GU73: The Stats Revamp

I agree. Would be neat if support had 3 masteries as well, one that sacrifices damage for extra support benefits, one that generally keeps a balance between the two, and one that sacrifices support benefits for extra damage, for those that like to battle role.

Well I know they are testing so I just hope it gets fixed.

I feel like we already have one that sacrifices support benefits for extra damage cause even now going Weapon Expert would put a support role player way out of his comfort zone.

So fingers crossed!

Something else that needs to be looked at are Supercharge generators.
Imo, these should always be hybrid type abilities so most need additional effects in Support role.

Generally, these additional effects could be:
- 30% CC resistance in Tank role for 3-4 secs.
- Additional root or stun effect in Controller role or if the ability is single target it could be AoE just in Controller role.
- 4 man Burst+ small HoT healing effect in Healer role. This is most important change for Healers since they lack Hybrid powers the most.

ok so i get if the Devs are trying to make all group required missions and instances Stay group required, but if they are going to do that then at least get us some more changeling
solo instances and missions(not the daily open world missions) so we can come back and beast it at higher levels.

or just get raid of all walk other walk-ins but keeping one in the war room and making a computer console by it and teleporter where we can chose what instance to walk in to as a group or solo and up the difficulty level & npc crs/stat level. and keeping Ques at normal difficulty stat/cr leves

I think one of the main problems so far with the revamp is the stats curve, even with cr differential gone there is no reason to lower the stats of gear from it's current state on live. I read their reasoning behind it and saw thatthe npc's change in stats is supposed to balance everything out but that does not seem to be the case. Players at end game content and lots of sp's are currently way too weak. Leave the stats the way they are on live. Let op gear be exactly that. They should have a considerable stat buff the way they always have been and should be worth the grind it takes to get them. It is also not fair to everyone who already has them and worked and grinded to get them, overal game balamce is a good thing but there also should be a very significant difference stat wise between peoplein lower tier gears like there currently is. Higher cr and higher tiered gear should have significant stat upgrades on gear as you level cr and run through content to get stronger, and op gear should be considerably stronger than that as well. On top of that sp's should add even more of a bonus and make players who are near end game even more op and considerably stronger as well. The answer isnt to nerf everything and everyone to make them feel so weak both in stats and performance so that they are close together with lower cr and tiered players with little or no sp's. Keep stats as is on live and make players stronger Who are at end game like they should be at this point into a 6 year old game.

This game will definitely not survive this update as og players who grinded their butts off surely wont stick around when they suddenly cant beat old or new content and newer players wont stick around if they cant beat anything or progresss at all becaise they are too weak to complete anything and so is everyone else. What is the point in progressing in a game if your character isnt actually progressing or getting stronger at any point. People will leave in hoardes and will never look back, I will probably quit if revamp hits live the way it is.

Too many unnecisary changes are being made and this complete game overhaul is a lomg way from what I envisioned when this revamp was first announced almost a year ago. People wanted to get rid of cr differential and to make stats matter, not to change the entire stat and gear system. People wanted powers to be more balanced in damage output anf in support role numbers and the removal of am's and weapon mastery(which no one wanted in the first place), not to redo every single role and power tree adjusting power costs and cooldown times and each roles ability and purpose. People wanted sp's to carry more weight and the tree to redone so sp's could be spent a bit more losely instead of being forced to complete weapon trees that no one wants, they didnt want this at the expense of everyones overall stats being obliterated. Many other changes seem sompletely unnnecisary and seem to create less of a gap between people just starting and people who deserve to be way better than that who are at end game content

This is not the game i fell in love with and havee been playing for almost 7 years and looks like this game will no longer be good or fun for anyone in anyway. I think you guys way overthought and overcomplited what should have been a simple update and not this complete mess of an overhaul we are getting. The result will be a lot of wasted time and money, and a completely dead game with an angry/no player base to do anything.

Exactly what I been saying all that grind for nothing only to get nerfed, well said.

I've been trying to stay clear of this thread for the most part, because I think people are getting a little hysterical, and I think a lot of folks are talking without actually having tested. I get it, change can be scary, especially when security blankets like overpowered AMs, and invincible tanks, and supercharged healers are thankfully being put out to pasture. I think the WM-AM era and the corresponding stat explosion has held people's hands far too long. But seriously, don't be afraid of what's on test. It plays like old DCUO, where trolls were necessary, and only savages solo-healed, and even then it was dicey.

There are some issues here and there, but for the most part this game on test plays more like it did three years ago than it ever has. Roles are important. You can't just sleepwalk your main and 12 alts through content in an hour. It's also not overly difficult. It's fun, and the devs are doing a good job and they're still working hard to tighten things up here and there. The hysterics, the handwringing, it's not necessary. If you think something needs changed, jump on test and run some numbers and come up with a suggestion. Put more effort into it than "update bad. I'm angry."

Don't be afraid y'all. You're better players than you realize.

^

If they could just clean up support roles a little
Fix the T3 raids
Not damage PvP along the way....

I'll be sold. I'll admit I've been a little pessimistic lately but only because I want this to be as perfect as can be. I dread AMs and I was just nervous when I heard that this is the next GU but it just doesn't seem to be ready at all yet.

Of course there are always hotfixes though.

I'd even say heals/tank is all that's left to fine-tune on support. Trolling in general is good. If light could get that clipable ranged defense debuff, even better. Honestly trolling on test is the most fun I've had as a controller in years, dude. Years.

AM and WM was what broke the game in the first place all vets wanted that gone so I disagree with you there. Everything else you right in besides the point I just made.

There is a difference between a linear gain and a exponential one.

You said you've been playing this game for almost 7 years. I've been playing the same game since Oct 2011. So probably close. The game had more balance up to T4. It was mostly a linear progression. When T5 launched, they boosted everything exponentially and caused a massive boost to stats to go with it. This began the cycle of constant increase in stats. This is where the game started to go in very bad directions that causes constant changes to the game including AMs, since damage was constantly increased.

The one thing that GU47 had the right idea to do, was flatten stats. The problem came from instead of clipping the high end down, they raised the low end up. Thus T1-T4 got inflated. What they are doing now is just taking that new line and bringing it down. Nothing changes other than the number values. What is balanced at T0 is balanced at T8.

I made an infograph to help with the example I'm trying to get you to understand.


Lowering the high end is not a problem if it actually helps with balance.

So is his/her lets say 200 CR character supposed to be equally "strong" relative to lets say T5 content after the update? If not his/her complaints are valid tbh. Its been 3+ years after all. Personally I d really welcome this change but fully expect a good junk of players to not like it at all.

Concerns are valid, but actions aren't. There will be some chaos happening after GU73 hits live, but that's to be expected.

The one thing that people need to do, if they actually test it, report anything that seems out of the ordinary. T2&T3 seem like outliers if the rest of the content so far tested works okay. What's been going on in this thread is untested assumptions that is followed by fear and more assumptions. There are problems, but most of the main problems are being drowned out by current fear assumptions.

The only thing wrong with WM was that it was doing more damage than Weapon clipping so everyone was forced to use it no matter what. WM animation and crit bonus concept are pretty good and they didnt have to be completely removed just crit bonus lowered to be more on par with regular clipping.

As for AMs, I didnt expect their removal to cause such huge time stretched update either.
Combos and Channeled powers existed way before AMs so they needed just damage and PI adjustments, nothing too complicated.
DoTs didnt need complicated update either, Nature was doing very well when Harvest was changed to refresh and spread DoTs. At that point AM wasnt even a concept.

1234 and burst power sets could have been fixed just by doubling or tripling normal damage of previous AM finishers like EMP Pulse and setting it behind 6-8 sec cooldowns which is how often people would previously use it as part of the removed AMs.

Healers and Tanks were balanced for most part with the exception of Fire, Earth and Sorcery, where their support roles could under perform in some scenarios and generally needed a little buff and at least 1-2 new abilities. Electric healers were slightly more power hungrier than others but it wasnt a huge deal.

Trollers needed most love cause their role has always been boring at Live server, at least for me. I dropped and stopped respecing to Controller power sets, except keeping my Hard Light toon and mostly as a Dps. Too much battery, not so much controlling required in content. This was mostly raid design problem rather than an actual problem with the controller role itself.

Now the Revamp delivered on most things and Devs have acknowledged the remaining problems.

What I still want is:
- better customized Play Styles.
- bringing back some moderated WM crit bonus.
- all melee weapon combos should have their spheres/cones increased by 1-2 meters to match 1 Handed's Flip Slash.
- Point Blank abilities need their area of effect increased by 2-3 meters wider around the player. They miss to register damage as much as most melee weapons. Too restrictive!
- more Hybrid abilities, especially for Supercharge generators.
- all support roles need a bit of a push. Tanks need little more mitigation, mostly for Atomic and Fire. Healers need about 20% power cost reduction on everything. Trollers need stronger PoT and Power Dumps so they wont need to spam so often. I think Power Dumps should be about twice as strong as they are now but with about 4 sec cooldown. Debuffs can cause additional ticks of group power healing.
- Movement Supercharges need back their group and allies power restoring effects.
Putting 4-5 SP to get a different SC than what my power set offers should be more rewarding. Yes there is Word of Power for 1 SP but that SC doesnt power heal pets and it spread its potential into too many things.

Well i remember many many things going live with numerous past updates that were not fixed and there is even stuff on live right now thats been there 1.5 years or longer that isnt fixed despite being reported by many people. Invisible players anyone? Maybe u and others have the faith that things will all be worked out before it goes live. I certainly dont. And i dont think people should believe things will be fixed just because other players say so. I base my opinion off of past history

I guess many people seem to forget gu47 and what made it onto live with that. Thats being said i do hope it all gets fixed before it goes live. Words on a screen dont tell me things are worked out or fixed tho. My own eyes seeing it makes me believe it I find it odd some of u guys would say everything will be worked on when u guys have made videos in the past showing things that made it onto live that werent functioning correctly and had been that way a long time. I guess the nature/electric thing is completely forgotten now.

And i see someone else say trolling was great All im going to say is i disagree. I dont find it fun at all. And yes ive been on test and tested a whole lot. What i find interesting is people raising concerns and asking questions and u guys dont actually answer those questions. Thats the reason i quoted ya again, because of the previous post. No explanation or answer back except the revamp is fine. Ok great. Lets see what happens when it goes live then. No sense in repeating ourselves over and over anymore.

Don't think ppl are really trusting in things getting worked out here. Nature and electric were supposed to be worked out two years ago.

Players hate change regardless. Whether its generally good, or generally bad there will always be someone who likes the change. Example people who like AM vs people who hate them. Same goes with WM.

The problem is players were so powerful in old content that they were gods, literally. Even in relevant content. I am pretty sure players will be mad once they see that they are no longer in that spot

Vey true but this is a new day and a new team of people for the most part and nature and elec play just as good as the other powers on test so you gotta have a little faith.

Like i just said to someone else this is a new day and a new team of people for the most part and the effort they have put in in the last few weeks gives me hope. You know me i keep it real and call it how it is and i can tell you these guys are def working overtime to try and get it right.

My faith along with others has been exhausted. Too many things have gone years still broken, while content has become a replay fest, time capsules are churned out like no tomorrow, etc.