400 SP - wow...really?

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by Reinheld, Apr 11, 2018.

  1. Drathmor Unwavering Player

    trust me when i say this....

    if they are wavedoxing you, they arent a group you want to run with.. they are going to be the first to start a kick as soon as they stand too close to the tank and die and then blame the tank and healer for not healing them or keeping aggro . It will NEVER be their fault
    • Like x 3
  2. Fatal Star 10000 Post Club

    I was never advocating to change how sp are earned.

    I want them to work on the population so people have others to run with at all times.


    Every problem this game has always leads back to the population in some way, shape, or form
    • Like x 4
  3. Black Prime OG Devoted Player

    No, no. What I mean is, pick a time when the majority of our servers are on. Evenings thru the week and weekends. We can't expect Daybreak to keep the server filled 24/7. Even people who work nights know when the busy times are for day players.

    And yes, if you are planning to do something specific, like feats from old content, and expect others to be doing the same thing, at the Same time. Good luck.

    I run my little new alt on the weekends, because there are other lowbies to play with. This is common sense people.
    • Like x 2
  4. Drathmor Unwavering Player

    they should just merge LFG and let us build groups from it. getting rid of the population imbalance and letting us all keep pretending like there is a difference between villains and heroes in this game
    • Like x 1
  5. Fatal Star 10000 Post Club

    Still missing the point.

    The population was higher back in the day when a lot of these feats were current. It was a lot easier to get a group to run them, since EVERYONE was doing them.

    Over the years, the game itself grew, but the population hasn't. It's hard to say if it was more or less active then it was 5-6 years ago, but what you can't deny is there is a lot more content to spread players out. We're about to have 9 tiers worth of content. In theory, the population should have grown with the game, but it hasn't. Anyone that says it has tell me why they had to do so many server merges already? It's getting harder and harder to put together groups to run older feats if you aren't in a league willing to do it.

    If I was the CEO of DCUO, I would be putting all this extra loot box money into proper advertising/marketing for the game while continuing QoL improvements, trying to get people in the door and staying. They're making some efforts like event DLC open to everyone, unfortunately it's not enough if there's other servers such as EU complaining how their LFG doesn't even move in half an hour on the villain side, or on US how literally have the LFG posts are gold bots.

    I'm sure they have some cool features or content being cooked up with all that time capsule money, but really what good will it be if there's not many players to enjoy it?
    • Like x 3
  6. Korlick Loyal Player

    I just checked the Wavedox ranking...and seeing the names of the top places, it made me cry.
    So sad what people are willing to do just to be in a stupid ranking that means nothing.
    • Like x 1
  7. Caesar's Lion Dedicated Player

    Not only was the whole SP system a bit questionable when it came to people joining years after the party started, some of the feats themselves...

    A lot of the open world solo feats are a pain to get if you weren't at level when they dropped (at least you can do those yourself though) & given how sparce those feats are in recent open world, I think they've seen the error of their ways;

    Then you have those monstrous rng feats in the Tier 5 alerts. I remember there being a clue in the T5 Huntress solo right at the start so you didn't have to go through the whole thing only to not have the boss you need. Those alerts though, mist recovery & the alternative Gotham/Metro. I'm still about 2 bosses short in alternative Metro cos I wasn't at level when that dropped. A new player trying to get those...for starters you could queue all night & not get in if you're on a quieter server, then you probably have to run it about 50 times to get all the bosses, with no real reward to speak of, all for 1 25 point feat.

    There are a whole host of these feats throughout the game, where it's not just a case of going in, doing this & you get the feat, but where rng is a huge factor. I don't know how much time you'd need to have to catch up on all of that.
    • Like x 3
  8. Fatal Star 10000 Post Club

    Yeah I got most of those done when they were current, or when I was part of an active feat hunting league a few years ago. I don't expect new players to look at those now and be like "know what, I think I'm going to pursue those." Especially with how long the queues take and hard hard it is to get people to help you through LFG, not mention the leagues i've seen lately are either active, or helpful. Never both. Been in small leagues like I am now that are helpful, then I been in active bigger leagues that just want to talk trash in the HoD all day while ignoring people in their league asking for help. I've yet to find both an active AND helpful league as of late and I'm not expecting a new player to know community well enough to find one themselves.

    It saddens me that nothing won't get done about it most likely.
    • Like x 2
  9. StillDeathern Dedicated Player


    Perhaps if the auto advance option was removed, or the insta-access to new instances, or the time capsule gear removed, players would be less likely to reach end game and need all the feats from what they skipped... (Tiers 1 - 7)

    The crux of the problem really isn't skill points or how they are acquired, but rather players reaching end game so fast that lower Tier content is often skipped over and forgotten. Then the players come to the forums and complain there is no insta-skill points to go along with the insta-access...
  10. Shark Dental Devoted Player

    Yes, because leaving them to rot in the deserted wasteland that are tiers 1-8 is a great idea to keep them hanging around. Who needs to actually play content to stay interested right?
    • Like x 3
  11. Dene Devoted Player

    I'm one of them.. played 2 days of Starro event last year, was on a small break for "reasons" - so this DLC was all new to me

    If they do the same with Anniversary event though *yikes*
    • Like x 2
  12. Jensu Well-Known Player

    Fatal Star i agree with you, it would be unfair to all the vets who worked they buts off grinding for those SP
    • Like x 1
  13. lordexecution365 Loyal Player

    This is a self inflicted problem not a development problem.

    What is being argued here is that SP are so high that newer players are discouraged from playing because when they see them so high that try then feel left behind and choose to quit.

    Then the argument goes on to say that it will take years to catch up because nobody is going for older feats.

    I contest this argument with the fact that it is enough players that need the older feats that choose to wait for others who already have the older feats through grinding the older content, and refuse to join with each other then blame it on the others with 300+SP's saying they are rejected from running older content.

    I have to believe it is not the case that it is not the SP but the desire to play the game due to many variables the grind not one of them because SP can be earned rather quickly and much faster than other games similar systems.

    I am definitely not convinced that a very new player that just downloaded the game for the first time playing on the very first mission looks at there SP level and says no this game is not for me, especially on the console where mmo's are only Beginning to become popular.

    Even if they have friends playing the game, I seriously doubt that SP would be the root cause for them to not continue to play DC, I would first start with needing to sub or pay $5 first then with their friends already having established themselves it would be pretty difficult for them to run with especially when others pull them to run other things that the new friend to the game is not high enough to run the content. It would not be SP that excludes them but the lack of knowledge and skill level.
    • Like x 1
  14. Shark Dental Devoted Player

    So in both scenarios, the new people quit, you're just saying we can't definitely blame it all on the SP problem? It's not too grindy? It's not too unfriendly? It doesn't take years? It's easy to find people to run old content with? Feats magically pop as you progress and learn your role? Nothing needs to be done to correct this runaway train? Will 500 be too much? 600? 700? Never too much grind?
    • Like x 1
  15. Fatal Star 10000 Post Club

    You're purposely taking things out of context here, no one here is saying a fresh new cadet that just left the ship is going to quit over skill points.

    You can't deny once they learn more about the game, learn how important sp are, take a look at the feat menu, then look at how long queues take, how hard it is to get a group for feats, how a lot of leagues will reject them for low CR and SP, that they just turn around and say "screw this, I'm out." if you deny that happens then you don't know the community very well as there are people in this very thread saying how it was a lot for them to take in.

    I don't want the amount of work reduced, i want the tools that help with that work sharpened so they're more efficient, as in we need a bigger population, period.
    • Like x 4
  16. lordexecution365 Loyal Player

    If they are willing to leave because of some leagues with CR and SP requirements then they will leave regardless.

    What I am saying is this, the process, as stated earlier in the thread by someone else works.

    Not all leagues have those requirements and they can form a league as well.

    The keeping or growing the population is a totally different beast, first they need to increase the advertising of the game then remodel the older content.

    You don't need 300SP to beat anything in the game at the moment, what they do need is more forgiving friends, there is nothing that any dev can do for that, if a person wants friends they have to make themselves friendly first.

    The grind is not bad at all, it can be disappointing at times, sure.

    The way the game is now jumps your CR more quickly and you most definitely don't have to do every instance in a tier, so off they do look at the feats menu they will see areas that they need to go to for the first time. There is the problem in itself, by then they look to those that have been playing a while and are quickly rejected, 'cause once you have grinded out that old stuff, going in and out, over and over and over again, it just is stale and makes the older vets want to logoff.

    Negativity breeds negativity and is far more cancerous to the game far more than seeing how many feats you need to do.

    If you enjoy the game and find it interesting then you will die right on in. Arguing for those a little shaky well they are on the fence and need guidance. I guess it breaks down to how is guiding.
  17. the solowing Steadfast Player

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  18. E Clip Dedicated Player

    Super grindy feats should have never been in the game in the first place, those who have completed them would feel robed out if they are handed out to others for free, but those who are new will take even longer to complete now because content isnt current and its not played anymore. Its a stupid situation, however I think instead of thinking about your time that was spent in feats you should try and put yourself in a position of a new player that will be overwhelmed with the amount of content to run. Content which he cannot run as quickly as we did when it was current, so newer players will spend more time than we did simply because they would have to spend very long time to form groups.

    Feats that can be done by doing any piece of content only a few times are fine, but the grindy feats are not. Someone starting now would have to be on grind mode for a long time, starting from all the styles which are in the first 4-5 tiers, then grinding 250 duos, 500 cc bounties, 100 bounties metro battle zone, 25k bits, 100 anomalies, 5k reapers etc etc etc. This is a lot when you have to do all at once and play current content, so in my view newer players are at a disadvantage when it comes to obtaining some of these feats, villains even more so. I've also worked for these feats little by little and they didn't take too much of my time because I was doing that content anyways for marks or gear. Newer players dont benefit from that content as we did when it was current. You really need to think about this, the value we got out of those feats and the value newer players will get out of these feats is simply not the same.

    In December I came back after 2.5 years break, I had 212 SP, took me 5 months to get to 343 and even with that 'little content' I have to do I still find it incredibly time consuming to run all of it because I need marks for all of those DLCs, I need the styles, OP collections etc etc. Im not complaining though, I run as much as I can and I only have 2-3 more DLCs to cover, but I wonder how would a player starting the game today would feel about getting feats from 30+ DLCs and how healthy is that kind of environment for newer players. All styles, all OP gear/collections, all TC feats, all PvP feats, all the super grindy feats I mentioned above .... its a lot to ask imo, its a big upfront time (and money of course) investment that's being asked of newer players.

    TLDR; some feats from older DLCs that are difficult to get at present times should be made easier to obtain. Grindy feats should not be included in future DLCs and the ones that are currently in game in older content should be reduced by a lot. The rest can stay of course, I dont think handing out feats should ever become a thing, but the ones I mentioned, well I think something needs to be done about it, because the problem will get even bigger as time goes on.
    • Like x 1
  19. lordexecution365 Loyal Player

    This is what I see when I hear the complaining about SP.

    They are not ground breaking feats that will get you to 300SP, excluding the styles, which you still can walk in to older content weekly or when board.

    The reaper feat and r&d feats are the easiest to get in a single day, it is just boring. I had to do that feat at tier at least newer players can solo them since they would be at a higher CR by the time they get to doing the feat.

    The r&d feat is tedious and super easy to get since they allow you the recovery kit especially the beta kit.

    Not wanting to run duo's or alerts, newer or older, it is the reason it is seen as being lazy or only wanting to play 1/4th the game. Again only 1 or 2 SP maybe.

    The drops for styles has always been the most complained thing about the grind. It is much better than before, at least we now get unattuned gear without having to roll for the drop.

    While it is easy to complain about grindy feats and knowing that it is highly disliked by a good number of players, they are a good opportunity to meet others and have conversations, not necessarily about the game itself but also to hear others thoughts about loadouts, various experiences in the game, and to simply have fun with your time.

    Again sounds more like they should just end those tiers all together and Grant everyone all the feats from them and the most current content then start a new so new players can be at the same level without having to experience that old portion of the game.
  20. WilderMidnight Steadfast Player

    not being able to find people to score old feats has been a thing for the past five or so years. trying to find people to open up mentor missions even longer. at thiss point you'll be hard pressed to find players who will help you with the shark feat in the new ssi raid and that takes like 20 seconds of everyone just hanging out in a pool...

    i know if i were a new player seeing i had 400 skill points to work towards and seeing what i had to go through to get those 400 skill points...i'd head for the hills without looking back. this is why i dont like the new skill point board. theres a lot of grind a new player is going to have to do just to get to a point where they can start speccing into might aand power with little wiggle room. The old weapon trees as tedious as they were allowed for a better sense of progression. more satisfying.

    once again were painted into a corner here. feats and skill points have become something of a joke this past year. too many available from time capsule purchases, too many grindy r and d feats, skill points just being flat out given away. if we must we must but we have to do something and what needs to be done just isn't.

    we still have a lot of new players coming in. in fact sometimes i'm surprised to see so much life in the pd's. problem is we still arent retaining those new players. they arent moving up. its the same pattern. they play a lot for a few weeks, less for a month or so after that and then finally they just stop logging in. at least the new players i come across do.

    there are three things that need to be done:

    1) pvp needs to get fixed. whether you love it or hate it one of the biggest attractions to any kind of online mmo game is its pvp and how players can compete against each other. the stronger your pvp arenas are the bigger a crowd you're going to attract.

    currently we have zero pvp.

    2) we need more content. so much more content. if only we could somehow just inject about a dozen much needed solos, duos and alerts into the game. our busy work content is in desperate need of updates: Survival Mode and new Legends PVE maps (solos/duos).

    3) the revamp needs some updating. at this point all the forum vets know how i feel about it. you can love it all you want, wake up next to it tomorrow morning for all i really care but the truth is the revamp is a fail. players are not impressed. sorry and thanks for all the hard work, worth a shot...now please fix it.

    until these things happen they may as well just throw in the towel and hope someone somewhere can come up with a dcuo2. i hear those other superhero games are years away from going live. maybe hooking them up to the dcu could speed up the process...
    • Like x 1