Dev Discussion Better Membership

+1000 from me! I know Epic strong armed Sony into this for Fortnite and there is no way DCUO has the same leverage. I guess I'll upgrade to PS5 one day, but the PS4 is running on fumes. I have the original model. Maybe we can pay an extra monthly fee that DCUO can send to Sony?

This kind of advice, if followed, will lead to people unsubbing and moving on.
You're underestimating the bulk of the playerbase's interest in customization by dismissing them as niche. TCs are paying the rent. The same way skins (styles) pay the rent in every modern game -- like we always told them they would.

People sub for features not discounts and freebies. The bigger discount is always not subbing and not paying anything at all. If the game doesn't offer what someone wants, you won't get them to stay just because you gave them some discounts. Suggesting that they would be satisfied with that, is a misread of the player.

Give people features they're interested in and they stay and play and pay. It's just that simple.

Not correct. The thread exists for Devs to get our feedback. They're essentially asking us what would make us sub or stay subbed. Because they want to know. And only we can tell them. What this thread is NOT; is a democracy. The devs are not going to implement any suggestion here just because it got the most likes and gained the most public support. This is silly to imply.

The devs are exclusively the judge of what is unrealistic and what isn't. Mepps has already said the *only* thing off the table (and unrealistic) is the price of membership. *You* need to understand this is a business and they will decide what's what (for all of their reasons), not you, or any of us. It's our job to tell them what would make us stay or make us sub. If they ignore that feedback and the game pop is negatively impacted by that choice, then the market has decided and people voted with their wallets, and things will play out from there.

Telling people to measure their requests to be inline with what would keep you interested hurts the game because what motivates you won't be enough to keep everyone with different motivations subbed and people will leave. Unless you plan to pay for everyone else's subs, stop trying to curate people's feedback. There is no risk of giving honest "unrealistic" (by your standards) feedback at all.

I'd like to suggest some things from my other favorite MMO, ESO.

The benefits that make the membership worth it in my opinion are:

ESO gives a "Craft bag" for membership, where all your crafting materials go. A similar feature would be nice for DC where we can store all our nth materials, or all of our pets, trinkets, extra armor etc. I personally do not invest my DBC into bank or inventory space, but I would like a place to store all these excess materials.

ESO also gives members 1650 "crowns" each month which is about $14.99 USD (according to their store page). DC currently gives 500 daybreak cash each month, which according to the store is $5 USD. This is something I would like to see increased, by quite a bit.


I agree with the other users about the XP increase or increased drops for artifacts. I only have one character in DC because it is SO expensive to level artifacts, and the controller armory I use is lackluster on that same character because I only have dps artifacts. Meanwhile in ESO I have 6 characters I regularly use because it is easy to level and use other characters. Please make DC more alt friendly.

Give members new exclusive feat free items each month that rotate each month, and maybe they could be new emblems, auras, materials, trinkets like the bat transform (no damage pet trinkets), and other solely cosmetic goods.

Another great feature is the daily reward login system, each month ESO offers a daily login bonus of things like research reduction time scrolls, gold, currencies etc. Another memebership bonus that would be nice is a system like this that could offer DLC currencies, seasonal currencies, and a lot more. This would solve the issue of players wanting seals of completion, preservation, more DLC based exobytes etc.



I know comparing these two games is a lot but they are similar in certain ways, and I think DCUO could take some notes from the amazing ESO membership plan.

Adding to my original post

Power and iconic customisation

This is most important. I'd love to be able to change colours and animations, If I want purple heat vision, green robot sidekick I should be able to have them. Alternative animations for powers that already exist. As an example the snowball throw from ice could be changed so that the snowball has spikes on it, alter lantern constructs such as making the giant weight a boulder instead and so on. If the plan is no more powers ever then that investment should go into revamping current powers.

An extra material slot

There is a lot I can could do if I had more space but 3 is limiting, often i want different mat for certain parts such as the weapon. The material should be redeemable on all characters.

Style save feature

Someone mentioned this before I will say again. A simple feature that lets you save your current style to a gallery that you can switch to whenever you want, it's a simple system nothing to do with feats and gear just the style. I also would like to be able to take pictures of myself and turn those pics into posters to put on a base.

Vault revamp

For such a big part of the game this is really boring. There needs to be a revamp or a new 'member vault' with new styles available and trinkets that drop more regularly. These rare drops should all be account bound.

so I have a few suggestions for membership appeal
features could be reworked to include...
3 free instance unlocks per week, Or more replays per month allowance
Member only collections
a lot of cosmetic items (Bases, styles, movement modes)
Discounted vendor styles in each episode ( aura, mats, etc)
Membership currency (like source marks) and a special vendor

Why I sub currently: access to all episodes, powers, weapons, broker, features of the game, plus bonuses of marketplace cash and legendary points.

Making access to episodes free to all, reduces the value of my subscription. I still get the rest and adding more cash or points to sweeten the deal doesn't feel equitable to what will be subtracted.

A subscriber only feature to drive premmies and freps to subscription is what is needed.

Wish list for subscribers:
Episodes 1 yr and older elite instances release the two deaths and youre out structure
Episodes 2yr and older become very easy including elite versions
Subscriber only PVP map with exclusive feats which can be used as an experiment to improve the PVP game experience
Ps4/ps5 subscribers can choose to move onto their own server....NO PC accounts. loose all items and cash and pending mail.

I'm not saying the customizations are niche...I'm sure a lot of people would want an use them. I might enjoy blue fire vs orange...I might even pay a few bucks for it...ONCE...but not 15 a month or 120 a year. I was saying the users who are going to sub or NOT going to sub because of such a thing (as we've never had it before anyway) is the niche group. If you really believe that this is something solely worth subbing for, well, I guess you are in the niche. We are 22 pages in and MOST of the requests have been for the freebies...not customization options.

Also, if you are saying you think memberships would stay afloat if they removed the replays/500 loyalty/access to cash and the other stuff...but pumped in a slew of cosmetic customizations available only to members...well I guess we'll just disagree. And those are the 'discounts and freebies' we currently get, not including whatever MIGHT be added. I can tell you I would unsub if that was the only thing I was getting for my sub....but that's me.

BTW...in those other games...are those skins part of a monthly membership or a-la-carte? This is a membership improvement thread not QOL or game enhancements. The request wouldn't even be on topic if it were not members only. As a QOL or enhancement to the game itself I'm down with the idea of these kinds of customizations...even if I won't use them. All that is moot anyway as the undertaking would be huge, and likely won't happen in 2 or 3 months....down the road? Sure...bring it on.

I understood you then. And my reply is the same; you're underestimating how important character customization options are to players in a game like this.

We could be talking about any new "feature" but for ease of exchange let's stick with customizations.

If we suddenly got Styles tabs for: Personalities, Powersets, Movement modes. But these tabs were only open for members, you don't think that a significant amount of players would consider this a good motivator to be subbed? The base game would still be free but any real deep level of customization would be reserved for members.

To be clear, [using my suggestion for this example because I know what I mean] a premium member would be able to buy a new personality or powerset style etc a la carte one time and it would replace their current default. But paid members would have their Style manager unlocked and be able to buy replacement styles a la carte, but then be able to switch back and forth between the defaults and any they purchased whenever they want.

Now keep in mind people have alts. Also keep in mind how often people change their costume styles (as a measure of how many people/often enjoy customizing their characters). Also keep in mind, this would create a new opportunity to add things of interest to players to the MP regularly that players can buy and use in their style manager over time down the road too. So, they might not find Blue fire appealing today but 3 months from now when the Devs release Celestial Fire; they'll want that. Or they might see a powerset style that they like so much they roll a new toon to use that powerset that they didn't care about before. ie. I don't have a fire character but if they put in blue fire I would make one to use it. Or players might want to try a different personality or might want to swap them depending on their actual mood -- one day some is feeling flirty and the next they feel powerful. The more options the Devs give players to use with these kinds of new customization systems, the more easy it is to justify locking it behind membership. And players who only want a 1 time Blue Fire could still get that but any player using multiple alts and constantly customizing (there are MANY) would definitely opt to sub for this to be free. I bet as many as were paying for new stories. Now that I'm thinking about it, costume style manager could also be locked behind membership with the new features. Premium players could be allowed 1 free costume change per month (per "save and exit") while members could change anytime.

People also have alts and mains and they'll want to change them back and forth on the go when they get bored. Those are excellent motivators and opportunities to monetize. But again, it doesn't have to be about my suggestion. Others keep bringing up their own variations of the same thing.

This level of customization would also attract a lot of new players and former players who left because they couldn't customize to this degree in the past.

True. But that doesn't mean most players are giving good feedback. Or they're right. Also notice the longer the conversation goes, the more people are realizing and posting they'll need more than discounts. It's going to come down to who knows what the players want more.

?? I wasn't suggesting taking anything away from memberships.

Not sure where this is going. I wasn't making specific suggestions related to skins. As for OoL improvements, I would argue they should be in the basic game and not monetized; therefore bad suggestions to drive subs. That would seem unethical.

Bottom line; if you believe the game is fine as-is and doesn't need fundamental changes, a discount is probably enough to satisfy you. If you believe the game is lacking in some fundamental ways, and they just made most of the game free, then there's no reason to sub anymore -- then you think you need more than discounts to satisfy you. So are there more people satisfied with the game as-is, or more people who think the game needs improvements?

Actually it kind of is a democracy, if singular ideas are being repeated and liked on then those ideas are more likely to be implemented because the repetitional request and repeated positive reinforcement of the idea is entirely what the developers are looking for.

You may not agree with this but I highly highly doubt the developers are realistically looking at any ideas that involve development resources, no matter how much merit they might have.

I know you might not agree with that, but i really cannot help but feel like you're setting yourself up for some unnecessary disappointment.

The amount of times replays, quarks, stabilizers, marks, DBC have been mentioned in this thread over everything else should probably give you an indication as to where the bulk of players desires sit, like it or not.

No offense intended, but how do you know what the devs are looking for?

10 years of general experience and gut feel.

That's why I said, you might not agree.

But when you've got bugs going unchecked for months, aspects of DLCs broken entire cycles, imbalances perpetuating forever, the state of PVP, new things in pvp, resources needed on existing content development, talk of it taking months and months to do the blue beetle outfit, not by any means an exhaustive list and you think they're sitting in here thinking;

"Yes let's make a new style every month, let's add color customization lets add this feature and this feature and that feature..."

Yea, sorry but I don't think that's even remotely happening, and I think deep down you know that too, the devs won't say anything because they won't want to disappoint you but it's true.

This membership revamp is happening in summer, theres just not enough time to develop some of these ideas you people are putting forward.

lol No, no it's not at all.

This isn't the community style thread where they poll and the one with the most votes/likes wins. It's very likely they'll narrow in one or two posts someone makes, that got 1 like or even no likes, and think it's a great idea to run with that can be expanded on. They literally said they're looking for ideas; and they're taking the temperature of where the community is at. Not sure why some people are trying to "decode" that to mean less than what it means. Sounds like it's you guys afraid to be disappointed.

If "big ideas" were off the table, Mepps would have explicitly stated that when he shut down Socrates or any other time he peeked in here. You may not agree with it, and think it's all unrealistic, but the scope of the thread has been laid out clearly.

Here we've (people who feel as I do) explained how the Devs can earn our subs. It's up to them to do the work. All we can do is give them what we're looking for. If they do; great for everyone involved. Everyone prospers. If they don't, it's no loss to the consumer anymore because we don't have to keep paying while waiting on something that might never happen.

Yeah not sure about that.. if someone polled the entire community about what would make you sub/stay subbed, "customisation,(other real improvements) or more free stuff" then the former would win easily...

What might be an issue here is people assuming the devs won't make any real change and saying what they think is realistic not what they actually want.

I see people moan about things none stop but when it comes down to the time to make the devs do something the response is 'give free stuff UWU'

It's this deaftist attitude that I am referring to.. oh they're incapable of making real improvements so better not ask.
You know they have the money right? stats came out few months ago that the game makes a ton. If their bottom line was under threat and they needed to invest to keep profits up, they would.
If people say they will keep subbed nothing but more freebies, then yeah, of course they're not gonna bother investing more in the game. Why would they?

also like it's not my problem if it's too 'hard' the question is what do I want in MY membership and what would make me sub. Not what I think is easy enough for the devs

Styles are consistently added as bonuses to each episode, multiple times, are they not?

And will they not continue to be? Are you wanting to make additional vendor rewards member exclusive? How has that added to my membership when I already get those? All that does is gate free players out episode content thats already free to give the illusion it increased my perks

So instead of putting forward ideas you know are realistic you're putting forward ideas you know are difficult but don't care that they are because it's just up to the devs to figure out how to get it done. Ok.

Yes that's it. My master plan is to troll them by getting them to add lots of cool stuff and do lots of work that will make them lots of money. I'm so dastardly. If only I had a moustache to twirl...

No, I'm putting forward ideas that would motivate myself and others who feel the same, to sub or stay subbed; and understanding the industry from a different perspective and understanding the work involved in my suggestions, I am able to let the Dev team decide for themselves what they're prepared to do.

Remember this post you liked early on.

Now I'm not by any means speaking for Panderus and although they are obviously happy to keep hearing your ideas the last part of that sentence is probably worth reflecting on, in terms of tempering your expectations

And that was his chance to also explicitly state what was out of scope.

Also you're curating out the nuance. Some of you seem to need a really binary approach, but in the real world and in a development context, this isn't practical. Just because someone says "powers" in their reply doesn't mean everything related to powers should then be a separate conversation. A suggestion can involve "powers" but also tie into membership benefits without veering out of scope. That's why he ended with "keep 'em comin".

How is removing an exclusive content-related perk and replacing it with the equivalent of a few more DC equitable?

Are you suggesting that exclusive styles are less enticing to players than seals of completion?