Jen's is dropping bombs.

I was once kicked from a run of Nexus of Reality (when it was hard) because 7 other players in the group were in the same league and the other, main controller, who had more pieces of 87 gear than me, wasn't able to perform as well as I could. But him being in the same league as everyone else, they kicked me because they couldn't kick their friend. Even though he was horrible.

I was also kicked once from Arkham Asylum because I was at CR and couldn't solo the final boss due to the ineptitude of the players in my team, causing them to die. When one left during the fight, another player joined the group during the battle, we wiped again and I was kicked for having a low CR.

I've heard stories of players being kicked because their friends came online. I've heard stories of people being kicked because they wanted to play their regular role, but overzealous DPS didn't want to waste time with that role as it "wasn't needed".

This won't happen now, thanks to the changes being made. But...

I've been running Legends PVE a bit as I love the concept but unfortunately, I'd say 90% of the time, grouped up with low level newbies, who haven't even made it to level 30 yet. They don't know what they're doing. One guy got his "100 Hit Combo" as Green Arrow because all he did was tap range. They always storm the boss and never wait for the group. When you tell them things to help, usually "Hold R1 when you have low health, stop running away from the boss", they completely ignore you. They deserve to be kicked but now it's impossible and it's going to be a chore on instances like Area 51, where it only really gets challenging at the third boss.

I guess this could be remedied (if just slightly) by limiting Legends PVE to Level 30 players only, though. But still doesn't guarantee it'll never happen.

Meh, I say go for it. Experiment. See what works and what doesn't. Research and trying new things never hurt anyone.

Will Safe House arena hostage rescue be included this Thursday? I know there were issues in the past with this map.

So for a week im not going to be able to run raids because everyone will que in and say "reset me or im not moving" theres so many problems with removing the kick button.

Injust kicking? it takes a majority vote to kick ppl so most of those ppl who complain of injust kicking where kicked for a reason, about like why did i get banned knowing full well why they where banned! u see my point spytle

People do not accept help when it is offered. I offer it every time. Several others do the same. I can count on one hand how many positive reactions i've seen from offering advice in-game.

That's not to say I give up on anyone without utilizing every possible solution first, but at the same time it is often the case all possible resolutions are exhausted, and the raid will not be completed with that particular player present.

In those cases, we will now be required to forfeit the instance, replace the player, and start all over again. That can waste an hour or more of time for all eight people involved - over one person's actions.

-------------------------------------------

Removing the kick option will severely cripple raid PUGs. People will only be able to raid pug by being extremely cautious, with heavy exclusions before entering the instance - which will only lessen probabilities of problems due to player assets.... not necessarily regarding their ability, and no minimizing the chance of terrible attitude at all.

No kicks will make players more apt to utilize ignore lists, less likely to run with people they do not know, and the longer they are not an option, the more severe and noticeable these effects will be. Effects that will remain in the game regardless of the following actions for a long period of time.

This seemingly simple option is going to have HUGE impacts on the playerbase and will have massive consequences in terms of players willing to play with strangers.

Please reconsider this. I do appreciate you guys really stepping out and responding to players.

I truely believe Kick Tokens to be the solution.

A single Kick Token allows a player to initiate a vote, or vote yes to a kick vote.
Each player is granted 3 Kick Tokens which reset weekly.
Further Kick Tokens must be purchased in the marketplace.
Kick Tokens!

Oh! Also, how about Kick Counter Tokens. Grants immunity to kick for 1 hour.
Only drops from iconic solos, tradable on broker.

The first person who tries to hold my raid hostage, I'm going off.

Had a tank try to pull this crap in Throne last boss a week or so ago. He thought because it was a struggle to get a tank that day..... that he could get a reset out of us.....he got booted without second thought. It took 10mins, but he got replaced in the end.

So now, if something like that happens again, we're going to have to just disband and do it all over.....that's bs man. It's going to become a common problem now, because they have the advantage now.

You guys truly underestimate how many d-bags there are in this game and it only takes one person to messed it up for seven other people now.

I think that there ARE modifications that could be made to the kick system that could go a long way towards making it less likely to be a problem.

-- Voting currently has "Yes" highlighted first. Simply making "No" the default option would require every player to make a specific decision to make that yes vote. Accidental votes have routinely contributed to kicks.
-- Alert votes are a bit strange because there are 4 people. A vote to kick is initiated and already gets one yes vote by the player starting it. In addition, the player in question of the vote is unable to vote, so out of the two players remaining only one player needs to vote yes for the kick to pass. Making alert votes require all 3 people to vote yes can make a huge difference here. As it stands now, if two leagues join an alert, with two members in each league and things go sour, the kick option will work for either side of the coin - whoever initiates it first.

The obvious first option to test was increasing the number of votes needed to approve the kick. That idea has been addressed in every thread concerning this.

Replay badges are abused daily by people to gear up faster and b3cause of it the entire gear structure has changed drastically since their implementation some would say they've caused more harm than "abusing the kick system" but I'm 1000% positve the devs won't remove those.

Its not even that stark.

I was simply wanting them to make it actually require a majority in alerts. Right now, due to the player being voted on unable to vote, all it takes is a 50% vote in favor really. A majority of four people should be at least 75%. 3 people. All three players other than the person being voted on.

I often put vote kicks up, so this drastically affects me.

And how well exactly has the community policing themselves worked out so far?

So, how has the "non participation" penalty been working out in PVP? I haven't heard much talk about it.

The only issue people are afraid of is players not participating and or holding the instance hostage.

What if there was a way to detect these people (if there really that many out there) and have a way to force PVP flag on them? Then the rest of the group could just beat the crap outta them and that would remove the player from the instance.

I know, I completely agree. The only option for 4-man content was to up it to 3/4. There are other options for 8-man content that could have been tested, 5/8, 6/8 etc.

You can't include the person being voted on. You can only include the people who are voting. In the case you mention, that amounts to 3 people. A majority in that scenario is 2 out of 3 people. What you are describing is a unanimous vote - 3 out of 3.

Furthermore, the system looks for a simple majority. In the case of 8-player content, you only have a pool of 7. A majority is 4 people. That seems like it is only half the raid, but it is not, it is a majority of the potential voters (8-1) so the vote kick is not hard to achieve.

The system itself is percentage based, not count based. We could unanimous in alerts but it could then only ever get up to 6 in raids due to the math.

No offense but some of the maps are just poorly designed. Especially when you take into account bugs. Ever get the 14 second respawn bug in shadowlands? Really any node map? There goes any "fair" chance you've got at winning.

I see getting rid of the map rotation as helpful for feat hunters and not much else.

On the note of getting rid of the kick option, previously it took multiple people to grief one person. Now one person can grief 7 others. Even if the old system was as abused as the same 6 people keep claiming, this just seems by far easier to abuse.

im not really for the removale of kick ...

This weekend in hoh we were on cerebrus and the group was trying to get the no hands no feet (feat) and just couldn't do it... The healer instead of just leaving grouo and then logging off logged out in the instance ....

Of course before kicking we waited about 7 mins realized they weren't coming back and started a kick vote ... So we could get another healer...

I dunno I think there will be more trolling with no kick then with ...


Also will you be bringing back 1v1 lair battles with all nap rotations gone? We haven't seen 1v1 lairs in about a year or longer... I think a lot of us really want it to come back

Exactly spytle.

Right now, there are four people in an alert, and since the vote is only based on three people, two is indeed a majority for the vote itself. The issue I have is there are actually four people, and one being excluded.

That means that in reality, because there is one excluded, it means that there can very well be two people in favor of the person being kicked, and two against - just for the people against the kick, one is excluded due to being the person in question.

The VOTE itself is a majority right now - 2 out of 3 - but there ARE four people in the alert, which means since only two people are needed to vote yes, really... it means only 50% of the people present are required to kick. This vote is unlike any other vote involving the instance like disbanding, inviting, or opening for matchmaking.

EDIT - I apologize, I really wish I can quote with this laptop, but the quotes do not work very well on here.

It's posted in the thread... It must be true!