    I'm not suggesting buffing the artifact itself, I'm suggesting buffing old pet trinkets (boo for example, a few others....), or adding a synergy that won't buff the main cast (using a henchman in a build with a shard in the long run is a loss of damage, not an increase ....)....
    • Like x 1
  20. Ranmaru Developer

    I've investigated the issue with Fury/Crystal and it looks a bit like a timing issue happening somewhere where the damage buff from Offering/fortify (now MAP) is taking an extra second to apply and not causing the first hit to be buffed properly. I can try to do a bit of background work to protect from this (making the first attack a bit stronger to compensate. This turned out to be more complicated than expected, i've gone ahead and hit both Crystal and Fury with another increase in dps on their AoE to cover for this edge case) but i'd make sure on repeated casts of MAP that you are seeing the proper damage. (in the background I have the AoE at about 10% stronger on Fury vs crystal on a scaling parameter to keep up with the inherent difference in stats & animation between the two.)
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