Pay to win? yes

You don't think being guaranteed at a disadvantage would be discouraging? If I was free to play I would never queue for arenas.

I am a Free Player, although I stopped playing for many reasons. And never went Premium/Legendary for other reasons.

The thing I realized, it wasn't just a Cash Cap for Armor that was a problem in Arenas. Personally, I thought it was pointless and pretty much redundant. Any player would soon realize it wasn't just Armor, I should be paying for DLCs to access more Skillpoints (for WM and Innates), the Mods (Exo and Tactical), the Consumables (Soder Next), the Belt, and the Trinkets. And I should be doing all the PvE Missions for all that stuff. Pay to Win? Not exactly, but certainly I need to pay to at least be on par with everyone else.

I could be the most skilled PvPer in Freebie Gear (I'm not), but that's not going to mean much when my enemies can refill their Health back to full rotating the Soder Next, Supply Drops, and health-replenishing Shields besides out-damaging me by ... a lot.

The thing is right now, apparently the Devs are considering fully separating PvP and PvE. Obviously, I'm not sure how that is going to affect everything. They might redo the whole PvP-Armor sales/progression system with no restrictions. They might keep in HT (and I think they should). They might force everyone to use the same Soder type (therefore no longer having to get them through PvE, or trade). So my need to buy DLCs might not be as important other than getting more Skillpoints, and that's a very important factor to consider.

In the end, I'm well aware it's a business. If someone only loves PvP, they should support the game somehow instead of making it totally free. However, there are plenty of different avenues to do it, instead of basing making money off of PvP-progression.

Oh thank god, someone give this guy a medal. Completely agree

As stated

That's an indirect effect of it as gear level isn't taken into account within the matchmaking system itself.

this thread was loads of fun... lolz

dcuo isnt P2W...

/thread

Tell me how to win as t1 against t5+ the skill points mr. pro

Omg, omg, omg did they start putting gear in the marketplace? That's what pay to win is. How could they do that and me not hear of it?

Actually you can get around 130 skill points without paying a dime. The Lone Lantern was a FTP player who did such a thing.

EDIT: Added link to his thread.

https://forums.station.sony.com/dcuo/index.php?threads/most-accomplished-free-to-play-player.177091/

If you want to get technical, loads of us payed for a certain pvp dlc and we haven't had access to parts of it for years.

of course it is you cant even buy the R&D sodas as f2p i would say 9/10 Free to play games are pay to win

Since you already made up your mind that this game is pay to win why did you make this thread?

It wasn't him who made the thread

let me sort things out for you.

35 sp t1 pvp dps f2p player vs 35 sp t1 dps Legendary player. who wins? it's 50/50

this game isn't p2w it's p2p. people pay for extra cash simple. the devs didn't guarantee that you'd win every match vs a f2p player and you can access most of the maps so what part of this game's pvp is p2w?
anyway you're complaining about a problem which doesn't exist. you're initial post wasn't constructive so why has this thread lasted up to 4 pages?

This argument is really just absurd.
The parts of this game that are completely free are 100 times better than 90% of games I've payed $60 or more for and can be played through more than one time and still be a blast.
................................was going to say more, but it seems rather pointless.

or maybe take your own advice and stop playing

Explain to me what is difference between Free to Play and Pay to Win. Last time I check Free to Play means you can download the game for free and play to hearts desire without the game ever demanding you to pay for anything. Pay to Win means that you can actually purchase IN-GAME EQUIPMENT (that means DLCs are excluded) that can almost guarantee a sure win.

You shouldn't be paying for DLC access? Why the hell not? You know it takes man hours to actually make those DLCs and release them to the servers right? See the problem with you guys is not the Cash Cap nor the Armor. The problem with you guys is that you guys are never content specially if it's already being given to you for no charge. Instead of saying thank you, you guys ask for more.

You guys want to be able to compete with guys who has Legendary Subs or the folks who bought the DLC? Then buy the DLC just like every single one of those folks who did. You're right you could very well be the best PvPer in Freebie gear but against guys who has a full gear and knows wat they're doing, they will trash you and you team quick but is that their fault or the dev teams fault that you cant reach the same potential because you didnt buy the DLC?

What the heck are you talking about separatng PVP and PVE? It's always been seperate.... They wont re-do the PvP Armors nor the Soder Colas. Why the heck would they want to make any DLC less useful or less important than the others? That's just dumb, why release a DLC that really does nothing to the gameplay? Free or not.

There are a lot of games that has released DLCs that's been free but mostly are now paid. Think of it as an expansion, actually it is an expansion. If you played the original World of Warcraft and when the expansion came out did anyone say, WOW is pay to win type of game? No right? Then this is the same way, you get to play the base game for free but beyond that you either have to sub or buy the DLCs. Actually with Game Updates you already get more than you would any other game.

Actually this is quite possible with well timed blocks and the right combo it is possible to win as long as you have a good amount of skill points and you're at level 30.... If you're not level 30 with a good amount of SPs then I dont thin you can win any PvP unless of course it's in Legends.

I actually dont see what's your problem... OMFG $1566!? As a premium free to play player you should have enough to even buy the highest tiered pvp gear. Last time I checked it doesnt require you to have any DLC whatsoever. It seems to me that all you really want is more access of the game while paying almost nothing....

I actually haven't fully embraced the idea that this game is Pay to Win, as it doesn't exactly qualify with buying specific items from the marketplace that guarantees a win. What people do need nowadays is pay to access every stat-enhancing item (armor, weapon, Feats, ExoMods, Tactical Mods, Trinkets) and non-core game Consumable in order to compete.

Because I don't support the decisions made by SOE/Devs. So I don't say Thank You either. If you don't mind paying for constant screw ups and can tolerate the inability to play the game, that's your decision. I've made mine.

Actually, I don't want to compete with Veterans in Max-Gear at all. Yet the Matchmaking System and the lack of PvP-population ensures that I will be facing them. I would prefer a system that I can progress my character with/against other players that are around my gear-level. Unfortunately, this is not the case. A decision I do not support.

Actually, there was a Work In Progress topic about fully separating PvP and PvE. This means not allowing PvE-Armor in Arenas which has always been a problem with balance issues. They were considering keeping out certain aspects of Home Turf (which I don't support actually). Progression in PvP would no longer rely on doing PvE-Missions. At least that's what I hope.

They already made Last Laugh less important already thanks to the PvP Seasons. During the first season they basically made sure the best gear (pre-Seasonal T4) was free. It was only this Season they decided to play a Cash Cap on the best Armor. They allowed access to all maps except Home Turf's Arena 1v1 Lair Battle. Of course they also stopped rotating a few maps, rendering Last Laugh's Feats even less important. So yes: it was dumb. Very dumb indeed.

I never played World of Warcraft. So I don't know how PvP works with their system.

Of course it's possible. That would mean playing against the worst max-gear player of all times. One that doesn't use the best Soder, Supply Drops, or other Health replenishing methods. One that doesn't counter at all or gets countered all the time. But let's be honest, a Max-Gear player has a significant advantage.

As a F2Player, I'm capped at $1500 Cash. So no, I can't get the Highest Tiered PvP Gear. But as I wrote before, that's just one limit of progression in PvP Arenas.

When I first started, it didn't take much to be competitive against the max-geared players. Extreme Soders were still viable. No one had stat-enhancing mechanic-breaking Home Turf mods and Trinkets. Obviously, the game has progressed to the point where it's not just breaking a cash-cap to buy the best Armor to be competitive. It's everything else that's usable in PvP Arenas.

Do I want more Access? No. I just want the same access I had before. To play Arenas with/against folks around my same gear-progression. Not the current belief that a Win/Loss Matchmaking works because Consolation Marks are okay, or low-gear people should be corralled into Legends.

If you (all) still enjoy PvP-Arenas, still support SOE/Devs, more power to you. I just want to finally see a PvP-system that's inviting to all players, that has balanced matchmaking based on progression. I've seen what they do with your money, and I don't like it. So I certainly don't want them to use mine.

https://forums.station.sony.com/dcuo/index.php?threads/most-accomplished-free-to-play-player.177091/
There's that....... Lolz don't be mad bro!...
Spend some money on the game you play n support the it... No money = died game

Apparently. This increasing level of derp (see also: herp) is why I stopped hanging out around here as often. By the way, where in the hell is Enickma?

Do you even play the game and did you read the thread before posting?
1.PvP gear isn't part of dlc.
2.It's not about me
3.As i said before i want to see you fight a friend of mine who has t5 gear or me when i get the t5 gear. My friend with 150+ skill points and you with 130.
4.This game needs more people and more competition(talking about the PC eu server since i haven't been in the us server)
5.If you pay to unlock things that makes you stronger it's called pay to win. Doesn't matter what definition you want to give to "pay to win".
AruaROSE(mmorpg) is a game that let you buy items with better stats right off the bat. Does it make it pay to win? If you look from the outside it sounds like pay to win. When you go inside you discover that it has a marketplace which let's you trade premium items with free players. Why the "premium people" need to sell those items? Because they need ingame money..Why? There is something called money sink which allow this circle of actions.
Same goes for RustyHearts which allows you to trade items and there is a marketplace.
Why you can't consider those games pay to win? Because free to play players get to the same level as premium players in pvp.
Why f2p games like LoL(most populated game in the world), smite, dota 2 etc. get so much money from players when they don't offer any advantage in battle over other players? It's because the big majority of the people support that system
Now guess why games like LOCO which had better graphics and awsome skills didn't get popular and died eventually? I'll tell you why..They were offering weapon upgrades which increased the stats..
How can you people say that this game is not pay to win when you can get(for god sake "unlock") more defence, power and other stats and more skill points which can be used in pvp.

PvP is a holy ground for fair fights. Not here.

I want more people in this game, more competition and fair fights..On the other hand people that are defending this system want advantage over other people, unfair fights, fight and beat the same people everyday. Doesn't matter how you look at it, that is the truth.



@The guy showing me the best f2p player on the game: that doesn't make me feel bad at all cause you are proving me nothing. 130sp player with t1 gear vs a decent pvp'er who has 160 skill points+t5 gear+home turf mods+big cola+hand of the fate slots filled with something. Are you saying that the f2p guy gonna win.. Yeah show me that

The good thing about this game's pvp is the legends(except lex luthor in the hands of a decent player ) and the combat system which is almost same as rustyhearts. I started playing legends and my win rate is like 3-4/5 but i'm still learning the combos of the legends to activate the counter mechanics.


ps: Forgot to say that some of the games I listed above are giving away from 200k to 10milion dollars with tournaments. Probably that's why people play LoL even though it's so '80 with click to move system which i hate.
Last week smite was giving away 40 gems for each 1st win of the day in all modes + 200 gems if you use curse which is a voice program.. That's like 2 skins for each person+ a voice pack. Multiply that for over 1mil unique accounts. Those games are still free to play and offer fair fights.