Counter Mechanics are Broken in PvE

Discussion in 'Old Arkham (Bug Archive)' started by Scott Zyur, Jan 3, 2014.

  1. Sifo Drogas New Player

    Counter mechanics are broken throughout the game
  2. Sifo Drogas New Player

    lol you feel bad for them? wow feel bad for them while they take your money.
    • Like x 1
  3. Thedumme103 Well-Known Player

    They present me with a product that I pay for and enjoy, so I gladly give them my money.
  4. Martian Reaver Well-Known Player

    The new wonder woman solo makes the disparity even higher with a boss that flat ignores all of the mechanics from you but deals them all to you.
    • Like x 2
  5. Snafui New Player

    If after all this time you still hold hope that the developers will fix the combat mechanics, I'd like to introduce you to the following:

    I would have just cancelled and called it a day because SOE has a history of ignoring major issues where they would need to admit fault (NGE ring a bell?), but since another player noted in this thread that the inequity of the game mechanics cause people negative stress I thought I should aid them.

    This is a game and it needs to be able to be played as a game--a relief from the negative stress of the every day world. A game should absolutely have some stress to it but only if it remains a positive stress, e.g. a challenge that can be overcome. But take note how the developers did acknowledge the players about this broken mechanic, players who gave valid suggestions to repair it--a compromise to keep the mechanic no less: by adding the blocking of powers. They doubled down! To me this seems rather petty if not outright vindictive toward the players.

    When you cannot use the system that created the problem to fix the problem it is time to walk away. In this case, the developers are the problem--they are now abusing their power on the player base.

    Feel free to scoff if you do not see validity, but for those that do, please take time to reflect on this, and then act in your best interest.
    • Like x 5
  6. Snafui New Player

    This is in the new solo challenges. Whether outside of them, I cannot confirm at this time.
  7. RedeemerD New Player

    We've just tested counter mechanics, 8 people (100+ CR), we went to battle of lanterns in Metropolis, when a mob blocked nobody could break his block. Also, this is definitely true in raids and T5/T6 solo, haven't seen a block breaker normally working. And I'm usually always going with a block breaker. Interrupts and blocks work normally. Except, I have noticed, that mobs started clipping animation of block breakers. The most usual example is the first boss in The Hunt solo. He usually uses a flamethrower and as the animation starts, as I lunge at him trying to interrupt, he immediately puts up a block. Or he uses an interrupt himself and somehow still knocks me from my lunging strike.

    Please SOE, revise the PvE system, it's broken right now. And I hate to play the game lately, it mostly get's on my nerves. It's like you wanted to up the difficulty, but not through normal mean, but through making your own mechanics not applicable to us. I hate to see, how a mob can put up a block and clip animations that are not clippable by block. And I hate that it is so fast, It is becoming tiresome to play this game.
    • Like x 1
  8. Anarcho-Captain New Player

    Well, if that's the case they need to revert to how it used to be. Didn't PVE not used to have these mechanics a couple updates ago? It's also extremely annoying that bosses can use the PVP mechanics against YOU, but you can almost NEVER use them against them. Can't tell you how many times I've lunged a range attack & nothing happened; blocked a HUGE string of like 5 hits from a boss & nothing happened; spit out 3 or 4 range attacks against a blocking boss & nothing happened. It's not fair. Either make it work ALL the time, or just go back to how it was.
    • Like x 3
  9. Mack10 New Player

    It's been confirmed pretty much anywhere there are enemies that can counter you. Getting countered for using Time Bubble gave me a hint that something was off in the mechanics.

    Weapon combo vulnerability windows stack, causing counter vulnerabilities to persist beyond the weapon's attack animation time and endow subsequent actions (such as normal powers that are not specifically vulnerable to block or interrupt) with counter vulnerabilities they may not normally have.

    On a side note, it seems that the more I post about this subject the worse Quantum's Singularity seems to get...The longer SOE takes to respond to this, the more that conspiracy theories become the only way we can make sense out of this stuff.
  10. SilverBullet Dedicated Player

    These things have been broken since day 1. SOE is aware of it but, they come up with excuses not solutions. The hope of getting this fixed are a 0.1% chance of happening. A really good solution would be take away all npcs rights to cause counters until SOE can get it right. I have even had a npc block counter me through a wall.
    • Like x 3
  11. Kira_kun Active Player

    While the counter-mechanics may be broken, it is still a player versus AI environment. Aren't players suppose to be better than AI?

    As always, AI will always have better reflexes and timing than human players. But AI lacks adaptability, limited to their behavioural coding. If the stick you carry can't beat down the AI, get a bigger stick and smack it into submission.
  12. Mack10 New Player

    They got an extra three months' sub out of me because I like the game and wanted to see if WM and the new DLC were going to be fun and/or improve the overall play quality. After a week, I've decided no more unless something is done about this issue. Enemies should not be able to blockbreak, stun, and juggle you simultaneously using moves that aren't even blockbreakers from off-screen and through walls (I wish they would give the staff weapon that kind of power for players...)

    These mechanics are nearly as problematic as the laaaaaag in the new DLC. Together (along with persistent annoyances covered in other threads) they make the game incredibly unfun to the point where I now dread the thought of playing it. And when I'm getting chided in group content for problems caused by these issues (glitchy counter mechanics + lag + instant power bug = interruptions to PoT), I'm now embarrassed in addition to frustrated. I will no longer pay money to add negative stress to my escapism. This is supposed to be an MMORPG not a BSDMRPG, unless I read the label wrong LOL.
    • Like x 1
  13. Mack10 New Player

    The AI doesn't need adaptability when it can already counter anything you do, even moves that are not counterable. THAT'S the problem we're trying to have the devs address. The overlong and stackable vulnerability window times are at the root of this issue, along with the fact that players can be vulnerable to both interrupts and blockbreaking simultaneously - which defeats the point of having counter mechanics in the first place.

    The devs are the biggest stick that can be wielded against the AI, hence this forum thread.
    • Like x 2
  14. SilverwingsZOE New Player

    Let's rifle users,like the annoying Jor El guards in BiA and their forwad flip:

    I range,I get interrupted,I'm on my but t,I stand up he keeps doing that,I get stunned,I broke the stun he keeps doing that I get stunned once again,I breakout I block he lunges and juggles me while blocking,forward flip get stunned again.Rinse and repeat.

    Annoying lanterns,amazons and whatever npc with a staff,stun stun stun stun stun stun,w t f I'm blocking he lunges and instead of getting countered as Im blocking he get the immunity for juggling me and stunning me all of this while I'm blocking?

    Really?Where is my immunity or the immunity that they gain once we use the same move two times?

    Same is happening now with npcs with a bow,not only the arrow storms from amazons deals tons of damage but their counter window is smaller than ours.

    Everytime I say ok going to lunge that ****** I lunge and I don't punish her cause as soon their move ends the window is gone.
    I try to do the same,range block they lunge while I'm blocking and if someone is block breaking me I get punished twice in a row for both blocking and raging

    But for someone here those things are awesome and of course ain't need a fix
    • Like x 1
  15. Mack10 New Player

    I was going to post a video showing the simultaneous interrupt/block counter vulnerability, but posting in this forum expecting any kind of acknowledgment, much less resolution to this issue is proving futile. The hysteresis needs to be minimized to provide a smoother, more balanced, and less frustrating combat experience. I'm surprised that this fact escaped QA testing.

    Ah well, I'm done. These glitchy mechanics, along with the increased lag in the new DLC have effectively countered me right out of the game. Sub cancelled and game uninstalled.
  16. Dark Suzumebachi Well-Known Player

    Imma recite the famous line "Working as intended"

    I think they should just reduce the immunity window for npcs and keep the mechanics to keep both parties happy and take a hard look at what is blockable for npc. The main issue i run into is how can an add block me from so far away or from behind and my attack doesn't even reach that far to do damage. I'm talking cone attacks not 360. My favorite is when you are targeting one add and if the other one is close enough and is blocking you will be on you butt just by simply doing melee attacks no charge attacks this is how it is in PvP as well. Last time i checked tap melee attacks don't do aoe damage so why can they be blocked? I remember when they introduced the counter mechanics to PvE and it caused an uproar. They definitely need to take a look at some of these, make the npcs act more human like is what they said but isn't what it is by a long shot. These mechanics prolongs our survivability once you learn the patterns hence the reason they shouldn't be broken. Its annoying but I can live with it, lol :)
    • Like x 2
  17. Drathmor Unwavering Player

    the adds also don't follow the same rules as players. they can block a attack at the last second right as they are being hit and you still get countered. they also don't display the fake out mechanics in newer content and set you up for counters with out the warnings.. also broken how you can block then start meleeing something or someone and three or four hits in you get block broke from your block several secs ago. those delays need to be looked at
    • Like x 2
  18. Mack10 New Player

    If losing paying players is intended, well, mission accomplished.

    The ironic thing is that I like the mechanics and have never wanted them taken out of PvE, merely adjusted for parity and consistency. I have tried to pinpoint exactly what I believe the underlying problem to be, and comparing notes with others encountering the same problem. I have always remained respectful when posting about this issue, still remained a paid player, still kept trying to offer as specific of observations as I could, but all that resulted was my giving up on the game (leaving behind a 4-digit chunk of SC in the process).

    As Snafui pointed out, all the devs have done is acknowledge nothing and instead taken tangible steps to make the problem worse. Why would they do this? The question must be asked, though the answer will likely remain a mystery.
    • Like x 2
  19. Dark Suzumebachi Well-Known Player

    Yea that sucks man. After putting hundreds of dollars into this game I will play til it absolutely has no interest to me anymore. I agree with most that if the mechanics were never introduce we wouldn't have these issues. As you asked why? Maybe this thread has to get 50 pages of people repeating what was said as probably I did before the situation is even noticed as a problem.
    • Like x 1
  20. Doctor Nova Devoted Player

    When you get knocked down, keep hitting attack moves.... not sure if I am actually damaging the NPC during this but the animations are working while I'm knocked down. :rolleyes:
    I first noticed this happening when T4 was new. Morrow's Robots being knocked down and while still in knocked down posture, lunging at me. Me getting knocked down and since Breakout was not going to get me up, I'd hit attack weapon and power buttons and they'd use up my power for power attacks and also show animations.
    .......Are we all connected to one of these!? [IMG] (ps3 server cluster) Are these PS3 in the server cluster running Folding@home while hosting the DCUO game?