Magrider coming short on 6/8 Game Update

Don't bother, mate.... the TR victim complex is strong with that one. You're not going to persuade him with trivial things like facts.....

3 Scenarios.
1. Prowler comes behind enemies, deploys, makes a mess (can be applied to every other MBT, idea is, you get the first shot you end up victorious in most cases).
2.Prowler meets face to face equally equipped MBT, Prowler stands no chance, as mentioned, anchor mode will fail or it will take more than several seconds to activate (imagine not being able to activate Vanguard shield because of terrain) in the mean time due to no defensive abilities and lowest damage dealing gunners weapon he will definitely lose.
3.Prowler opens fire on enemy MBTs from long range, enemy either strafes or uses shield to reach safety in which he can repair, in that case Prowler has to go for Scenario 2 which isnt favorable for him in any case.
One more fun fact as well, VS and NC Maxes decimate TR armor unlike opposite, add to that specific launchers those factions have and it makes job for TR armor even harder (Lancer and Phoenix).

Here is one more thing, most of you, who dont have maxed out MBTs or rarely play them base your opinions on zergs you meet and think its representative of how this game truly is.

I stole this from one post and I believe it perfectly sums it up.
average player: Prowler > Vanguard > Magrider
above average player: Vanguard = Prowler >= Magrider
best players: Vanguard = Magrider >= Prowler

Magrider should get a 20% increase in Magburn fuel capacity or better handling (default rank 1 Rival Chassis) as compensation for this update.

BrblmAFK was right, you are too deep into victim complex selfpittyness.
I'm gonna sum this up short.

1. Anyone rear ending another MBT should win. A quick reacting vanguard could at least pop shield and have a chance at it. So scenario goes for all tanks no matter what. Prowler can easily do this wide flanking cause it's speed automatically gives mobility.

2. If you play right into a vanguards "party trick", YOU either got jumped or you made a bad engagement decision. Your anchor should allready be locked in. Don't you pick spots to engage where YOU get the advantage? Why would you choose to engage where anchor has a chance of failing? If you are allready anchored in and can't dps through shield and armor(health pool) you are doing something wrong.
3.lomg range engagements. The strafing... did you know that if you fire at a magriders airport every time, you will hit, every time even though he's strafing, up to 250 meters? Mag had it's inertia neefed and velocities on guns was buffed. It can't outstrafe you if you air properly. If enemy tank has a cover nearby, it choose it's(luck or deliberately) area of movement well and foreseed a potential prowler shelling. Still, it's in the open behind a cover, it can't go anywhere and if it peeks out you shoot. If more tanks show up you reposition.

As for maxes, I haven't played re and nd maxes enough in combat so I couldn't answer you, someone else must chime in.
But from being on the receiving end of pounders(the multi win all tool against infantry and close tanks) or lockdown fractures, or lockdown bursters, the dps is INSANE.

And, I have fully certed MBTs on all fractions. Tanking is what I love doing, I don't base my opinions on 2 hours in a tank under conditions that severely favoured or unfavoured me....

In terms of balance the vehicle game has to be really out of whack for the developers to look into it and do anything about it. The magrider is probably in the "sad" position it is because in terms of in game performance it was once measurably way way out of balance even though no doubt magrider users said that it was under powered as people always do in this sort of situation. Overall, you might have noticed, planetside 2 is a game full of ridiculous cheese weapons and tactics. If anyone somehow feels that they are able to put their head above the cheese and play "fairly" it's probably a good sign that what they are doing goes beyond the normal cheese into the territory of being brokenly unbalanced.

This is not a fair game in that sense. The easy fix is to just make all the weapons effectively the same across factions which is the opposite of what most people claim that they want. Like a lot of complaints I head about ESF balance from veteran pilots is that fighting a Scythe is just not fair because the velocity of their nose guns is always higher so they just land more shots in a head on duel with same accuracy. Would it generally make people happier in game if the nose gun velocity was made equal for all ESF? It seems unlikely, no change makes everyone happy and most players would not even understand why such a change was required. It's a TURBO LASER duh, it's in the name, of course it should be faster.

Drove my Lightning and Prowler yesterday. The increase in "mobility" ofc helps those vehicles but the changes (IMHO) are not that significant or game breaking as some might argue

As a dedicated tanker I don´t think that any of the MBTs is currently OP or UP
Let´s see what other things the next updates will change though..

Having played all three factions and used their armor, I feel the desire for the Magrider to become more stable with this patch is an unfair request.

Magrider drivers have the occasional issue with their tanks being unable to ascend mountains or get over hills, but more veteran tankers will know what their tank can or cannot handle. When you're used to driving one, and you know your intended path, a Magrider can be an absolute menace on the field against TR or NC forces. Couple that with its strafing ability to dodge incoming fire, I feel the Magrider is in a good place right now... but again, that's if you're a dedicated tanker who knows what they're doing - not the every day yahoo who pulls a tank because they can.

But even if you're a new person who pulls a Magrider, you will still find that most mountains and hills can be ascended regardless of your skill level. But if you've never pulled a Lightning, Prowler or Vanguard, or if you simply don't try to climb mountains with them, then you'll never understand what it's like for the other factions.

It sucks when you try to climb a mountain with a treaded vehicle, then juuuust as you're about to get to the top, your tank stops and no amount of holding W will allow you to go any further. Nothing sucks more than having to allow your tank to go sliding back down the mountain and crossing your fingers that it doesn't flip over a rock and explode.

Indeed, if you're someone who doesn't use treaded vehicles to climb mountains, then you don't know how difficult it is. And yes, I've been in the position of both a Prowler/Vanguard and a Magrider on a mountain, and almost every time, I'll win against a treaded tank with a Magrider because I can get over the mountain and get behind them, whereas their placement is limited due to their (previously) poor traction.

So no, I do not believe the Magrider requires a buff or free certifications with this patch. Treaded tank players have prayed for an increase in traction for a very, very, very long time. The fact that they've had to endure the poor traction for this many years is just a testament to their dedication to tanking... so with this patch, dedicated tankers will definitely be in a better place, and (hopefully) Magriders, Vanguards and Prowlers can now duke it out on equal footing.


And I don't know why this has been brought up, but I'll address this topic as well:

Yes, Prowlers have the highest DPS potential of any MBT, but they also require you to hit the target with both shells. Each shell does half of the damage a single Vanguard or Magrider shot will do.

Prowlers have some of the weakest armor in the game for an MBT, and the way I perceive them is: Prowlers are glorified sniper rifles. Just like as an infiltrator, you want to keep your distance and take shots from locations your enemy doesn't expect, and if your location is discovered (usually when I see an enemy MBT look at me), you need to relocate so someone doesn't sneak up on you and kill you. If you are playing a Prowler like a front lines MBT, you are playing it wrong.

This next patch will only add to that, with the Prowler's vanilla reload speed being severely reduced without lockdown. Therefore, CQC with a Prowler is inadvisable.

Oh, and from one Prowler driver to another: don't lock down in close quarters combat with magriders. Seriously, when I'm on my VS character, nothing pleases me more than when people do this. It's so easy to magboost behind you and shoot you in the back for an easy kill. Remember: Prowlers are snipers, and locking down in nose booping distance of a Magrider is like standing on C4 while an enemy throws an EMP at you.

Alright, i get you. You want the same mobility on your Prowler/Vanguard like the Magrider has it. No problem you can have it, but then it's more than fair to give the Magrider the same max speed and more DPS and more bullet velocity and less drop on the main gun in return. Things must stay fair you know.

Yup and give me Vulcan+Gatekeeper ..

Vanguard shield still dont get nerfed ????? Can i have a shield for my magrider DB yeah ? Its easy for you DB just hotfix your patch and give me a shield for my magrider and the same ******* insane vanguard damage...

Here we go.

The Gods of Arbitrary Self-Serviing Argument smile.

I don't think that was the case.
The buildings resistances were different when construction first came out and you used to be able to damage all structures even when they were backed up by repair modules.

Mag feels slow and squishy now, perhaps could use something buffed imo.

You mean equal ground such as Magrider being slower, having the slowest bullet speed, lowest DPS, highest ttk equal?

It's exactly the same armor as a Magrider except the Magrider don't have the benefit of a main turret turret, rear view camera while being longer, higher and wider.

http://www.kleenex.com

You'll be happy to know that after the patch bullet speed of deployed prowlers has enormously decreased, making that mode / accessory quite useless.

I said it's fair for the Prowler, Vanguard and Lightning to have more mobility so they can get around easier. I'm not saying to make them equals to the Magrider. The Magrider still has the advantage of mobility compared to all three other tanks.

What other tank in the game can climb over other pieces of armor to continue on its path?

What other tank can strafe left and right to avoid incoming fire while maintaining its focus on a target?

What other tank hovers over the ground, thus giving it no treads for anyone to target?

What other tank can literally boost up behind enemy targets to immediately target their weakest armor?

What other tank can sit sideways on a mountain and fire at a tank out of its depression?

The point is: the new traction update allows for other tanks to get up on mountains and cliffs easier, so we're not slipping and sliding while Magriders have a free shot at us.

Oh, and...

True, but the Magrider still has greater killing potential than a Prowler in CQC. You can get the jump on a Magrider, but since they don't need to turn a chassis like the Prowler or Vanguard, it means their front armor is facing whatever they're looking at. Prowlers and Vanguards have the disadvantage because their main gun can look from any direction without turning the rest of the tank, but that also means less experienced tankers are leaving themselves fully exposed from the rear or sides just to get a good shot.

For a Prowler to succeed in CQC, it either must have a gunner, or it must have the drop on an enemy... and even then, no success is guaranteed. With the Magboost and the Vanguard shield, they must pick their CQC battles carefully.

In this instance, imagine if a well certed Magrider and Prowler got into a 1v1 battle without gunners. The Magrider will attempt to get a shot at the Prowler in a direction where the armor is weaker, and depending on the skill of the Prowler driver, they may or may not succeed. The Magrider is able to maintain having the thickest armor visible to the Prowler because in order to target an enemy, your front armor must be facing them. It's not the same as, say, being in a Prowler or Vanguard where your cannon turns, but your chassis does not.

If a Magrider fires at the Prowler, it gets one shot before reloading. The Prowler must fire twice and hit both times to do max damage. If it misses one shot, it does half the damage of a Magrider's shot, so the Prowler MUST hit you if he wants to compete on a CQC level, and he MUST make sure his front is facing your front so he has the same amount of protection you have. The issue is... the Prowler's main gun must fire two shots, and I'm not talking about damage potential, I'm talking about reload speed. The Magrider with max reload will have already begun its reload cycle, whereas the Prowler must get off its two shots before it can reload, which leaves a window of .2 - 1 second delay depending on how trigger happy or accurate the tanker is. So that's .2 - 1 seconds extra the Magrider has to reload and do another huge damage shot against the Prowler. And then of course, couple that with its mag boost, and the Magrider can quickly get behind the Prowler to finish it off while the Prowler is busy reloading.

Going into lockdown while facing a Magrider in CQC is one of the dumbest moves you can make, depending on the terrain and how much friendly armor you have with you. If it was an isolated situation, it would basically mean you are relying on getting as many shots down range as possible to kill the Magrider, and depending on your accuracy, you might succeed... but if the Magrider boosts up behind you, that means he only needs to shoot your rear armor twice, whereas you must shoot his front armor 6 times (3, compared to another MBT) in order to kill him first.

The point is: while the Magrider and Prowler have similar armor, it's how they go about using it that makes the difference.

Most Prowler drivers won't think to turn their chassis to face what's shooting at them - they'll just turn their gun, whereas Magrider drivers must turn their tank in order to turn their gun. This is why getting the drop on a Magrider is a slim chance and only leaves a small chance of success to eliminate the Magrider... because by the time you've got your attack off, they have their front armor facing you and the advantage of mobility to come and kill you first.

Signed! This rly reflects my gameplay experience with Prowler.
To me most reactions sound like "Wat?! Prowler/Vanguard/Lightning get buff?! Me want buff for Magrider too!!!" and have no real basis

OMG did not hear about this upcoming change yet. If true, this will have a faaaaaar greater impact MBT gameplay than any change to traction/turning etc.

*Going_To_Cert_IR_Smoke_Now_LoL?*
*Max_Fire_Suppresion_FTW?*

Except one prowler Ap round does not do half of the magrider's Ap damage, it does 67% damage.
Now let's flip the scenario.
If the Magrider misses a shot, it does 0% damage! If the Prowler hits both shots, it does 134% damage!

And let's not also forget that, even counting the delay between the two shots, the Prowler still has a shorter reload speed and faster fire rate. That's 2500 damage every 2.5 seconds compared to the Magrider's 1865 damage every 3.25 seconds.
In terms of DPS, that's 1000 damage per second for the Prowler and only 574 damage per second for the Magrider.

(However, I'm not sure if there's another delay after the Prowler's second shot before it reloads so it might be 2500 every 3 seconds, someone let me know if that is the case and if it does or does not also apply to the Magrider, but I'm sure even in that case the results will be hugely in the Prowler's favor )

In terms of TTK, that means the Prowler can kill the Magrirder in 11 seconds, when hitting its front armor.
The Magrider can kill the Prowler in 16 seconds hitting the side armor.

( Even in the event that there is in fact a second delay before the reload, 2500 every 3 seconds still comes down to 833 damage per second for the Prowler, resulting in a 13 second TTK on the Magrider's front armor )

In short, the Prowler's DPS advantage is so massive that it does not need to care if the Magrider is hitting its front or side armor, it just needs to cover its butt and let the dual canons do all the work.

Right now on live projectile speed is decreased?
This was not noted in the patch notes, might want to submit a bug report.