Test Discussion Water Powers

Discussion in 'Testing Feedback' started by spord, Aug 11, 2017.

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  1. kraptastic Well-Known Player

    This actually really scares me due to showing that some testers don't play live to know this and are using the test server as a free game without helping it. How can this persons testing be trusted? Does it make other testers look worse? The statement is obviously from someone on test as they say "we". Why can't they make it so legendary only get to test (regardless of platform, notice how you can log in via psn and Xbox live on forums thereby linking you)? It would encourage people more focused on the game in my opinion. And if not enough would sign in then either devs or paid testors should be logging in with them to test.
    • Like x 1
  2. Ala Rebeldex Loyal Player

    Hey i´m innocent i pay my monthly fee! lol
    • Like x 1
  3. Shark Dental Devoted Player

    I can see water being pretty strong as a ranged damage power in groups with lots of adds. All of its damage abilities (except the 35% finisher) can hit (and do hit very consisently) 8 targets. I think the damage seems good considering that most abilities are able to be used at max range, along with the benefits of High-Tide and Riptide. At the same time, it doesn't feel OP either compared to most of the powers I used on test.

    Note: These are not max damage rotations as I have no pocket troll and plenty of latency. I only used the in-game parser and compared results with basic celestial and rage rotations, since it looks like Water falls pretty closely into that quick clip-one-power-with-another-power playstyle. So these are just general impressions, not concrete parses of numbers. In other words, don't nerf or boost anything without corroborating evidence, lol.

    I was going to ask why Depth Charges (I think it's called, just closed down the game a second ago) as a 300-cost ability with 0 CC effects hits for almost exactly the same as both Shark Frenzy (without High Tide) and Aqualance (also without High Tide), which are 200 cost powers. But I noticed it's also extremely fast with little dovetail, so you can basically sneak in a Depth Charges at the end of both SF and Aqualance while their animations are playing out. Still, for the cost and lack of other add-ons, I'm still surprised it doesn't hit a little bit harder. Has anyone else noticed this?
  4. The3meraldKnight Active Player

    I could feel it not hitting hard enough. As a 300 PC move, it doesn't feel like it's worth it to use. For the most part, I have kept it out of my loadouts because of that.
  5. Drathmor Unwavering Player

    really loving the change to the range combo move also being a heal and reducing high tide makes a hybrid build feel much more viable than how it was and a lot more fun... I haven't ran a raid with it yet but looking forward to healing with it. wish there was at least one more move that could do damage and heal also but couldn't find another option.. also I don't really see how you would have room for Riptide and high tide in your loadout making you choose between them or losing a move you might need not a fan of being trapped in a loadout if someone had to have both i think it would be better to do more like nature had were one was primarily a DPS interaction and the other one was a healer one but i know it does give options just not optimum ones
  6. Mystere Well-Known Player

    Been testing water DPS, it is a little lackluster. Here are my thoughts for improvements:

    1. Tsunami Strikes = Too narrow of a cone in front of caster; not very tsunami like. Widen the cone

    2. Depth Charge = While one of my favorite abilities, the cone also needs to be widened. The distance is perfect.

    3. Waterspouts = Increase distance to be equal to that of depth charge.

    4. Crashing Wave = Love the power - hate that it must bring you into enemy. Can we get an option to not have it draw us to enemy?

    5. Aquatic Arsenal = DPS seems low for a melee power. If we have to keep crashing wave as a draw into enemy can you please work on the animation tails so that you can go crashing wave into aquatic arsenal more smoothly - there is a slight bump. Also the damage cone for Aquatic Arsenal should be increased and the damage depth increased. One last suggestion for this ability, instead of a sword - can we get a trident!!? Actually just thought of something - make the first activate of Aquatic Arsenal jump you to enemy and the subsequent taps do the combo. Then you can remove the jump to enemy from Crashing Wave.

    6. Shark Frenzy - can we make the cast instant - the slight delay is annoying when trying to chain abilities together

    While I like the High Tide concept - is there a way to make this work without taking up a space on the ability bar?
    Also, since Bubble does a decent dmg bump, can we make Bubble cooldown (for DPS only) also be reduced by Tsunami Strikes and Aquatic Arsenal?
    • Like x 5
  7. Ala Rebeldex Loyal Player

    Well, first things first, a HUGE thank you for the changes made on Tsunami Strikes on healer role, Battle healing with it feels so much better now, and even for a pure healing build is a valid option aswell. Excelsior! :D

    Now, with more testing hours at my back in both roles (healer and DPS) i'm going to make some suggestions that i hope can be evaluate it by the developer team:

    - Change the High Tide interaction of Aqualance in healer role: This is a burst damage move that leaves a DoT if HT is up, so my suggestion is that instead of leaving a DoT in the enemies make a change to leave a group HoT while in healer role, keeping the first part of the power a damage ability. This will give us an aditional "hybrid" ability to play with if we chose to Battle Heal.

    - Ebb and Flow: the damage can be raise a little bit IMO, especially the second part of the combo because it really needs a lot of timing and practice to get use to it.

    - Make Tsunami Strikes clipable faster. Right now, you need to let almost the whole animation run before the damage is registered, which feels really weird coming form a player who loves the combo powersets and their cliping potential.

    - Swap the High Tide interactions of Tempest Guard and Blessing of the Depths. This is based on my testing while healing, when the shield is up there is enough time to raise the health bars of your team mates, so the aditional effect of TG is pretty much wasted, it can be more useful to have a HoT after the Shield expires than a burst heal IMO; while BoD can use that second burst effect if HT is up for those OMG moments when u need to burst heal several team members.

    - Aquatic Arsenal: this power needs a serious buff, it feels really weak for being a melee attack. Maybe raise the damage value of the initial cast and the last animation (the mace one) to make it more worth it.

    - Deep Charge: underwhelming ability that needs a buff to even consider it a viable choice. Raise the base damage value plz.

    That´s all for now. I´m falling in love with this powerset, keep doing an amazing job guys! ;)
    • Like x 7
  8. The_fair_1 Committed Player

    I like this except for the change to tempest guard and blessing of the depths, the HoT placed after blessing is so perfect when used with that power
  9. Ala Rebeldex Loyal Player

    I feel like its a weak HoT, but i wouldn´t mind if stays a HoT but got buff a tad. On the other hand i just think that the Hight Tide effect of Tempest Guard is a waste, i always had the time enough to raise up the health bars of my teammates by the time the shield expires, so a HoT after that would be better IMHO.
  10. stärnbock Devoted Player

    not a fan of those new animations. but: if you adjust your settings for highest fade for effects, it doesnt help much for area effects and the shark frenzy. it just makes everything look even more blue than it allready is, but it doesnt help a bit for the visuals to actually fade.
    even worse: i completely loose all other effects and can not even see AOE's from bosses. but tranquille of the sea and frenzy still blind me anyways... it is rather frustrating to have a screen covered in blue all the time... just saying.
  11. Celestial Powers Committed Player

    This,

    I mentioned this in my initial post in a different form but this is basically similar to what I was getting on about, a burst heal after a shield is pretty much useless as this shield allows you the time to prevent damage already so the burst heal you receive once the shield wears off is useless in a burst format since you may have already topped people off.

    Also, have a much bigger burst for that 8 man is also an interest concept since as I've mentioned it feels pretty weak, this change will help mitigate that since the burst will be much bigger with the high tide interaction.

    Actually this makes a lot of sense and as it seems like my suggestions for high tide won't be taken into account please do what the above has suggested as they look like they complement each other much more than how it's currently set up and seems like a much more minor change than as I suggested previously.

    --------

    8Man Shield - HoT at the end, and since the cooldown and power cost are much higher than the 8Man heal the HoT should be majorly increased which in turn should fit with your guidelines (Even if we as a community agree that the majority of the HoTs in this game are now weak post revamp)

    Priority - I think with the base increase of the heal I would say this feels like a better choice now as the High Tide interaction heavily increases the healing potential, this interaction will mainly be used for the tank but valuable never the less, it's the strongest heal in the game with High Tide.

    4Man Heal - Still a strong option, and will have contention for use against all the other options - lower cooldown than the eight man so you won't always want to use the High Tided 8Man Heal, the 100% critical chance 4Man might be enough for that situation

    8Man Heal - Given the explanation of the lower base healing amount I would say that yes the lower base is justified and swapping the High Tide interaction from the 8Man Shield helps alleviate that negative and makes it much more attractive to use High Tide, of course this would mean that the interaction with High Tide will result in a lower burst in comparison with how it is attached with the 8Man Shield I think it still synergies well as it can still crit, it has render distance range and that extra burst (Currently with a rough base heal of 104 with the 8Man Shield even if this was halved I think it would still be a valuable amount in the healing interaction if it was swapped onto the 8Man Heal)

    Typing up this post makes me realize even more that this is a major benefit for usage of High Tide in healer role as currently it doesn't feel all that desirable to use as how the bonuses are set out currently as not every ability benefits as well as another but doing this will definitely second guess us all as to what the primary / best loadout for Water Healing will be.
    • Like x 2
  12. Drathmor Unwavering Player

    I wish we didn't have to give up a spot for a power interaction and nothing else(high tide). it takes up space in our load outs but it doesn't really do anything except power up other moves.

    I feel that would be better implemented through power interaction like have high tide be the interaction based off of a move like (crushing is) and then consequential moves would then benefit from that interaction like say the next move, then would have to be reapplied if you wanted a further interaction. there by freeing us up in a healing loadout to use Riptide or another heal move.

    the power set would flow much better that way than what is currently offered with two moves that are really useful but would take a 33% chunk of our load out (high tide, riptide)
    • Like x 1
  13. spord Developer

    Thanks for the report. We are working on a fix for this.
  14. spord Developer

    The High Tide effect is meant to be for your group. A fix should have gone to PC Test yesterday.
    • Like x 1
  15. The_fair_1 Committed Player

    So how I see it is that the HoT after blessing isn't too small as I get about the same as I do with CoP on sorcery. And what you can do is that after you use Tempest Guard you don't have to heal then cause it's still letting in like 25% of the damage so you don't even have to heal during that time cause when the shield breaks they get an insta heal probably bringing them to max health so it allows you to conserve power
  16. The_fair_1 Committed Player

    I see it as like how a weapon buff fits into your loadout it doesn't deal damage just powers up your attacks on some way shape or form and is a clippable move
  17. Drathmor Unwavering Player

    through out the game the weapon buffs always did damage with a proc its only been the last few weeks that that has changed
    the problem i have with this one is we have 2 such powers one that acts like a PI (hightide) and one that acts as a shortcut kind of like phase dodge did by giving a clippable move that lets you recast a power quicker (riptide)

    so water has 2 loadout spot stealers

    I know were way into testing and I doubt it will be changed just wanted my thoughts on the issue put before the devs as i feel it slightly pushes us into a forced loadout for healing and takes away some of our needed heal powers
    • Like x 2
  18. Celestial Powers Committed Player

    The HoT from the 8Man High Tide heal is much weaker than CoP. I don't have the base values on hand but if a friend is reading this she might be nice enough to post them so you can see the comparison.

    In regards to Tempest Guard, yeah in theory that sounds like what you can do but everyone's shield will break at different times meaning healing will still be required, so the output of healing you do indirectly effects everyone else who still has the shield on meaning if they are full health since you have been healing those who have lost Tempest Guard (because the shield has mitigated the maximum) then that High Tide burst heal from Tempest Guard becomes worthless. But on the other hand if it were a HoT then the usage of High Tide for Tempest Guard isn't completely power / ability utilization inefficient since the HoT will cover damage taken as time passes.
    • Like x 1
  19. The_fair_1 Committed Player

    Yea I know exactly where you're coming from but I'd rather have both be HoT rather than give the burst Heal a second burst Heal. Blessings HoT only heals for 6 seconds whereas CoP is a 12 but the numbers I get from both on just me are within like 100-150 health of each other which is still nice
  20. The_fair_1 Committed Player

    Which I get that it's dislikeable but like I'm used to sorcery and you had offering so for me it doesn't matter cause I'm used to powers that don't deal damage but what's new is that these ones clip XD
    • Like x 1
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